Creative Spell Kills

[HoodedHero007]

Here, we think of creative ways to kill opponents with spells without that intention!


Mage Hand: Block Airways
Any Illusion: Gamma Radiation
Darkness: Since photons carry the electromagnetic force, removing them...:smallwink:
Creation: Poisons/Toxins
Hold Monster/Hold Person: Stop the Heart, Lungs, et cetera
Phantasmal Force: Cause someone/something to think they're being attacked by allies

[Coffee_Dragon]

(This probably doesn't need pointing out, but the thing about spell entries is that mechanically they do what they do and no more. You can't use fluff to rationalize they could mechanically do the things that higher-level spells do explicitly. So basically this comes down to "Magic, it's weird, huh?")

[TheTeaMustFlow]

Here, we think of creative ways to kill opponents with spells without that intention!


Mage Hand: Block Airways
Any Illusion: Gamma Radiation
Darkness: Since photons carry the electromagnetic force, removing them...:smallwink:
Creation: Poisons/Toxins
Hold Monster/Hold Person: Stop the Heart, Lungs, et cetera
Phantasmal Force: Cause someone/something to think they're being attacked by allies



1. Most of these are not capable of doing the things you suggest:

Mage Hand can "manipulate an object, open an unlocked door or container, stow or retrieve an item from an open container, or pour the contents out of a vial." If you're an Arcane Trickster, it can also "stow one object the hand is holding in a container worn or carried by another creature", "retrieve an object in a container worn or carried by another creature", or "use thieves' tools to pick locks and disarm traps at range." It explicitly cannot be used to attack someone. Even if it could, it's still just one hand that only exert 10 pounds of pressure. You're gonna have trouble chocking someone to death with that.

One could conceivably create an illusion of gamma radiation, if one knew what gamma radiation was (highly unlikely in most settings), but... it's an illusion, not real radiation. It's not going to hurt anyone. Maybe you could fake a radiation alert, but that's reliant on someone having a way to detect radiation in the first place, which is going to be pretty rare even in a setting where people actually know what radiation is. You could create a radioactive mineral with creation, but that's not going to be a very efficient way of killing someone, since the created object disappears after the duration, and that will include it's radioactive decay.

Darkness does just creates an area of darkness. It doesn't do anything with the photons that turning off my light wouldn't do.

Making poisons with creation would be legit, though bear in mind that one would be limited to vegetable-based poisons and they'd only last for a day. Still, perfectly good for making some before clearing a dungeon.

Hold spells cannot selectively stop bits of a target. And they cannot stop organs anyway. All they can do is paralyse someone.

Phantasmal Force fake betrayals would probably work, but there'd be a bit of a DM judgement call there. I'd allow it, but I know DMs that wouldn't.

Edit: ...aand I got ninja'd by a dragon, and a coffee-sipping barbarian at the same time. How embarrassing.

Actual examples of innovative spell use:

Using Animate Object on an enemy vehicle and getting it to stop, crash, or disengage.

Hold Person/Monster on flyers is always a classic.

Put Sympathy and Explosive Runes on the same rock.

[Regitnui]

Is forcing them to swallow a delayed blast fireball creative?

- Dropping an acid splash down their shirt/pants as appropriate
- Animate dead on a person's hair or epidermis (outer layer of skin) and use it to attack them.
- Help a sniper out with clairvoyance.

I have realized that I might be mildly disturbed in the head.

[MrStabby]

Its slow, but I think you could arcane lock someone mouth and let them starve. I presume if they open it to put food in it counts as an entryway? You have to grapple them and hold their mouth shut whilst you cast it though.

If you can cast it on a mouth I imagine it can make a great opening move vs a sleeping dragon... or a sleaping anything that has a bite or breath attack.

[TheTeaMustFlow]

Is forcing them to swallow a delayed blast fireball creative?

- Dropping an acid splash down their shirt/pants as appropriate
- Animate dead on a person's hair or epidermis (outer layer of skin) and use it to attack them.
- Help a sniper out with clairvoyance.

I have realized that I might be mildly disturbed in the head.

The Animate Dead thing just doesn't work, since a persons hair or epidermis are neither the bones nor the corpse of a humanoid.


Its slow, but I think you could arcane lock someone mouth and let them starve. I presume if they open it to put food in it counts as an entryway? You have to grapple them and hold their mouth shut whilst you cast it though.

If you can cast it on a mouth I imagine it can make a great opening move vs a sleeping dragon... or a sleaping anything that has a bite or breath attack.

I guess with 3 castings you could suffocate them. 2, if you count the nose as a whole rather than individual nostrils as an entryway (or if they do too much coke).

[Segev]

An object planted on somebody with a magic mouth that is enchanted to speak its line every time its bearer bumps into somebody, no matter how lightly: "Watch where you're going, dirty orc-spawn!"

I don't care if they ARE orc-spawn, having it used as an insult is going to make them wanna take a swing at you.

