Best sorcerer summoning builds

[Yaitanos]

So, thinking of a halfling summoner and curious as to what peeps would suggest. Throw your ideas my way, but no ranged sneak attack. I don't have a lot of hit points.

[Pippin]

Well I tend to turn anything into a Shadowcraft Mage these days. This is the kind of PrC where you decide how cheesy you want it to be!

Edit: and of course I missed the most important word in the OP. Halfling. Well sorry, and good luck with that :v

[Yaitanos]

Well I tend to turn anrything into a Shadowcraft Mage these days. This is the kind of PrC where you decide how cheesy you want it to be!
Well considering the character will be built to really summon the things and not just pretend summon them, shadow magic isn't all that useful.

[ATHATH]

Have you tried a Psion with the Astral Construct power?

There's a feat in some Dragon Magazine that lets you put Astral Construct powers on the monsters that you summon with your Summon Monster spells.

Be a Strongheart Halfling so that you can get an extra feat.

[Werephilosopher]

What alignment are you thinking? Non-evil summoners should go for malconvoker, it's pretty good.

Seconding strongheart halfling.

[daremetoidareyo]

Sorcerer is not the best summoner...

But it can be pretty good.

First thing first. Did you know that you don't HAVE to choose spells from the wizard list? That's right, you can get summon nature's ally.

A sorcerer casts arcane spells which are drawn primarily from the sorcerer/wizard spell list.

Primarily being the operative word.

The problem with this is the lack of ability to talk or command the animal summons...


Complete champion has domain access ACF.
Which can nab you augment summoning for free with the dragon below domain.
Summoner domain lifts your summon spells by +2 levels and puts many summon monster on your spell list, freeing up some spells known for summon nat ally, or other spells.

Imbued summoning is a great metamagic feat to bring in your summons prebuffed. Invisibility? Fly? etc.

Summon dire hawk is pretty good because it sticks around for hours.
Engulfing terror is fun because gelatinous cubes are often full of tactical comedy.
planar binding is a power house.

Consider nar demonbinder or malconvoker.

[Werephilosopher]

First thing first. Did you know that you don't HAVE to choose spells from the wizard list? That's right, you can get summon nature's ally.

That's an... interesting way of reading it. Sorcerers can't get druid spells, because the rules don't say they can. Any spells they can get that aren't from the sorcerer/wizard spell list are still explicitly sorcerer spells, like arcane fusion.


Summoner domain lifts your summon spells by +2 levels and puts many summon monster on your spell list, freeing up some spells known for summon nat ally, or other spells.

Domain Access doesn't free up any spells known - you know one less sorcerer spell from each level in exchange for the domain spells.

[MisterKaws]

Primarily

Uhh...no. It's just because they have exclusives, other than that, Sorcerers only get the normal arcane spells in the Wiz/Sorc list.

About classes: a dip into Sand Shaper is pretty much the norm nowadays for non-gish Sorcerer builds that have spare levels, and considering you want all the summoning you can get, Sand Shaper would be indeed a solid dip, even if you lose a caster level for it.

[Cosi]

I would not go deep into summoning as a Sorcerer. Summoning spells are not very good*. They summon creatures that are below par if you get them as a Wizard, and getting them a level late as a Sorcerer is frankly sad. If you want to run around casting various kinds of summon monster, you should do it as a Cleric. Because you can and Cleric is a better class than the Sorcerer. Not just because they get a bunch of other spells (although to be clear: they totally do), but because they are passively better than you. They get spells faster, get domains, and have a better chassis. Frankly, you should probably go a level past that and play a Druid summoner because that lets you take Greenbound Summoning, which is insane.

*: By this I mean summon monster, summon nature's ally and similar spells. Calling spells like planar binding are totally insane.


What alignment are you thinking? Non-evil summoners should go for malconvoker, it's pretty good.

It's really not, particularly in this case. Consider two characters who would like to do some summoning. A Sorcerer/Malconvoker and a Cleric. The Sorcerer gets some class features that are nice (planar binding becomes marginally more broken, his summons are slightly stronger), but the big cheese is that when he casts summon monster he gets two creatures. That's decent. But that's something the Cleric can also do. When the Sorcerer is casting summon monster IV, the Cleric is casting summon monster V which has the option of simply getting 1d3 creatures off the summon monster IV list.


