DND Alcohol Ingredients

[Cybertron2]

So in my campaign I've gotten the idea that I want the PC's to be able to become crime bosses if they want, so I'm creating the minigame of "Bootlegging". Unfortunately, some of the more mythical
DND beverages (listed below) have difficult to find real life counterparts. I have no idea how the multiverse makes firewine (is it a hint of magic?), not how the dwarves get their dwarvern ale to have such a high alcohol content (do they repeatedly distil potatoes or have some secret method). As I'm planning to release it on the DM's guild, I'm actually trying to make the process "somewhat" believable, and the two other, more 'regular' alcohols have taken the cores of real world recipies
Many thanks for all your help
Daniel

[Cybren]

So in my campaign I've gotten the idea that I want the PC's to be able to become crime bosses if they want, so I'm creating the minigame of "Bootlegging". Unfortunately, some of the more mythical
DND beverages (listed below) have difficult to find real life counterparts. I have no idea how the multiverse makes firewine (is it a hint of magic?), not how the dwarves get their dwarvern ale to have such a high alcohol content (do they repeatedly distil potatoes or have some secret method). As I'm planning to release it on the DM's guild, I'm actually trying to make the process "somewhat" believable, and the two other, more 'regular' alcohols have taken the cores of real world recipies
Many thanks for all your help
Daniel

I would guess that fire wine is just wine and dwarven ale is just ale, and they are given fantasy sounding names from the same obnoxious impulse that has poker called "three dragon ante" and chess "dragonchess"

[Knaight]

So in my campaign I've gotten the idea that I want the PC's to be able to become crime bosses if they want, so I'm creating the minigame of "Bootlegging". Unfortunately, some of the more mythical
DND beverages (listed below) have difficult to find real life counterparts. I have no idea how the multiverse makes firewine (is it a hint of magic?), not how the dwarves get their dwarvern ale to have such a high alcohol content (do they repeatedly distil potatoes or have some secret method). As I'm planning to release it on the DM's guild, I'm actually trying to make the process "somewhat" believable, and the two other, more 'regular' alcohols have taken the cores of real world recipies
Many thanks for all your help
Daniel

They aren't particularly defined things, so you have leeway here. For firewine, I'd expect it to basically be a spiced wine; so throw in some appropriate spices and call it a day. As for the dwarven ale, the term "ale" generally denotes something that isn't distilled - if you bring distilling in, you can get to something ridiculous like 196 proof before running into an azeotrope. Absent that, I'd probably go with dwarven ale having a particular yeast strain that has an unusually high alcohol content, and thus pushes it to higher alcohol levels before dying off.

[Reaper34]

So in my campaign I've gotten the idea that I want the PC's to be able to become crime bosses if they want, so I'm creating the minigame of "Bootlegging". Unfortunately, some of the more mythical
DND beverages (listed below) have difficult to find real life counterparts. I have no idea how the multiverse makes firewine (is it a hint of magic?), not how the dwarves get their dwarvern ale to have such a high alcohol content (do they repeatedly distil potatoes or have some secret method). As I'm planning to release it on the DM's guild, I'm actually trying to make the process "somewhat" believable, and the two other, more 'regular' alcohols have taken the cores of real world recipies
Many thanks for all your help
Daniel

You could also make those ingredients mystical. firewire is made form grapes grown on the elemental plane of fire. drow wine is made from spider venom. (thats canon atleast as of 3e.) an idea make exotic drinks just that exotic. regular ones just that regular. top shelf drinks use better regular ingredients with a better process. just a thought.

[kaoskonfety]

I've fairly recently taken up brewing, its fun. But it does take some of the mystique out of this sorta thing.

"Dwarven ale" is typically played up as "strong as hell".
Conventional beer brewing can get you into the 7-9% alcohol by volume if you push it with a more or less absolute cap of 15% before it kills whatever yeast you are using. Given that most beer sits around 4-6% no need to really get too in depth with it: they just make it way stronger then humans because poison tolerance. They may also tolerate more trace poisons that make humans and elves ill and badly hung over giving it its rep (basically they make it strong and/or badly by human standard). If you are going "good but strong", play up the clarity and smoothness of the drink, it goes down easy... and so does the human foolish enough to have more than 2. At the far side of the other end "the dead rat adds flavour" and "Drink the chunky bits they are full for nutrients" - its basically an ingested poison cocktail that happens to contain alcohol.