[krugaan]

Knock: "open a chest"

Player: I knock open the chest of that ancient red wyrm. No save.

I claim no credit for this, someone else mentioned this, but it's pretty funny.

[Estrillian]

Mage Hand can "manipulate an object, open an unlocked door or container, stow or retrieve an item from an open container, or pour the contents out of a vial."

Is a person a container? They might be, if they have their mouth open. So you could drop an item in their open mouth to choke them, perhaps when they are asleep? You can certainly pour a vial of poison into their open mouths as they sleep with no weird spell interpretation needed.

[ShikomeKidoMi]

Is a person a container? They might be, if they have their mouth open. So you could drop an item in their open mouth to choke them, perhaps when they are asleep? You can certainly pour a vial of poison into their open mouths as they sleep with no weird spell interpretation needed.

Sure, but if they're asleep, you barely need mage hand, they're probably not going to notice you anyway.

Best use of Mage Hand offensively is probably to trigger traps, drop a portcullis on foes, etc without having to physically walk over to the switch, which makes maneuvering them into position a lot easier.

For example, maybe the hallway has a trap door over a spiked pit that locks into place if you push a hidden button in the wall, making it safe to walk over. Have your thief find this, then travel over it. If you run into monsters, run back across and ready a mage hand to unlock it when they're over the pit. If the monsters are at all familiar with the traps, they won't be dumb enough to stand on the trap door while you're next to the button, but that's where mage hand's reach comes in handy.

[Flashy]

A few weeks ago my DM got me with Grease on a ladder I was climbing. I thought that pretty clever.

[Reaper34]

stone or iron wall cast on unsteady supports.

sphere of force and decanter of endless water (actavated and used as a "grenade"). after a few rounds it's drown or decompression. demiplane would work too.

flushed a red dragon out of it's hole with a gate spell to the elemental plane of water and some wall spells.

demention door/teleport stright up and let go of the victim.

[HoodedHero007]

Mage Hand can "manipulate an object, open an unlocked door or container, stow or retrieve an item from an open container, or pour the contents out of a vial." If you're an Arcane Trickster, it can also "stow one object the hand is holding in a container worn or carried by another creature", "retrieve an object in a container worn or carried by another creature", or "use thieves' tools to pick locks and disarm traps at range." It explicitly cannot be used to attack someone. Even if it could, it's still just one hand that only exert 10 pounds of pressure. You're gonna have trouble chocking someone to death with that.
I'm talking about putting the hand in someone's mouth

Remember: intent to kill, this is creative spell Kills​

[JoeJ]

I'm talking about putting the hand in someone's mouth

Remember: intent to kill, this is creative spell Kills​

How is that not an attack?

[Gtdead]

I really like "Glyph of Warding" spell for creative spell use. It's not exactly RAW, but knocking someone out cold and inscribing a glyph on their back, or performing surgery and doing the same on their organs, can have some interesting effects. How do you avoid a disintergrate when it's inscribed on your stomach? Or that poor orc group that found their long lost buddy and wanted to pat him in the back. BOOOOOOOM.

I can also inscribe a rune on food. Rune pie anyone?

[Shaofoo]

I sometimes wonder if D&D forums are just training grounds for munchkins, testing their tortured logic and fast application of both real and fantasy facts (which might not even apply but since it is so fast you don't catch it in time) against the most scrutinous eyes in the internet so that you'll be able to unleash your munchkin-fu on an unsuspecting party or DM.

[TheTeaMustFlow]

I'm talking about putting the hand in someone's mouth

Remember: intent to kill, this is creative spell Kills​

I know. And it wouldn't work, even if allowed by the wording of the spell (which it isn't). Choking someone to death with one very weak and very clumsy hand is not a thing which is going to happen.

[HoodedHero007]

However, I was under the assumption that it is very hard to breath WITH A HAND INSIDE YOUR WINDPIPE (also, it does not say the hand has a specific shape of a degree of clumsiness)

[Inevitability]

However, I was under the assumption that it is very hard to breath WITH A HAND INSIDE YOUR WINDPIPE (also, it does not say the hand has a specific shape of a degree of clumsiness)

Line of effect.

But hey, go ahead and try this in a game, any game. You probably came here expecting us to tell you it was possible, allowing you to show your DM this thread when he told you there was no way he was allowing this. Well, it's a pity but you won't get these forums' backing. Feel free to try it on your DM, just don't expect him to say yes.

[Sir cryosin]

This one will take some time but you follow someone around and keep using thaumaturgy to make load scaring sounds. You would scare them to death or they would too many levels of exhaustion and just die. You could use magic mouth to were the trigger is of someone falls asleep it makes a beep beep beep beep beep beep beep beep beep beep noise evert time. Giving lvs of exhaustion

[HoodedHero007]

This one will take some time but you follow someone around and keep using thaumaturgy to make load scaring sounds. You would scare them to death or they would too many levels of exhaustion and just die. You could use magic mouth to were the trigger is of someone falls asleep it makes a beep beep beep beep beep beep beep beep beep beep noise evert time. Giving lvs of exhaustion
I don't think that is in RAW

[Douche]

I got one! Acid and fire spells, when directed in the face, would burn the eyes and induce blindness. Therefore, spells like Blindness/Deafness are redundant since those actually give you a save and wear off eventually.