About classes: a dip into Sand Shaper is pretty much the norm nowadays for non-gish Sorcerer builds that have spare levels, and considering you want all the summoning you can get, Sand Shaper would be indeed a solid dip, even if you lose a caster level for it.

No, it would not. You get some versatility and in exchange you are an entire level behind Wizards. That's not an automatic choice at the best of times, and you are playing a summoner, you really wants as close to full progression as possible and is already a specialist in a fairly versatile line of spells.

[daremetoidareyo]

Uhh...no. It's just because they have exclusives, other than that, Sorcerers only get the normal arcane spells in the Wiz/Sorc list.


That text was written before sorcerer's had exclusives.



"(snip) ...If you go through the Core (3.5 PHB) spellcasters, they all have essentially the same [statement] for the first sentence under their spellcasting section; it swaps out a few words (Arcane/Divine, class name, spell list), and there's some conditionals for the two classes that don't have spell casting from level 1), but it's essentially the same sentence:

Bard: "A bard casts arcane spells, which are drawn from the bard spell list."

Cleric: "A cleric casts divine spells, which are drawn from the cleric spell list. "

Druid: "A druid casts divine spells, which are drawn from the druid spell list. "

Wizard: "A wizard casts arcane spells which are drawn from the sorcerer/ wizard spell list. "

Paladin: "Beginning at 4th level, a paladin gains the ability to cast a small number of divine spells, which are drawn from the paladin spell list"

Ranger: "Beginning at 4th level, a ranger gains the ability to cast a small number of divine spells, which are drawn from the ranger spell list."

The Sorcerer, though, has extra conditionals: "A sorcerer casts arcane spells which are drawn primarily from the sorcerer/wizard spell list. " (Emphasisadded).

Of the core base casters, the Sorcerer is the only one who, right on the first sentence of the spellcasting segment, uses a conditional modifier that implies exceptions. A little later, it even adds (none of the other Core casters get an analog to the second half of this sentence): "These new spells can be common spells chosen from the sorcerer/wizard spell list, or they can be unusual spells that the sorcerer has gained some understanding of by study."

If you pick up the PHB, go to the magic overview, and start pulling out where it specifies how characters learn spells, there's also an interesting exception. For the Wizard, it's level up, copying from scrolls/spellbooks, or independent research (pointing to the DMG). For Divine spells, it's level up or independent research (pointing to the DMG). For Sorcerers and Bards, though, independent research isn't listed - new spells are learned on level up only, and it adds the sentence "With the DM's permission, sorcerers and bards can also select the spells they gain from new and unusual spells that they have gained some understanding of (see Spells in the sorcerer description, page 54)." It then follows it up with an example, that lists "or he might have learned an unusual spell from an arcane scroll or spellbook." (both quotes from the 3.5 PHB, page 179).

For everyone except the Sorcerer, their Spells section has them casting from the class list. With the Sorcerer, it's "primarily" from the class list. For learning new spells, for the Wizard and all Divine classes, it's the automatic spells from level up, spell research (pointing to the DMG), or (in the case of the Wizard) copied spells. For the Sorcerer and Bard, spell research is not listed, but it is noted that they can get other spells.

That's not what most people expect to see, though, so when it's seen, it's usually assumed that the "Primarily" in the Sorcerer spell section refers to spell research (despite the fact that no other Core base class uses that word, but they can all do spell research, and spell research isn't listed as an option under the methods for gaining spells for the Sorcerer in the Magic section). There's no listed mechanics for it, but the Core Sorcerer isn't restricted to the Sor/Wiz list, and does not need to use spell research to get outside of it."

So I read this and thought, "well I haven't seen WotC come out and say otherwise~~"...

Okay, so if Jack's logic is right, your little Sorcerer could very well be calling lightning as a Druid might, cure wounds like a cleric...and sing others to death with spells exclusive to the Bard. Right?

Now as a DM of seven years, I've never allowed it (primarily because I never thought about it), but have been overthinking it lately. I'm in the process of building a half-Djinni Sorcerer and wondered what it would be like to cast some spells he otherwise couldn't before. I would allow this!

