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View Full Version : DM Help Spellcaster BBEG first battle with party help



Alerad
2016-03-20, 09:12 PM
Anybody familiar with the name Ashblack stop reading now :)

So, last session my evil Archmage teleported to the party just after one medium battle with some random bandits and we ended there. My question is how to design a fun first encounter.

1. He has some teleport contingency so the encounter is likely not going to be fatal for him.

2. Party is 5 PCs of 6th and 5th level. Two fighters, assassin, ranger and wizard. The wizard is out of 3rd level slots.

3. The Archmage is blessed with divination powers. School of Divination, permanent Foresight boon, 15th or 17th level wizard. 8th level slot was used for Mind blank, 7th for teleport, one 1st for mage armor.

4. Ashblack doesn't want to TPK the party just yet. He needs an item from them so I'm planning on a few rounds battle then flee.

5. Restrictions
- Duergar for story reasons
- no Enchantment or Necromancy spells because of story reasons
- ideally no TPK because of story reasons


My question is, do I design him as a boss or as a player? One vs five is going to be hard, and I don't want the battle to end too fast. On the other hand the party's resources are half spent. Concentration restrictions are also strict. Several options I'm thinking of:
- Legendary actions - that's if I go for boss
- Ability to concentrate on two spells. Might include it as a home brew feat later.
- Free Bigby's hand (no concentration, it's just there)
- What spells are good for threatening the group and prolonging the encounter? Wall of force, etc. is good, but I also need something with no concentration

Sir cryosin
2016-03-20, 10:01 PM
Have you thought about animate objects or conjure Elementals. If your doing two concentration spells at once I like animate objects and stinking cloud.

Alerad
2016-03-20, 10:25 PM
I was thinking of Animate objects, yes, its on my draft list.

The real question is do I stick to the rules or make him more powerful? He's beatable, he's mortal, he has weaknesses. He's just powerful.

Kane0
2016-03-21, 01:03 AM
Resilient Con and warcaster are recommended, spells that do both damage and control are good options since they both hamper the party and deal less damage on average than straight blast spells. Ice storm, phantasmal force and the like.

Using concentration on a debuff or control spell is okay, but what you really want to do is break attention from yourself. Summons are great at that, and there are some good non-concentration spells like mirror image that will keep you safe for a little bit while you cast.
To demonstrate power you can control one or more pcs at a time with things like forcecage but it often leaves a bad taste in player's mouths, they want to be able to influence things and a contingent teleport is already plenty enough to cheese them off.

But theres really no need to build him the same as a PC. You are under no obligation to make him mechanically equal to the party, just build him as you would a monster and manage the cr that way. An ability that allows him to conc on a specific spell for free might be worth +1 CR, any two conc spells 2 CR, etc.

BurgerBeast
2016-03-21, 04:58 AM
I would stat him as a monster. I'd use the Archmage in Appendix B as a baseline to substitute abilities, but then I'd calculate offensive CR from damage output based the average of actual damage/spells used in the first three rounds of combat. Likewise with defensive CR.

Angry GM has an awesome article on monster creation in 5e which I used to create many custom drow, and I was quite happy with the results.

Most importantly, he'll get 17d8 hit dice plus Con modifier, so he'll have more staying power.

Oramac
2016-03-21, 02:01 PM
Does the Wizard have Hold Person prepared? If so, I'd worry about that, as if your BBEG fails a couple saves against it, he could be toast. Especially if the Fighters and Assassin get some lucky rolls.

Otherwise, the party has basically no healing available, so maybe use that to scare them into running away from the fight instead of your BBEG running away?

Safety Sword
2016-03-21, 04:54 PM
One of my personal favourites is a "James Bond" villain scenario.

Perhaps a Wall of Force or similar to hold the party at bay whilst Askblack does his thing (whatever that might be, it could even be a monologue) without interference.

He could do what he needs to do so that the party are guaranteed to give chase and then drop the wall and disappear in a puff of acrid smoke or some such thing.