Shatter might deal only 3d8 damage, but when you consider the fact that individual bones probably don't have that much health, you should be able to destroy a persons entire skeleton with a single cast!

[HoodedHero007]

Arcane gate: If I remember this correctly, if the gate is dispelled, you would be cut in half like the huge pigman from take back the night

[tieren]

Fey Lock - Use dominate person to turn an enemy combatant into a "willing creature" to accompany you through a dimension door, which empties 500 feet straight up. Lock gets close to the ground can bite tongue to trigger Misty escape and teleport to safety.

[HoodedHero007]

Feylock?
As in from the dand homebrew stuff?

[tieren]

Feylock?
As in from the dand homebrew stuff?

No sorry, I meant fey patron warlock

[HoodedHero007]

What does that do again?
(I mixed up sorcerer and warlock)

[tieren]

From what? Unearthed Arcana?
If so, which one?

Its one of the three original patron options in the PHB (p 108) Archfey, fiend, or Great Old One.

Archfey gets dominate person on their expanded spell list and the 6th level subclass ability Misty Escape.

[HoodedHero007]

see edit


Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn

[krugaan]

I don't think that is in RAW

The irony is so thick here you could cut it with a club.

[HoodedHero007]

The irony is so thick here you could cut it with a club.
Ohhhhhh.... but how does that work anyway?

[Regitnui]

Ohhhhhh.... but how does that work anyway?

Wave it through the air in a circle and catch the irony in your other hand as it falls down.

[Solusek]

I don't think that is in RAW


The irony is so thick here you could cut it with a club.

This entire thread went from mildly embarrassing to outstanding entertainment with this one post.

[Shaofoo]

Fey Lock - Use dominate person to turn an enemy combatant into a "willing creature" to accompany you through a dimension door, which empties 500 feet straight up. Lock gets close to the ground can bite tongue to trigger Misty escape and teleport to safety.

By RAW you can't do that.

Dominate Person does not allow you to change a creature's thoughts, it just applies a charmed condition that has extra effects. The creature can still be (and probably will be) unwilling to do anything but he can't do anything about it as long as the spell is up. A dominated creature is not considered as an ally (it won't provoke OAs from former friends for one).

Also biting your tongue is not an attack since you can't bite as an action, plus even if you could you already used your action to Misty Step, plus there are no rules that allow you to use your Bonus Action to bite yourself so by RAW you'll be eating 20d6 damage regardless if you somehow are able to hit your own tongue with a non proficient bite with an action that you don't have.

[Coffee_Dragon]

This one will take some time but you follow someone around and keep using thaumaturgy to make load scaring sounds. You would scare them to death or they would too many levels of exhaustion and just die. You could use magic mouth to were the trigger is of someone falls asleep it makes a beep beep beep beep beep beep beep beep beep beep noise evert time. Giving lvs of exhaustion


I don't think that is in RAW

No, that one is totally RAW. It's going to happen. It cannot be stopped. You also wear a scary mask and pop out from behind trees and boulders shouting "BOO!" in between the scary sounds. They'll be all "STOP THAT" but you don't. Never. In the end they'll go "AUGH I can't take this any more" and fall down and die. Did I mention this guy was a dragon! Free treasure

[Inevitability]

Ohhhhhh.... but how does that work anyway?

http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh248/8alot/munchkin%20cards/Mace_of_Sharpness.jpg

[tieren]

By RAW you can't do that.

Dominate Person does not allow you to change a creature's thoughts, it just applies a charmed condition that has extra effects. The creature can still be (and probably will be) unwilling to do anything but he can't do anything about it as long as the spell is up. A dominated creature is not considered as an ally (it won't provoke OAs from former friends for one).

Also biting your tongue is not an attack since you can't bite as an action, plus even if you could you already used your action to Misty Step, plus there are no rules that allow you to use your Bonus Action to bite yourself so by RAW you'll be eating 20d6 damage regardless if you somehow are able to hit your own tongue with a non proficient bite with an action that you don't have.

It works fine. Dimension Door does not require an ally, just a willing creature. Dominate says the target does its best to obey, which is close enough to willing for me.

You could escape the fall by a bonus action misty step, but if you fell from high enough you might get another action to self inflict a wound for a misty escape, which just seems cooler.

[krugaan]

It works fine. Dimension Door does not require an ally, just a willing creature. Dominate says the target does its best to obey, which is close enough to willing for me.

You could escape the fall by a bonus action misty step, but if you fell from high enough you might get another action to self inflict a wound for a misty escape, which just seems cooler.

Hit the ground, take 10d6 falling damage, misty step 30' up on reaction, take another 3d6!