But is it really DM's call, or is it RAW, and we've never really noticed until now the Sorcerer was capable of doing this?

Discuss, because I'm curious!

Oh, and what spells (not on the Sor/Wis list) would you equip your sorcerer with and why, given the chance?

....There are no sorcerer-only spells in the Player's Handbook or anywhere in core. Races of the Dragon was released 3 years after 3.5 Core. It would take a level of foresight WotC otherwise kept well hidden for them to anticipate the list of sorcerer-only spells

[Werephilosopher]

It's really not, particularly in this case. Consider two characters who would like to do some summoning. A Sorcerer/Malconvoker and a Cleric. The Sorcerer gets some class features that are nice (planar binding becomes marginally more broken, his summons are slightly stronger), but the big cheese is that when he casts summon monster he gets two creatures. That's decent. But that's something the Cleric can also do. When the Sorcerer is casting summon monster IV, the Cleric is casting summon monster V which has the option of simply getting 1d3 creatures off the summon monster IV list.

Full disclosure, I'm not a sorcerer guy. But in my experince, malconvoker is good for wizards, at least.


That text was written before sorcerer's had exclusives.

Ok, but the SRD doesn't say what other spells a sorcerer can get. So you aren't guaranteed druid spells by RAW, only non-sorc/wiz spells.

[Aegis013]

I'd consider taking Anima Mage from Tome of Magic. It's a strong PrC alone, with the right interpretation of its soul binding advancement text you can get in without dipping binder, but if you have to dip binder, it's not a bad dip. You get some really nice features from Anima Mage, some passive complementary abilities, and with Improved Binding feat and all 10 levels, you can get 6th level vestiges, which gets you Zceryll a vestige from an online article (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/frcc/20070718) that gives you Summon Monster as a sorcerer of your character level once per 5 rounds.

You'll never run out of your main trick, and you can use your sorcerer spells to cover other aspects of your character you may want.

It would be wise to discuss this option with your DM, though, as many consider the ability poorly edited and broken, so clarification may be needed on how exactly it works, also as mentioned above, entry method opportunities may need to be discussed.

[daremetoidareyo]

Ok, but the SRD doesn't say what other spells a sorcerer can get. So you aren't guaranteed druid spells by RAW, only non-sorc/wiz spells.

Yeah, unfortunately you have to talk to your DM. And probably use that post to demonstrate that your claim is supported by the peculiar word use for sorcerers. It's a your mileage may vary situation. But talking to a DM ain't that hard.

[Thurbane]

See if your DM will house-rule letting Heighten spell work with Summon Monster spells like this:

*) When Heighten spell is used on a Summon Monster spell, the creature table changes to match the new spell level. i.e. A Summon Monster I heightened to be cast as a 3rd level spell can use the Summon Monster III creature table instead, at the caster's option.

I've considered allowing this in my games to free up Spells Known slots for Sorcerous Summoners...

[Âmesang]

I'm on the fence regarding that particular reading of the rules since I've typically understood the Player's Handbook as suggesting that such "unusual" spells would be drawn from sorcerer/wizard or sorcerer-only lists outside of the PH; so "no" to call lightning… although "yes" to Slerotin's fortitude from 2nd Edition—it is a wizard/"sorcerer"/mage spell, after all, and being from a previous edition is most certainly "unusual" :smalltongue: (the spell's extraordinarily easy to update, by the way).

…on the other hand a sorcerer could make fine use out of glibness.

Also I now have the urge to play a character who summons halflings…

[Cosi]

Full disclosure, I'm not a sorcerer guy. But in my experince, malconvoker is good for wizards, at least.

Even then, I don't really think so. The basic plan of being a Wizard/Malconvoker is just not all that good. Obviously, being a Wizard at all is pretty sweet so you can still be good with some suboptimal choices, but there are a lot of issues with being a Malconvoker.