EDIT - beers/ales and similar are generally made with malted grains and hops. Given the lack of grain underground specifically breed lichens, or fungi (high starch and sugar content) could be used to supplement the process leading to undrinkable poisons or whole new fields for brewing (or both). Beer generally takes 2-6 weeks start to finish

Most of my experience with wine is making the kinda of sweet/flavoured stuff the elven trope covers off. Many of these ingredients are added after fermentation is done as being fermented does weird things to some of the flavours. These can be as exotic and common knowledge (juice from the berries picked from the FireLang bush which give fruit once every 6 years during the summer solstice night - the brewers bid for the right to harvest them in competitions leading up to the date) or mundane but secret (molasses and hot peppers - SHHH! its secret!!!) as pleases you. With literal centuries to try out new things they will have tried basically everything.

Edit: any fruit juice and/or honey blend will make 'wine' - grapes being the modern default/legally required to call it "wine". I'd stick with fruit/berry/honey blends with truly exotic ingredients mostly being added post-fermentation during the aging. Wine ranges from 4-8 weeks to around a year depending on the fine details and how much tampering and aging your finished product needs to settle down to its final state. Elves may have pushed these numbers from a year to a 'few decades' but the longer it ages the more of the batches will go bad from incidental contamination (but you know - magic might help with that)

[Regitnui]

A few can trips immersed in the brewing, or a couple of alchemic ingredients make a difference. I'll tell you what; find the Recipe Crafting for Consumables on the DMsG. That has teas, juices and brews that fill my mind with ideas for the local bar in my campaign.

Clickable (http://www.dmsguild.com/product/171344/Recipe-Crafting-for-Consumables), I hope

[KorvinStarmast]

For the ale, look up how the Trappist Monks make their stronger ales.
See also some of the higher alcohol Belgian brewery output. (Chimay is my brother's favorite).

For Firewine, you could sub in mead (http://www.rohanmeadery.com/), but add in rare and exotic peppers (high Capsaicin (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capsaicin) content) that only grow under certain conditions or in certain locales. This combination would result in a sweet yet spicy flavor -- I've had a number of jalapeño beers over the years.

Scenario: the secret to growing the exotic peppers is confined to certain cultures or peoples. Trade route missions to dangerous places become part of the adventure. Gnollapeños might be one such ingredient. The gnolls protect their trade monopoly with extreme prejudice.

[RulesJD]

I've fairly recently taken up brewing, its fun. But it does take some of the mystique out of this sorta thing.

"Dwarven ale" is typically played up as "strong as hell".
Conventional beer brewing can get you into the 7-9% alcohol by volume if you push it with a more or less absolute cap of 15% before it kills whatever yeast you are using. *snip*

This is absolutely false. http://www.beertutor.com/beers/index.php?t=highest_alcohol

I've tried about a dozen beers on that list. They are, by and large, completely undrinkable. With that said, that is also generally how dwarven ale is described.

Some basic concepts that you can translate to your campaign:

1. Need to use specially designed yeast (http://www.whitelabs.com/yeast/wlp099-super-high-gravity-ale-yeast). Make them go adventure for it or trade for it in some far off kingdom.

2. Fractional Freezing. Basically freezing the beer into a kind of slush and then filtering out the ice. You're essentially just removing water to make for a more concentrated beer. Make them find a suitable cold location, perhaps deep in the ground near an elemental node of Cold, or off in the high mountains where dwarves tend to live anyways.

3. Baby the fermentation. This essentially just involves a lot of effort and careful monitoring of the temperature, etc. Not sure how to have this happen in game, maybe some RP mission to convince a grand brewmaster to come shepherd the process, or even just an apprentice?

4. Hops. Higher ABV beers tend to get that way and end up with a really sweet or medicinal flavor. Hop the hell out of it to make it slightly more palatable. Plus I've always just envisioned dwarven ale as being super hoppy.

[Knaight]

This is absolutely false. http://www.beertutor.com/beers/index.php?t=highest_alcohol

I've tried about a dozen beers on that list. They are, by and large, completely undrinkable. With that said, that is also generally how dwarven ale is described.

Some basic concepts that you can translate to your campaign:

1. Need to use specially designed yeast (http://www.whitelabs.com/yeast/wlp099-super-high-gravity-ale-yeast). Make them go adventure for it or trade for it in some far off kingdom.

2. Fractional Freezing. Basically freezing the beer into a kind of slush and then filtering out the ice. You're essentially just removing water to make for a more concentrated beer. Make them find a suitable cold location, perhaps deep in the ground near an elemental node of Cold, or off in the high mountains where dwarves tend to live anyways.