[Shaofoo]

It works fine. Dimension Door does not require an ally, just a willing creature. Dominate says the target does its best to obey, which is close enough to willing for me.

Not really, willing to me is being dedicated fully both mind and body to you. A person that is dominated does not count but I am sure you'll deny it for the sake of argument so it is a pointless endeavor.


You could escape the fall by a bonus action misty step, but if you fell from high enough you might get another action to self inflict a wound for a misty escape, which just seems cooler.

Depending on the DM you might be surprised that just because you teleport doesn't mean that the force that you provided from the fall is somehow negated, you'll still splat.

But even if you didn't splat you still wasted 3 slots that could fail at any moment in combat just to make someone splat. You'd literally do more damage throwing three fireballs at the guy than hoping to somehow convince him to teleport up and then you spending another spell to not die. Really this entire endeavor is just less efficient than spamming attack spells and only doing it for the cool factor (which will make you look bad if the guy was packing Feather Fall).

[krugaan]

http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh248/8alot/munchkin%20cards/Mace_of_Sharpness.jpg

Hah, I lolled at that

[Steampunkette]

Icy Doom. Only works in Winter.

Lure enemies onto a frozen lake or river. Cast Shatter at their feet. Follow it with Make Whole, targeting the ice.

Grease a rope ladder near the top of a cliff is always nice.

I also like Blinding someone in the middle of vehicle chases.

[djreynolds]

Umber Hulks were at a dam on the underground river. I webbed my me and friends to the wall and cast lightning bolt at the dam, never did see those umber hulks again, and the web held.

[HoodedHero007]

By RAW you can't do that.

Dominate Person does not allow you to change a creature's thoughts, it just applies a charmed condition that has extra effects. The creature can still be (and probably will be) unwilling to do anything but he can't do anything about it as long as the spell is up. A dominated creature is not considered as an ally (it won't provoke OAs from former friends for one).
So then manipulate the electrons in their brain, after all, that is the idea of the thread

[Shaofoo]

So then manipulate the electrons in their brain, after all, that is the idea of the thread

Sorry electrons are not in the rules. Real life rules do not apply in fantasy elf land.

Basically if it isn't in the rules then you can't do it. The DM can allow you to do it but manipulating electrons in the brain is so vague and nonsensical that I don't even know what the end goal is. I mean can you even prove that mind control is manipulating electrons, do electrons even exist in D&D?

This is why it is lazy, it is just basically working backwards from the answer to come up with some catch all, except the answer isn't even clear. I mean you might as well say you use Dominate Person to create nuclear fission if somehow you can manipulate electrons.

[Boci]

Full Frontal Nerdity (I forget which day) had an argument for using mage hand offensively. The player Nelson had 2 ideas:

a. lift a 10 pound object and move it into someone face. Since mage hand moves 30ft / 3 seconds he argued that weight at that speed should be enough to do damage (maybe the object was also spiked?)

b. Lift the 10 pound object 30ft above the head of the target and release it.

Link to the comic, sorry I cannot remember the specific page: http://ffn.nodwick.com/

[Flashy]

This is why it is lazy, it is just basically working backwards from the answer to come up with some catch all, except the answer isn't even clear. I mean you might as well say you use Dominate Person to create nuclear fission if somehow you can manipulate electrons.

Pfffft, next you'll be telling me that the Prestidigitation briefcase nuke doesn't work.

[HoodedHero007]

Basically if it isn't in the rules then you can't do it. The DM can allow you to do it but manipulating electrons in the brain is so vague and nonsensical that I don't even know what the end goal is. I mean can you even prove that mind control is manipulating electrons, do electrons even exist in D&D?

This is why it is lazy, it is just basically working backwards from the answer to come up with some catch all, except the answer isn't even clear. I mean you might as well say you use Dominate Person to create nuclear fission if somehow you can manipulate electrons.

point A: where do you think lightning damage comes from? Lighting is an electron discharge, and if you are able to do that, then you can manipulate electrons on a smaller scale.
point B: dominate person doesn't do fission, that's creation!

[Shaofoo]

point A: where do you think lightning damage comes from? Lighting is an electron discharge, and if you are able to do that, then you can manipulate electrons on a smaller scale.
point B: dominate person doesn't do fission, that's creation!

Lightning damage comes from effects that deal lightning damage, nothing more. You are trying to crowbar in effects that do not exist at all in the game for the sake to munchkin in some apparent effects because real world only applies to fantasy elf games when you can take advantage of it.

Also good job ignoring that Creation doesn't involve a massive release of energy. For trying to involve real life you sure missed something so obvious.

Quite frankly this entire topic is just one big lazy attempt to create a catch all for spells. Why bother thinking of anything else when you can shove in fists in mouths (which is instant kill even if the creature doesn't need to breathe or has anything resembling the standard anatomy) and create lightning damage with Dominate Person and nuclear explosions with Creation.