It's a useful plot device as long as it's not an overused plot device. Since your party would be throwing themselves to their deaths at low level against this guy, it's actually of benefit to the party for him to have some arrogance and not finish them off. Plus, as you said, he's clearly luring them to gain something they have.

You want the party to have this moment:
PC1: It's a trap.
PC2: I know, but we have to keep going.
DM: Internal maniacal cackling

Reaper34
2016-03-21, 05:13 PM
animate object on dead bandit's armor. makes them think he's a necro but he's not. and maybe stinking cloud. never go wrong with misdirection.

Roughishguy86
2016-03-21, 05:27 PM
I would treat him as a monster like most people on here are saying. It gives you more freedom. Also you said hes beatable but you might want to get away from that mentality for this encounter because if you make it possible too beat him(However extremely difficult) your players might just get insanely lucky and do alot more damage too him then you anticipated. It might be better off for you too just not track his damage or rather than have him teleport out if they start getting the upper hand maybe have him pull a final fantasy esque move and drop the whole party too 1 at the same time(thus ending the engagement) this would give the whole party this feeling that this archmage is way out of their league at this moment which if your players are anything like mine will casue them too go out of their way too get stronger and find some way too get an upperhand on your NPC.

But then again my pc's are used too my relentless style of DM'ing wher i essentially beat them down over and over again forcing them too think of new ways too approach any given situation. I also find that it gives them a much greater sense of the power of others in the world and makes their eventual victory that much sweeter because they worked so hard for it. Kind of like a rocky movie.

Icewraith
2016-03-21, 06:15 PM
I don't understand why he doesn't just nuke the party and search the bodies if he wants an item from the party. With divination abilities, it's not like he won't know where the item is.

Probably best not to reveal your true nature to the clueless good guys you're planning on snuffing, so I'd say hit them with a summon without revealing yourself or at least disguise yourself. Your stereotypical evil wizard probably won't be able to stomach the hit their reputation would take if word got around they fled from a 6th level party.

Having this guy show up and not kill the party is going to stretch suspension of disbelief, or it would stretch mine. Even just teleporting in means the wizard is way out of the party's league. I know you as the DM don't want the party dead, but I'm not sure if that motive is really translating to this NPC the way the encounter is starting.

Brendanicus
2016-03-21, 06:25 PM
On a side note, look up any and all buff spells that have no concentration. Mage armor, false life, mirror image, etc. these wards can increasw his survivability, which essential for a spellcaster boss. He could also use scrolls or spell gems for such a purpose, that latter make awesome loot.

Consider giving him minions? A fiendish familiar or apprentice could spice things up.

If he is skilled in divination, the bbeg could know of the fights location in advance. Maybe he hired mm spies or bugbears to ambush the party mid fight, or priests or acolytes to heal him.

Reaper34
2016-03-21, 09:04 PM
[QUOTE=Brendanicus;20569616] Consider giving him minions? A fiendish familiar or apprentice could spice things up. [QUOTE]

this is good. what evil overlord does the job themselves when they have apprentices to do the dirtywork. he could still escape but it adds a layer to the story. you always have to beat the sub bosses to get to the big boss.

side not i can't get the quotes to work. it's probably a malfunction with the operator cuz i'm tech dumb.

PeteNutButter
2016-03-21, 11:38 PM
Definitely make him a monster, PCs are too weak/fragile. CHEAT! If you don't they will kill him fast and easy.

Anyways instead of allowing him to concentrate on multiple spells, just give him items that have the effects. His boots make him boots haste him, cloak makes him fly etc. The party isn't supposed to beat him so you don't have to worry about them getting OP items.

Alternatively it could be a fun thing, to maybe have a side-mission to steal one of the mage's items. Or maybe just have him leave behind something minor when he teleports out (the fighter grapples him, and *poof* he is gone leaving only the cloak in the fighters hand). If he is deadly but leaves behind powerful things, the PCs will learn both to fear and look forward to fighting him. Say he stumbles out of boot in combat, and it is a powerful boot... but they can't use it much till they get the other one. Basically every shred of every stitch of the guy could scream POWER to the players.