1. Combat summoning sucks. You get monsters that have a CR around half your level, and they last for round/level. That isn't great.
2. summon monster is worse than summon nature's ally. Even in core, Fiendish is not really worth being bumped up a spell level, and that's mostly what happens with various animals. The Druid gets to summon wolves at 1st, the Wizard gets them at 3rd. Once you open the floodgates to Greenbound Summoning, it's not even close.
3. Even if you wanted to cast summon monster as your primary shtick, you would be better off doing it as a Cleric. summon monster is on the Cleric list at all the levels it is on the Wizard list, and you get better BAB, better saves, a better HD, domains, and turning.
4. Malconvoker isn't that impressive. The HD boost for planar binding is nice, but that's not really pushing planar binding from "fine" to "broken". The extra monster is similarly good, but at the cost of a caster level, it's not doing anything around half the time (you get two creatures, but they get summon monster at a higher level for d3 creatures).

That's not to say that summon monster is useless. A low or mid op Wizard can get some value out of summoning various creatures for spontaneous utility. But it's not something you should spend much to specialize in.

[Blackhawk748]

Full disclosure, I'm not a sorcerer guy. But in my experince, malconvoker is good for wizards, at least.

Sorcerers make amazing Malconvokers because they are Charisma based.

[Gnorman]

Also, wizards (well, Rapid Summoning Conjurers) can summon as a standard action. Clerics cannot (at least, not without metamagic).

Sorcerers, of course, get the worst of both worlds. Sure, Charisma is useful for planar binding, but it's relatively trivial to find items and spells that boost your Charisma check.

[Yaitanos]

A lot of hate on sorcs, which I can kinda understand, they are basically commoners with spells and a special pet. I was planning on using strongheart for the character. The main idea is a halfling sorcerer who pretends to be a human child (will have a player pretending to be the parent) who primarily summons elementals, using a stuffed earth elemental as a focus. Talked with the dm for trading in the familiar for the rapid summoning ability of a conjuration specialist wizard. Anima mage looks interesting with that zceryell character, could play it off as nightmares and stuff.

[Aegis013]

Anima mage looks interesting with that zceryell character, could play it off as nightmares and stuff.

Just be aware of the sign that Zceryll causes your character to show without two levels of Binder for suppress sign. You may need some kind of illusion or a Hat of Disguise, otherwise your strange opaque mirror eyes will make you look quite a bit less human.

The influence probably won't be too much of a problem with your high charisma score, but even if you make a bad pact, you can ignore the influence at a cost that won't too drastically affect your character's viability.

[Blackhawk748]

Sorcerers, of course, get the worst of both worlds. Sure, Charisma is useful for planar binding, but it's relatively trivial to find items and spells that boost your Charisma check.

Its not just for Planar binding (though thats kinda huge) IIRC Malconvoker has a bunch of other stuff that works off of Charisma.

[Kelb_Panthera]

Metamagic specialist and rapid spell are your friends. Add in versatille spellcaster and you can get your top level summons out in a standard action just like a focused conjurer.

Remember, with summon monster you'll want to look at the summoned creatures' SLA's. They're not worth much as meat shields but they -can- turn out a lot of fire-power or utility, particularly the mephits at SM 4.

There's a summoner's handbook around here somewhere. Gimme a minute.

Here we go (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?255219-The-Summoner-s-Desk-Reference-D-amp-D-3-5).

[TheBrassDuke]

That's an... interesting way of reading it. Sorcerers can't get druid spells, because the rules don't say they can. Any spells they can get that aren't from the sorcerer/wizard spell list are still explicitly sorcerer spells, like arcane fusion.

Let's look back at 3.0 and see what the designers said.


Uhh...no. It's just because they have exclusives, other than that, Sorcerers only get the normal arcane spells in the Wiz/Sorc list.

Primarily is not exclusive, and if you look at it the right way? It's open to DM and player cooperation.


That text was written before sorcerer's had exclusives.

Correct. This wasn't written because they foresaw the Sorcerer Only spells. While I agree it means researching other books for Sor/Wiz spells, it doesn't necessarily lock them down to the spell list altogether. And you could argue all day, but every DM I actually know will agree they can and should be able to learn off other lists.


Ok, but the SRD doesn't say what other spells a sorcerer can get. So you aren't guaranteed druid spells by RAW, only non-sorc/wiz spells.