Do not involve real life physics and chemistry in fantasy elf land, when we can create fireballs because we learned a lot then you can add in all the physics and chemistry you want but as it stands both real life and fantasy are divorced from one another and the laws that apply to one doesn't have to apply to the other.

[HoodedHero007]

I did not say to deal lightning damage with dominate person, and to quote the PHB: "You pull wisps of shadow material from the Shadowfellto create a nonliving object of vegetable matter withinrange: 50ft goods. rope, wood, or something similar. Youcan also use this spell to create mineral objects such asstone, crystal, or metal. The object created must be nolarger than a 5-foot cube, and the object must be of aform and material that you have seen before.The duration depends on the object"s material. Ifthe object is composed of multiple materiaIs, use theshortest duration." Where does this say there can't be a massive release of energy?

[ShikomeKidoMi]

point A: where do you think lightning damage comes from? Lighting is an electron discharge, and if you are able to do that, then you can manipulate electrons on a smaller scale.

Yes, because everyone knows that Tasers are capable of mind-control. That is what you're arguing, right? That the ability to create electricity lets you control neuron firing in people's brains at range?

Look, Dominate Person makes someone do what you tell them, but whether or not they count as willing is up to the DM, ultimately. Even if they do, as someone pointed out, you might as well just throw a couple fireballs instead of wasting so many spellslots.

[HoodedHero007]

Yes, because everyone knows that Tasers are capable of mind-control. That is what you're arguing, right? That the ability to create electricity lets you control neuron firing in people's brains at range?
No, I'm saying if you have enough power to control that much lightning, then you can control the small amount of neuron firing with the same lvl spell slot (to account for percision)

[ShikomeKidoMi]

No, I'm saying if you have enough power to control that much lightning, then you can control the small amount of neuron firing with the same lvl spell slot (to account for percision)
So that is what you're saying. That the power to create large amounts of electricity means you should be able to control neurons in people.

I recommend wearing your tinfoil hat around hydroelectric dams, then.

[Boci]

No, I'm saying if you have enough power to control that much lightning, then you can control the small amount of neuron firing with the same lvl spell slot (to account for percision)

Sure you do. Just like I have enough power to assemble a computer, in that I have sufficient strength to lift every component into its place. So why can i not build a computer?

[Shaofoo]

I did not say to deal lightning damage with dominate person, and to quote the PHB: "You pull wisps of shadow material from the Shadowfellto create a nonliving object of vegetable matter withinrange: 50ft goods. rope, wood, or something similar. Youcan also use this spell to create mineral objects such asstone, crystal, or metal. The object created must be nolarger than a 5-foot cube, and the object must be of aform and material that you have seen before.The duration depends on the object"s material. Ifthe object is composed of multiple materiaIs, use theshortest duration." Where does this say there can't be a massive release of energy?


So you are saying that because it doesn't say that there can't be a massive release of energy that there is a massive release of energy?

That is just bad logic right there. By that logic you can do anything that the game doesn't prohibit you to do. Which is just bad.


Pfffft, next you'll be telling me that the Prestidigitation briefcase nuke doesn't work.

Of course it works, Prestedigitation doesn't say that after the spell is resolved you don't immediately create a nuclear explosion where you stand. Heck any spell can be used to do anything that the spells don't say they don't do.

Cleric: Okay so Fighter is dying, I'll use Cure Wounds to save him.

DM: Okay you heal him for 6 damage... also because the spell doesn't say that an anvil doesn't materialize on top of the target after you cast the spell an anvil materializes on top of the fighter and he takes... 30 damage... yep he's dead all right.

Cleric: Damn it, okay fine I guess i'll use Cure Wounds on the orc to kill him.

DM: Okay so you heal him for 4 damage... and because the spell doesn't say you don't summon the Black Eyed Peas after casting the spell you summon the Black Eyed Peas, enjoy Dirty Bit.

[tieren]

To be clear, I brought up the dominate person issue, and my hypothesis is that you can order someone under the control of a dominate person spell to be a willing creature for the ride-along effect of the dimension door spell.

I base this hypothesis on the language in dominate person that says "you can use this telepathic link to issue commands to the creature ... which it does its best to obey". IMO, if you command the target to "accompany through this dimensional portal as we escape to safety", then the target would do its best to obey and not resist the dimension door spell, which in my mind makes him a willing creature.

Now I accept in a free will sense of the word it is not of his own free will, he is being compelled to do it by some external force, but I really don't think that is the level of commitment needed for a "willing creature" under the dimension door spell. Again, imo, that restriction exists to stop you from sending unwilling targets away, and anyone that is actively trying to go with you won't be a problem. I am not saying it would suffice for informed consent in a rape trial or anything, just that the dimension door would transport him.

I accept others may not agree with this interpretation and that does not bother me. I haven't suggested anything about electrons or fission or anything else, just that someone who is actively trying to obey will be considered a willing target of a dimension door spell.

As to why not just throw 3 fireballs, its because the thread is to come up with creative ideas, and nightcrawler kills are cool.

