Multiclassing into the same class?

[Oramac]

I just had this thought.

Ignoring the RP issues, say I wanted to take 7 levels of Vengeance Paladin for Relentless Avenger, and then take 7 levels of Devotion Paladin for Aura of Devotion.

Is that even possible?

[Azedenkae]

According to the rules, no.

[Renvir]

I think the rules in the PHB for Multi-classing are all based on moving into a new class. Their examples are only of base classes (fighter, druid, barbarian) and not subclasses (devotion, vengeance). Without a deeper dive I'd guess the RAW and RAI are against it. However, I did let a player multi between an Evocation and two levels in Divination Wizard. His spell slots progressed normally but I told him he'd miss out on the 20th level signature spell.

If I were to allow it I'd say Lay on Hands continues getting stronger, you don't get a second fighting style, your spells continue normally, you don't get two extra attacks just one, and you'll miss out on the Sacred Oath abilities at level 15 and 20 (I believe their 15 and 20, don't have the book in front of me). Definitely weird but if the GM allows it...

[Arkhios]

According to the rules, no.

What he said. No, it's not possible per RAW. Technically not even per RAI, because multi-classing refers to taking levels in another class than your original/previous class. Archetypes do not qualify for being a separate classes in this sense, unfortunately.


If I were to allow it I'd say Lay on Hands continues getting stronger, you don't get a second fighting style, your spells continue normally, you don't get two extra attacks just one, and you'll miss out on the Sacred Oath abilities at level 15 and 20 (I believe their 15 and 20, don't have the book in front of me). Definitely weird but if the GM allows it...

Yes, they are at 15 and 20. Also, I would agree on your approach, if I were to allow multi-subclassing :)

[Saggo]

Archetypes do not qualify for being a separate classes in this sense, unfortunately.

Archetypes aren't really classes at all. They're just a mutually exclusive feature you acquire early on that provide additional features as you level.

[DaKiwiMonsta]

What he said. No, it's not possible per RAW. Technically not even per RAI, because multi-classing refers to taking levels in another class than your original/previous class. Archetypes do not qualify for being a separate classes in this sense, unfortunately.

I have to agree with this, two archetypes are the same class so I would say no to that unfortunately.

[PeteNutButter]

Definitely not RAW. If your DM wanted to allow it the only balanced way of doing it would be for you to pick up the different subclasses feature (starting w the first and working up) the next time you would pick up one from your original class. Paladin is probably the worst RP choice for this since you would then have two separate and distinct oaths to follow which could conflict. If a necromancer wizard say wanted to instead pick up the lvl 2 ability of an enchanter instead of the lvl 6 necromancer ability it could reflect him turning away from his oft' frowned upon school. Still far from RAW though.

[Arkhios]

Archetypes aren't really classes at all. They're just a mutually exclusive feature you acquire early on that provide additional features as you level.

To be fair, we're still talking about the same thing. That's just another way to put it. However, in some sense, archetypes (or in this precise case, sub-classes) could be seen as separate classes (all the while they obviously are not), if we're talking from a descriptive point of view.
One could even say that a barbarian, a fighter, a paladin, and a ranger are all "archetypal concepts" of a Warrior's general concept, and wouldn't be too far from the truth. But that's semantics. :smallsmile:

[Icewraith]

I'm trying to think how I'd run this if I had decided to allow it... most of the levels are duplicate, just taking the 3rd level etc would be too powerful although you could have it delay spells known like multiclassing. But the levels aren't different until three.. you don't become a Vengeance Paladin until third. Before that you're just a Paladin. If you actually count the levels as two separate classes you immediately run into spell prep shenanigans.

Using some sort of XP buyout to unlock a different set of class abilities might be something I'd consider doing in a level 20 campaign.

[Lawful Good]

If you were to multiclass into the same class, with a different archetype, there wouldn't be anything wrong with it. Against the rules, of course, but it wouldn't be a problem. Ignoring duplicate features, it would just be a nerf.


Using some sort of XP buyout to unlock a different set of class abilities might be something I'd consider doing in a level 20 campaign.

This is the path I would take. It could be used before 20, with some tweaking. +1 to this suggestion.

[Oramac]

Thanks everyone! Sorry I wasn't able to reply before now. I appreciate the feedback, and I figured it probably wasn't RAW, but wanted to see if there was even a glimmer of a way to do it other than "Please Mr. DM let me do it".

[Citan]

Definitely not RAW. If your DM wanted to allow it the only balanced way of doing it would be for you to pick up the different subclasses feature (starting w the first and working up) the next time you would pick up one from your original class. Paladin is probably the worst RP choice for this since you would then have two separate and distinct oaths to follow which could conflict. If a necromancer wizard say wanted to instead pick up the lvl 2 ability of an enchanter instead of the lvl 6 necromancer ability it could reflect him turning away from his oft' frowned upon school. Still far from RAW though.
Thanks!
You just gave me a great idea of a NPC (or maybe PC after all :)) that would join a party, alternating between helping them and betraying them because of a strong mental disorder that gave birth to dual personalities... XD

[CapnZapp]

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?452358-Can-one-multiclass-into-the-same-class
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?486672-Multiclassing-in-the-same-class
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?482358-Multiclassing-into-the-same-class
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?480138-multiclass-within-same-class
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?387596-Can-you-multiclass-within-the-same-class-for-different-archetypes