>_> A Druid spell is non Sor/Wiz. So if you're guaranteed that, yes you are. But it doesn't even strictly say that anyway, which is the reason we have the debate to begin with. Unfortunately. Because I'm the front runner to it all. Following Jack, of course.


Yeah, unfortunately you have to talk to your DM. And probably use that post to demonstrate that your claim is supported by the peculiar word use for sorcerers. It's a your mileage may vary situation. But talking to a DM ain't that hard.

Exactly.


daremetoidareyo]Originally Posted by
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-423413.html
"(snip) ...If you go through the Core (3.5 PHB) spellcasters, they all have essentially the same [statement] for the first sentence under their spellcasting section; it swaps out a few words (Arcane/Divine, class name, spell list), and there's some conditionals for the two classes that don't have spell casting from level 1), but it's essentially the same sentence:

Bard: "A bard casts arcane spells, which are drawn from the bard spell list."

Cleric: "A cleric casts divine spells, which are drawn from the cleric spell list. "

Druid: "A druid casts divine spells, which are drawn from the druid spell list. "

Wizard: "A wizard casts arcane spells which are drawn from the sorcerer/ wizard spell list. "

Paladin: "Beginning at 4th level, a paladin gains the ability to cast a small number of divine spells, which are drawn from the paladin spell list"

Ranger: "Beginning at 4th level, a ranger gains the ability to cast a small number of divine spells, which are drawn from the ranger spell list."

The Sorcerer, though, has extra conditionals: "A sorcerer casts arcane spells which are drawn primarily from the sorcerer/wizard spell list. " (Emphasisadded).

Of the core base casters, the Sorcerer is the only one who, right on the first sentence of the spellcasting segment, uses a conditional modifier that implies exceptions. A little later, it even adds (none of the other Core casters get an analog to the second half of this sentence): "These new spells can be common spells chosen from the sorcerer/wizard spell list, or they can be unusual spells that the sorcerer has gained some understanding of by study."

If you pick up the PHB, go to the magic overview, and start pulling out where it specifies how characters learn spells, there's also an interesting exception. For the Wizard, it's level up, copying from scrolls/spellbooks, or independent research (pointing to the DMG). For Divine spells, it's level up or independent research (pointing to the DMG). For Sorcerers and Bards, though, independent research isn't listed - new spells are learned on level up only, and it adds the sentence "With the DM's permission, sorcerers and bards can also select the spells they gain from new and unusual spells that they have gained some understanding of (see Spells in the sorcerer description, page 54)." It then follows it up with an example, that lists "or he might have learned an unusual spell from an arcane scroll or spellbook." (both quotes from the 3.5 PHB, page 179).

For everyone except the Sorcerer, their Spells section has them casting from the class list. With the Sorcerer, it's "primarily" from the class list. For learning new spells, for the Wizard and all Divine classes, it's the automatic spells from level up, spell research (pointing to the DMG), or (in the case of the Wizard) copied spells. For the Sorcerer and Bard, spell research is not listed, but it is noted that they can get other spells.

That's not what most people expect to see, though, so when it's seen, it's usually assumed that the "Primarily" in the Sorcerer spell section refers to spell research (despite the fact that no other Core base class uses that word, but they can all do spell research, and spell research isn't listed as an option under the methods for gaining spells for the Sorcerer in the Magic section). There's no listed mechanics for it, but the Core Sorcerer isn't restricted to the Sor/Wiz list, and does not need to use spell research to get outside of it."

So I read this and thought, "well I haven't seen WotC come out and say otherwise~~"...

Okay, so if Jack's logic is right, your little Sorcerer could very well be calling lightning as a Druid might, cure wounds like a cleric...and sing others to death with spells exclusive to the Bard. Right?

Now as a DM of seven years, I've never allowed it (primarily because I never thought about it), but have been overthinking it lately. I'm in the process of building a half-Djinni Sorcerer and wondered what it would be like to cast some spells he otherwise couldn't before. I would allow this!

But is it really DM's call, or is it RAW, and we've never really noticed until now the Sorcerer was capable of doing this?

Discuss, because I'm curious!

Oh, and what spells (not on the Sor/Wis list) would you equip your sorcerer with and why, given the chance?