[ShikomeKidoMi]

Icy Doom. Only works in Winter. Lure enemies onto a frozen lake or river. Cast Shatter at their feet. Follow it with Make Whole, targeting the ice.

Grease a rope ladder near the top of a cliff is always nice.

I also like Blinding someone in the middle of vehicle chases.

These are all nice, though you could skip the rope ladder and just grease the top of the cliff, probably.

As far as creative spell use goes, I once suggested polymorphing someone into a small fish and then dumping them in a half full bag of holding. When the spell breaks, they revert to normal size, the bag of holding overloads and they get dumped on the Astral Plane, which probably means you're never seeing them again. Sadly, bags of holding are too rare for this to be a repeatable strategy.

[HoodedHero007]

Oh really?
I thought that creating a highly explosive material WOULD CREATE AN EXPLOSION!

[ShikomeKidoMi]

Oh really?
I thought that creating a highly explosive material WOULD CREATE AN EXPLOSION!

Has your character seen a lot of high explosives? Remember that it must be 'a form and material that you've seen before'.

[HoodedHero007]

Has your character seen a lot of high explosives? Remember that it must be 'a form and material that you've seen before'.
Why can't he have seen Azidoazide Azide?

[ShikomeKidoMi]

Why can't he have seen Azidoazide Azide?

Because it almost certainly hasn't been invented in the setting?

And even if it had, whoever discovered it probably just blew themselves up without sharing the info.

In fact, a better question is what would lead you to believe your character should have seen that?

[HoodedHero007]

Because it almost certainly hasn't been invented in the setting?
I could see it in Eberron or a modern campaign

[Shaofoo]

I could see it in Eberron or a modern campaign

If in your world you want to create a whole bunch of house rules so real life chemistry works then go ahead and do that, but by the rules you can't do anything that the rules don't say.

Azidoazide Azide might not be explosive in D&D world, there is nothing in the rules that certain chemical compounds have to obey the real life chemical reactions, heck we don't even know if water even vaporizes when heated at the boiling point, or if water even has a boiling point. Azidoazide Azide explodes in your world then good for you, don't complain if you go into another world and cleverly try to make explosives outside the rules only for the DM to basically say it doesn't work because that is how the rules are in his world and game.

Basically if it doesn't say it then you can't do it is a much better way to go about it than saying if it doesn't say it then you can do it because the latter just invites madness as we summon horrible pop stars and reenact Looney Tunes sketches.

[Regitnui]

Why can't he have seen Azidoazide Azide?

Here's a good reason; what the hell is azer-do-azer makes-azer-child? And a second question; does it look distinct enough from a harmless substance to be made by memory?

[HoodedHero007]

Here's a good reason; what the hell is azer-do-azer makes-azer-child? And a second question; does it look distinct enough from a harmless substance to be made by memory?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ckSoDW2-wrc

[Shaofoo]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ckSoDW2-wrc


Okay, now point out to me the Top 5 most dangerous chemicals in D&D, cause this references the real world and not fantasy elf land. Fantasy elf Land might not even have these things available, it isn't dangerous if it doesn't exist after all.

I mean can you even get ricin in D&D?

[tieren]

if you come up with a way to disperse it into the air you could make a huge dust explosion with a 5' cube of flour, which should be accessible enough in nearly any setting with bread in it.

[HoodedHero007]

Okay, now point out to me the Top 5 most dangerous chemicals in D&D, cause this references the real world and not fantasy elf land. Fantasy elf Land might not even have these things available, it isn't dangerous if it doesn't exist after all.
D&D has the same general Laws of physics, except for magic, component pouches, carrying capacity, fall speed, and injury logic.

[Shaofoo]

D&D has the same general Laws of physics, except for magic, component pouches, carrying capacity, fall speed, and injury logic.

If you can point to a place in D&D where it says that it is a realistic simulation of real life physical laws then you'd have a point. Otherwise talking about electrons acting in make believe land makes about as much sense as having boxing kangaroos as the nucleus of an element. Also magic does not have a place in the laws of physics unless you can point to me a branch of physics that deals with real life magic.

You are not going to craft a mystery element that is "Surprise explosive!" unless the DM allows it even if you can scream at him blue in the face how it would totes work in real life even though you are playing in a fantasy world that never made any such promises.

DMs might allow some things to happen but it is usually contingent on good will between players and DM, you seem to wish to violate such goodwill in all examples for the sake of gaining an edge (textbook munchkinism). I sure won't listen to someone who tries to push in fists in throats as if he just discovered a new fetish.

[georgie_leech]

D&D has the same general Laws of physics, except for magic, component pouches, carrying capacity, fall speed, and injury logic.

Great, so outside of experimental research labs specifically messing with dangerous chemicals you can't get it because it pretty much explodes at any disturbance. Again, why would your character know about this?

[krugaan]

Hey, have you guys seen that new Star Wars movie? I didn't like it that much.

[Segev]

Hey, have you guys seen that new Star Wars movie? I didn't like it that much.