But yeah give him lots of hp.

Alerad
2016-03-22, 05:31 AM
Thanks for the advice. I'm thinking of Animated Objects and Bigby's Hand as main concentration spells. Wall of Force is useful, but not fun. I'll keep it as a last resort protection. Also walling off the group doesn't impose any real threat (unless there is a raging elemental on their half). I was thinking of Mirror Image as well, seems like the best protection. Misty step and Shield.

The reason he doesn't just nuke the party is, he doesn't want to unless necessary. I rather dislike placing my NPCs on a 3x3 alignment grid where Evil sums up his entire motivations. Also, the Wizard resisted his first Scrying attempt so out of curiosity he ought to at least check her out. Potential apprentices are valuable.

The item was left behind by another wizard hundreds of years ago so supposedly it has some powerful abjurations. Not sure if non-detection works this way but surely there must be a spell that hides it well.

I'm staying away from fiends because that's in fact another medium villain's specialty.

Alerad
2016-03-22, 05:35 AM
Also, giving him some minor items which can be gradually stripped off is a good idea, thanks. I'm not sure I want to gear him up too much, but few tricks to get out of tight situations are probably just right.

Alerad
2016-03-22, 05:51 AM
Does the Wizard have Hold Person prepared? If so, I'd worry about that, as if your BBEG fails a couple saves against it, he could be toast. Especially if the Fighters and Assassin get some lucky rolls.

Otherwise, the party has basically no healing available, so maybe use that to scare them into running away from the fight instead of your BBEG running away?

The wizard doesn't have Hold person. Either way, with 3 Portent dice I feel almost like having Legendary resistance already.

The Assassin took one level of Bard last time (some elves convinced her to seek the good in her heart), so the party has 1-2 healing words hopefully.

Oramac
2016-03-22, 08:09 AM
side not i can't get the quotes to work. it's probably a malfunction with the operator cuz i'm tech dumb.

In the second [quote] bracket, you need a / in front of the Q: [ /quote ] (without the spaces)

This tells the forum to "close" the quote.

Alerad
2016-04-16, 07:00 PM
Update.

After all, I designed him as a character. Level 15 or 17th (has Foresight either way). I didn't calculate the CR, but should be similar to the Archmage NPC. Hit points hovering a little above 100, I was very worried the party will drop him in round 1. However, he laid waste to the entire group.

Spells I used:
Animate Objects
Shield
Misty Step
Detect Thoughts
Fireball
Bigby's Hand
Dimension Door

Protections:
Foresight (he's a Diviner after all)
Mind Blank
Mage Armor

Other:
1 Portent die which saved him from the Assassin's auto-crit
1 Scroll ("Heal") which wasn't really necessary, but let's keep him above 50% hp

Observations:
Foresight is really powerful. Rolling everything with advantage while enemies attacking you with disadvantage felt like fighting a boss and not some random NPC. I didn't extend the advantage/disadvantage to Animate Objects and Bigby's Hand though, not sure if I should.

Animate Objects (10 tiny) is great for field control. Each of the players had 2 objects tagging them. At some point I stopped tracking Opportunity Attacks as the fight would have finished much much faster.

Bigby's Hand not as great as Animate Objects against multiple enemies, but still very good. I think casting it at higher level is much better though, if you can afford it. Still, it's probably a better choice for the players and not the villains.

Fireball is great as always. I used it a little bit late and dropped the two fighters immediately, I think it's better suited for an opening spell if your objective is to keep the battle longer.

I ran with the idea of dropping loot when players damage him (which was hard enough, so it should be rewarding). He had tons of gems and jewelry for spellcasting, so it wasn't out of place either.


Things I could've done better (probably):
My players did no tactical observations of any kind. I did hint that he has limited spells ("Good! You don't hit him, but you force him to use his Shield spell."), but the power gap was so huge, they didn't bother to notice what spells and how often he uses.