....There are no sorcerer-only spells in the Player's Handbook or anywhere in core. Races of the Dragon was released 3 years after 3.5 Core. It would take a level of foresight WotC otherwise kept well hidden for them to anticipate the list of sorcerer-only spells

Hey, that's me! You have summoned me!

[Âmesang]

To be fair, dragons cast spells as sorcerers but many also cast cleric/domain spells as arcane spells.

Perhaps the intention was to have a non-dragon sorcerer perform a quest for an agreeable dragon and receive a special scroll in return with which they could study and learn?

[Troacctid]

Let's look back at 3.0 and see what the designers said.
Well, I happen to have the 3.0 Player's Handbook handy here, so sure.

These spells can be common spells chosen from the sorcerer and wizard spell list (page 168), or they can be unusual spells that the sorcerer has gained some understanding of by study. For example, a sorcerer with a scroll or spellbook detailing an unusual sorcerer/wizard spell (one not on the wizard/sorcerer spell list in this book) could select that spell as one of his new spells for achieving a new level, provided the spell is the right level.
The example given specifies a sorcerer/wizard spell not from the list in the core rulebook (perhaps one from a different book, or one that was specially researched). But it does definitely say a sorcerer/wizard spell.

Compare that with the 3.5 version, which is...

These new spells can be common spells chosen from the sorcerer/wizard spell list (page 192), or they can be unusual spells that the sorcerer has gained some understanding of by study. For example, a sorcerer with a scroll or spellbook detailing an unusual sorcerer/wizard spell (one not on the sorcerer/wizard spell list in this book) could select that spell as one of his new spells for attaining a new level, provided that it is of the right spell level.
...exactly the same, with the only change being the page number reference.

[TheBrassDuke]

I'm positive in the old edition Sorcerers were explicitly allowed to cast outside of their Spell list. Backtracking now!

[Gweed]

A lot of hate on sorcs, which I can kinda understand, they are basically commoners with spells and a special pet. I was planning on using strongheart for the character. The main idea is a halfling sorcerer who pretends to be a human child (will have a player pretending to be the parent) who primarily summons elementals, using a stuffed earth elemental as a focus. Talked with the dm for trading in the familiar for the rapid summoning ability of a conjuration specialist wizard. Anima mage looks interesting with that zceryell character, could play it off as nightmares and stuff.


If you are focusing on elemental summons, Rashemi Elemental Summoning is the feat for you.

Also, while hardly even close to the "best" Bonded Summoners are wholly focused on elementals, with you being able to turn into an Elder elemental as the capstone.

[Gnorman]

Also, if you are indeed focusing on elemental summons, perhaps something with druid casting would be a better choice than sorcerer? They get earlier and better access to elemental summons. You could also trade in your animal companion for an elemental one, or use the Aspect of Nature ACF to take on elemental traits. Or perhaps you could "trade in" your animal companion for Rapid Summoning, then regain it via Wild Cohort. Or take this feat I just made for you. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?481958-Rapid-Summoner-(3-5-feat))

If you're set on being a Charisma-focused caster, well, there's the spirit shaman, and I'm sure you could talk to your DM about creating some sort of "dynamic druid." In most aspects, switching to Charisma would be a straight downgrade for a druid, so I doubt it would be a balancing issue.

[ace rooster]

I came up with a slightly odd summoner build that gets you the high level CE summons two levels early. It is bard based, but that is almost a sorcerer right? :smallwink: Needs to be chaotic evil, but that can be fun. Nerfs the rest of your casting a little, but only 1 level behind sorcerer. Needs wisdom 15, and a way to get listen as a class skill.

Bard 7, Demonologist 3 (BoVD), sublime chord x (CA).

The demonologist boosts your summon monster spells by 2 levels, irrespecitive of how you cast them. Level 9 is a definite low point in the build, as you only have 3rd level spells, but level 10 boosts those to summon monster 5s, and level 11 gets you sublime chord 5th level spell slots which get boosted to summon monster 7s.