There wasn't a single transporter accident!

[krugaan]

There wasn't a single transporter accident!

I see what you did there, sir.

The universe becomes way more ethnically diverse in ... however many years elapses between the movies.

[Segev]

I see what you did there, sir.

The universe becomes way more ethnically diverse in ... however many years elapses between the movies.

My brother isn't a huge Star Trek/Wars fan, but he is aware of them, and he's a huge troll IRL. So for Christmas, I got him this shirt:

http://cdn1.bigcommerce.com/server3400/v4eyu8t/products/2187/images/2544/Loved_Him__34768.1430515135.1280.1280.jpg?c=2

[TheTeaMustFlow]

My brother isn't a huge Star Trek/Wars fan, but he is aware of them, and he's a huge troll IRL. So for Christmas, I got him this shirt:

http://cdn1.bigcommerce.com/server3400/v4eyu8t/products/2187/images/2544/Loved_Him__34768.1430515135.1280.1280.jpg?c=2

Oh God, that's beautiful, where can I find one?

[Segev]

Oh God, that's beautiful, where can I find one?

IIRC, I got it off of thinkgeek. I'll try to remember to double-check tonight.

[krugaan]

Oh God, that's beautiful, where can I find one?

I'm betting ThinkGeek might have a version of it.

Anyway, that's way off topic:

Anyone else bothered by how little fighters they send to assault the planet destroying space station?

Like, even *less* than they did in the first one.

[Segev]

I'm betting ThinkGeek might have a version of it.

Anyway, that's way off topic:

Anyone else bothered by how little fighters they send to assault the planet destroying space station?

Like, even *less* than they did in the first one.

They're using mage hand to clog its breathing tubes.

[krugaan]

They're using mage hand to clog its breathing tubes.

They charge the station with a minor legion of conjuration wizards making small amounts of solar plasma, lol (I forget exactly how much minor conjuration is allowed to make).

[TheTeaMustFlow]

I'm betting ThinkGeek might have a version of it.

Anyway, that's way off topic:

Anyone else bothered by how little fighters they send to assault the planet destroying space station?

Like, even *less* than they did in the first one.

I'm still wondering why, if they can go through the shield at lightspeed, they don't just ram the exhaust port self-destruct-button big blowy-uppy thing with an droid-piloted ship full of bombs.

[Vogonjeltz]

This one will take some time but you follow someone around and keep using thaumaturgy to make load scaring sounds. You would scare them to death or they would too many levels of exhaustion and just die. You could use magic mouth to were the trigger is of someone falls asleep it makes a beep beep beep beep beep beep beep beep beep beep noise evert time. Giving lvs of exhaustion

The flaw therein being that the caster would also being suffering exhaustion at this point (unless otherwise immune), and the target would no doubt attempt to seek total seclusion whereupon the caster either gives up or reveals their presence (assuming they were otherwise hidden) and gets engaged in a fight.


Arcane gate: If I remember this correctly, if the gate is dispelled, you would be cut in half like the huge pigman from take back the night

Thank goodness, for everyone who might find themselves in this position, that you do not.


Depending on the DM you might be surprised that just because you teleport doesn't mean that the force that you provided from the fall is somehow negated, you'll still splat.

Yeah, but if that were occurring we'd also die by using planeshift or opening portals between locations with different pressures/gravity/etc...

And forget about things like Time Stop, you'd vaporize by hitting the air molecules, resulting in a massive explosion. I'm inclined to think all this gets handwaved in the name of magic.


D&D has the same general Laws of physics, except for magic, component pouches, carrying capacity, fall speed, and injury logic.

What do you think is wrong with component pouches, carrying capacity, fall speed, or injury logic?

In point of fact, specifically where are you even seeing a fall [i]speed[/b] listed? (book and page number please).

[krugaan]

I'm still wondering why, if they can go through the shield at lightspeed, they don't just ram the exhaust port self-destruct-button big blowy-uppy thing with an droid-piloted ship full of bombs.

Probably the same reason the giant eagle guys only appear at the very end of Lord of the Rings.

Also, it seems like it would require a retarded amount of precision to be going at the speed of light and come to a relative dead stop within the few hundred miles between the surface of the planet and the shield.

They have advanced AIs that translate a billion languages and yet the Corellian Falcon has human gunners...

[JackPhoenix]

I'm still wondering why, if they can go through the shield at lightspeed, they don't just ram the exhaust port self-destruct-button big blowy-uppy thing with an droid-piloted ship full of bombs.

The bombs are redundant... any object going at relativistic speed packs its mass in *boom*. Only antimatter would be more effective.


And forget about things like Time Stop, you'd vaporize by hitting the air molecules, resulting in a massive explosion. I'm inclined to think all this gets handwaved in the name of magic.

Actually, you couldn't move at all, because you can't affect any creatures or objects while in Time Stop. You wouldn't be able to displace air molecules surrounding you to move.

[Shaofoo]

Yeah, but if that were occurring we'd also die by using planeshift or opening portals between locations with different pressures/gravity/etc...