Summoning can be a viable combat method, because it has three shining strengths. Firstly, your summons are entirely expendible. They can and will happily go on suicide missions to moderately inconvieniece someone. Secondly, summoning does not need line of effect to the target. Ideally you will be around a wall of force, so you can see, but not be attacked. Finally, summons actions are extra actions, so they are valuable despite being relatively weak. A readied stinking cloud from a SM3 dretch might not cause a caster to fail their con check, but it will mean they can't see their target!

Summoning based combat is all about attrition and overwhelming the enemy. Priority number one is surviving. The easiest way to survive is to be untargetable, so your other spells should be things like invisibility, walls, DD, obscuring mist, resiliant sphere.

Another shining spell worth mentioning is benign transposition (SC). Send a summon, switch with summon. 2 first level spells for a teleport. If you are in a party with other casters this is a great emergency evac, because your summons are entirely expendible. Teleporting one into the grapple with the tiger is not a problem, while teleporting another party member in would be.

Edit: being silly, just use cross class ranks. Demonologist gets plenty,

[Zaq]

Honestly? Unless your group is super optimized, ignore the naysayers who say that Sorcerers don't make good summoners. They're not wrong that Druids do it better, and they're not wrong that Sorcerers have better things to do, but you're still a damn Sorcerer, and you can still be plenty effective with a summoning focus, with or without Malconvoker.

Yes, if the party is full of highly optimized Artificers and CoDzillas and insanely prepared Wizards, then sure, you're going to be less effective than they are. But if the party ISN'T full of high-op characters, then you'll be perfectly fine as long as you do your homework ahead of time. (Make sure that you're really very familiar with the stats for everything you can summon so that you can pull out exactly what you need in any given situation, and make sure that you have sheets ready for them so that you don't slow down the game. Your party will hate you if you take fifteen minutes to pick a critter and dig up its stats every single time, so do your homework and make that smooth and simple at the table.)

You might choose to learn a summoning spell at every spell level, but you don't necessarily have to. You don't get all that many spells known, and you don't necessarily need to have every single Summon Monster spell at your fingertips. Exactly which ones you want are up to you, but don't feel like you have to have every single one.

Remember that summoning doesn't break Invisibility, so that can be a decent way of keeping yourself alive. Your call whether you want to spend the action turning it on in every combat, but it's a good trick to have up your sleeve regardless, since sometimes you get a buff round. Same thing applies if you can get your hands on Sanctuary—that one's not usually on the Sorc list, but keep an eye out for items or other ways of getting access to it. (It is a domain spell, so you can use Arcane Disciple or Domain Access to get it once per day, but that's a pretty big cost for a 1/day benefit unless you have a cheesy way to Persist it, which would take some shenanigans.)

Cloudy Conjuration is a fun feat to have. Invisible Spell is really cheesy with summon spells, but you might look into it if your GM allows it. (If your GM does allow it, don't overdo it and make every single summon invisible—that's a good way for every single enemy to suddenly gain the ability to see invisible things. But it can be a great trick to have now and again.) You'll need Rapid Metamagic or another way of reducing the action cost, though, since adding metamagic to a 1 round casting time is bad news on a spontaneous caster.

Do remember that you have spells that aren't summons. It's totally fine for summoning to be your go-to trick, but it shouldn't be your only method of solving problems or even your only method of contributing to fights. You'll definitely want some way of dispelling Magic Circle Against X and Protection From X, since those can really mess up your summons. (Every Sorcerer needs Dispel Magic or an equivalent, but it's doubly important for you.)

Overall, you're a Sorcerer. Just make sure you do your homework to the point where you won't slow down the game every time you summon something, and you'll be fine. Yes, a Sorcerer Malconvoker is a full spell level behind a Wizard, but if you're comparing yourself to anything that isn't a T1 full caster, you'll still be a perfectly happy and functional member of the party.

[Gnorman]

Well, hey, before you throw us all under the bus:

I'm not saying that Sorcerers make bad summoners, and yes, you'll probably be fine no matter what, because you'll still be playing a full caster. You may have other reasons for wanting to play a Sorcerer, and that's just fine. Maybe you've already got a divine caster in the group, I don't know.

I'm just saying that, if your desired playstyle is "summon elementals," a druid will let you do so earlier and more often.

[Piggy Knowles]

Sorcerer 6/Malconvoker 9/Thaumaturgist 5 is clean, easy and ridiculously effective at summoning.

[Yaitanos]

Honestly not looking for optimized. As this is just a silly character concept I wanna play. The idea is a halfling (since my GM doesn't let us play children) who has a stuffed elemental and calls on his imaginary friends to help him out when needed. Was definitely going to use the benign/baleful transposition cheese for both effective tactics and party shenanigans. I saw once a way that wizards could get elementals on the lower lists somehow, but can't for the life of me find it. They gave up diversity on what they could summon for the elemental.

As for why sorc, druid would be a better choice yes, but to my knowledge doesn't get the fun teleportation spells that a sorc gets. Also, hate preparing spells. Prefer spontaneous casters.

[Zaq]

Well, hey, before you throw us all under the bus:

I'm not saying that Sorcerers make bad summoners, and yes, you'll probably be fine no matter what, because you'll still be playing a full caster. You may have other reasons for wanting to play a Sorcerer, and that's just fine. Maybe you've already got a divine caster in the group, I don't know.

I'm just saying that, if your desired playstyle is "summon elementals," a druid will let you do so earlier and more often.

No buses, no throwing, no judgment. You'll notice I said in my very first paragraph that it's not wrong to say that Druids do it better. I'm just saying that this character concept is quite strong enough even without applying maximum optimization. (And I'm very much not one of those "optimization is bad" folks. I'm just pointing out that a Sorc is still a Sorc even if a Wiz is better.) No hard feelings, everything's cool.

OP, have you ever played Sentinels of the Multiverse? (If not, you should. Everyone should. It's an incredibly fun cooperative superhero card game. Total blast.) I can't help but think of your character as The Dreamer, only probably not evil. (Which I guess would make you The Visionary, but that's different. Anyway.)

[Yaitanos]

No buses, no throwing, no judgment. You'll notice I said in my very first paragraph that it's not wrong to say that Druids do it better. I'm just saying that this character concept is quite strong enough even without applying maximum optimization. (And I'm very much not one of those "optimization is bad" folks. I'm just pointing out that a Sorc is still a Sorc even if a Wiz is better.) No hard feelings, everything's cool.

OP, have you ever played Sentinels of the Multiverse? (If not, you should. Everyone should. It's an incredibly fun cooperative superhero card game. Total blast.) I can't help but think of your character as The Dreamer, only probably not evil. (Which I guess would make you The Visionary, but that's different. Anyway.)

I have (love the virtuoso of the void), and you're kinda right. I'm just not summoning nightmares that wanna eat me, but instead calling my imaginary friends who want to kill everyone around me.

[Zaq]

I have (love the virtuoso of the void), and you're kinda right. I'm just not summoning nightmares that wanna eat me, but instead calling my imaginary friends who want to kill everyone around me.

Yeah, it's not a perfect match (The Dreamer is doing her thing unintentionally and needs to be saved from herself, while you're doing this very intentionally and are, we hope, in control of what you're doing), but that's still what I think of when you describe a character as a child (or childlike person) who summons imaginary friends to cause problems for people.

[Yaitanos]

So does anyone know of the variant wiz that gets to summon elementals at an earlier level than summon monster 3?

[Cosi]

So does anyone know of the variant wiz that gets to summon elementals at an earlier level than summon monster 3?

The Druid. /s

I think there's a cheesy way to get the Summon Elemental reserve feat early. Nothing else off the top of my head, although there might be a Elemental equivalent to Fiendish in one of the planes book, which you could ask your DM to let you substitute (so instead of a Fiendish Wolf you summon a Fire Element Wolf). Maybe for a feat.

[Yaitanos]

The Druid. /s

I think there's a cheesy way to get the Summon Elemental reserve feat early. Nothing else off the top of my head, although there might be a Elemental equivalent to Fiendish in one of the planes book, which you could ask your DM to let you substitute (so instead of a Fiendish Wolf you summon a Fire Element Wolf). Maybe for a feat.

No really there was some way for wizards to get elementals on lower level summon monster spells. I know I saw it somewhere. Unfortunately wizards is going through and destroying every online database that would make the search for this easier to do.