And forget about things like Time Stop, you'd vaporize by hitting the air molecules, resulting in a massive explosion. I'm inclined to think all this gets handwaved in the name of magic.




The moral of the story is that munchkinism kills with misuse of science. Don't try to bring in real life rules into fantasy elf games.

[mgshamster]

In a previous edition, I had some players who used create pit combine with black tentacles to kill quite a few enemies.

Not sure if it's a viable tactic in this edition.

[krugaan]

In a previous edition, I had some players who used create pit combine with black tentacles to kill quite a few enemies.

Not sure if it's a viable tactic in this edition.

Your players watch all the wrong right kinds of anime, eh?

[mgshamster]

Your players watch all the wrong right kinds of anime, eh?

Between this and the Kobolds, you're now my favorite person.

[krugaan]

Between this and the Kobolds, you're now my favorite person.

Sorry, hamster, you're not getting my Bud Light(tm).

[TheTeaMustFlow]

In a previous edition, I had some players who used create pit combine with black tentacles to kill quite a few enemies.

Not sure if it's a viable tactic in this edition.

Nothing stopping it except for the relative dearth of good pit-making spells. The only decent way I can think of is using Illusory Reality on an Image of a giant hole, which depending on one's understanding of the word 'direct' may or may not inflict fall damage but will certainly inflict in-a-giant-pittitude.

[ShikomeKidoMi]

Nothing stopping it except for the relative dearth of good pit-making spells. The only decent way I can think of is using Illusory Reality on an Image of a giant hole, which depending on one's understanding of the word 'direct' may or may not inflict fall damage but will certainly inflict in-a-giant-pittitude.

How fast does Move Earth work?

[HoodedHero007]

What do you think is wrong with component pouches, carrying capacity, fall speed, or injury logic?
Component pouches: theoretically are infinite as they hold the ingredients for all the spells ever
Carrying Capacity:oh yes, there won't be any strain on my muscles as long as the weight is not over a specific amount of lbs
Fall Speed: no acceleration, no terminal velocity
Injury Logic: if someone stabs me, I'd probably bleed out, not in D&D though

[Shaofoo]

Component pouches: theoretically are infinite as they hold the ingredients for all the spells ever

By the rules the spell component pouch can be used in lieu of non expensive material components. Nothing about having to fill it up before with anything. Expensive components are exempt from this (anything with a GP cost) so no, not all spells ever.


Carrying Capacity:oh yes, there won't be any strain on my muscles as long as the weight is not over a specific amount of lbs

If you are talking about the whole one pound more and I am immobile while one pound less then I can't really see your point of argument. Also the book does include rules for exhaustion so even if you think running around with a medium load won't tire you out it will tire you out eventually.


Fall Speed: no acceleration, no terminal velocity

Uhhh... wow...

Actually falling is probably closely modeled after real life falling. You take more damage the further you fall (which means that there is acceleration involved to increase the force) but damage caps of at 20d6 (which means that you have reached terminal velocity).

Also your comment is basically illogical. If there is no acceleration then the terminal velocity is instantly achieved(which would be 0 so things are basically floating around with no gravity). And if there is no terminal velocity either this means that it is for all accounts infinite (which can only happen in a friction-less environment) or 0 (which can only happen on an environment without acceleration like before).


Injury Logic: if someone stabs me, I'd probably bleed out, not in D&D though

Except you do bleed out in D&D.

Characters start out with 5-15 HP, a big hit from a big weapon can have the potential to wipe out all that HP in one go. Even a Wizard can bleed out from a simple Dagger stab. And then you can wait it out and let the person die in the floor as he fails his death saving throws.

[HoodedHero007]

And if I was extremely experienced?

[Shaofoo]

And if I was extremely experienced?

Good job?

If you mean that if you somehow can survive because you have more HP considering that level and HP are abstracts it is meaningless to the actual discussion because you are basically trying to salvage a false premise.

[TheTeaMustFlow]

Component pouches: theoretically are infinite as they hold the ingredients for all the spells ever

You seem to have misunderstood this. Rather, it is assumed that any caster who uses components carries enough of the inexpensive ones for the spells they use 'off-screen', as it were, since they are both inexpensive and easy to acquire, just like it is assumed that the fighter is cleaning his armour and keeping his sword sharp. Both are simply parts of the basic maintenance of one's equipment, so under normal circumstances it is assumed they are both being dealt with.

[krugaan]

...because you are basically trying to salvage a false premise.

He's not even trying to do that. Fairly certain his real goal (intentional or not) is rather different.

[HoodedHero007]

you are basically trying to salvage a false premise.
The premise that physics is sometimes not like it really is in D&D?
Also, we're getting off topic

[krugaan]

I do believe that someone is playing The Game?

[Shaofoo]

The premise that physics is sometimes not like it really is in D&D?
Also, we're getting off topic

Yep, fantasy is not like reality. That really needs to be stated.