3. Baby the fermentation. This essentially just involves a lot of effort and careful monitoring of the temperature, etc. Not sure how to have this happen in game, maybe some RP mission to convince a grand brewmaster to come shepherd the process, or even just an apprentice?

4. Hops. Higher ABV beers tend to get that way and end up with a really sweet or medicinal flavor. Hop the hell out of it to make it slightly more palatable. Plus I've always just envisioned dwarven ale as being super hoppy.

Specially designed yeast can push that percentage up, but you're not getting anywhere near those 60+% ABVs with any yeast, barring major advances in genetic engineering that drastically alter yeast function (although in setting magic could probably handle that). It's not getting anywhere past about 24% without bringing in the fractional freezing, and at that point whether it should even be counted as a beer is debatable - you wouldn't count it if it were distilled, and fractional freezing is just a different way to remove water (which does have a pretty different effect on everything other than the water and the ethanol; I'm not saying it does the same thing as distilling). Plus, fractional freezing as a technique relies on controlled refrigeration, which fantasy dwarves probably won't have easy access to.

[JoeJ]

Why wouldn't dwarven ale or elvish wine have as much variety as human ale or wine?

[KorvinStarmast]

Plus, fractional freezing as a technique relies on controlled refrigeration, which fantasy dwarves probably won't have easy access to.Fantasy dwarves have access to fantasy spell casters who have access to spells with cold and ice and snow in them.
Fantasy dwarves tend to live in caves/underground, and near mountains. Many mountains have glaciers or snow caps.

[RulesJD]

Specially designed yeast can push that percentage up, but you're not getting anywhere near those 60+% ABVs with any yeast, barring major advances in genetic engineering that drastically alter yeast function (although in setting magic could probably handle that). It's not getting anywhere past about 24% without bringing in the fractional freezing, and at that point whether it should even be counted as a beer is debatable - you wouldn't count it if it were distilled, and fractional freezing is just a different way to remove water (which does have a pretty different effect on everything other than the water and the ethanol; I'm not saying it does the same thing as distilling). Plus, fractional freezing as a technique relies on controlled refrigeration, which fantasy dwarves probably won't have easy access to.

Just saying that we can hit well above 15% pretty "easily". Throw in some magic and naturally existing sub-zero temps, and you could do a pretty decent job of incorporating the production of "dwarven ale" in a D&D universe. Those 4 different things I listed can all be individual quest. For the Fractional Freezing just have the party have to adventure to the highest peaks where a long forgotten dwarven room, containing a special portal to the Elemental Plane of Cold, can be used to brew the finest dwarven ale in all the land.

Heck, have it be guarded by evil Elven Monks (aka tappist brewers) that must be defeated.

[kaoskonfety]

I suppose my question to anyone quoting (much) higher than 15% is how have you used fermentation to get past that? I can *distill* to 60%+ and labs can get functionally to 100%. But at that point its not a beverage. Its an industrial solvent. And its sure as hell not 'ale' in any conventional sense.

Most strains of yeast die in the 12-14% range. The high tolerance yeast I can get could go to 18% in theory, but I'm not a pro and don't have half degree temp control or lab sterile conditions.

Scale and control wise I have the kind of set up someone in the dark ages would have to make some beer for themselves and their neighbours. With a bit more understanding about sanitation and far more soap. I can do a 16 gallon keg (60 litres) every few weeks (I don't). I'm sharing personal brewing experience and understanding.

Some specially breed/created ones can apparently go to 25% or so, but these are not what most people would use and are probably best emulated in D&D with "magic yeast". The dwarves having this would EASILY cover off your "foolishly strong ale" all on its own.
I'm honestly impressed by that number having now dug a bit and found it. SCIENCE! I'd also assume this stuff is artificially primed. If not, I'm more impressed.

At 7% you are talking some strong beer. I've seen nothing over 9% labeled beer - likely for legislative reasons. The strongest I'd make and still be able to have enough live yeast to prime (get the bubbles in) would likely be 8-10% - I'm not doing the math but that feels right. I've not tested it at this end though, I'd have to be quite careful about my measurements and test frequently. I settle in the 4-6% range and it comes out tasty enough to serve guests and doesn't need me to test it every 3 hours for a full week.

Human used to the 4-6% range will get DEMOLISHED by 15-25%. Dwarves, used to 15-25%, will wonder what the deal is with the humans funny tasting water. "wait... this is your BEER?" (pours it into a potted plant, swears of booze till they get home)

[Knaight]

Some specially breed/created ones can apparently go to 25% or so, but these are not what most people would use and are probably best emulated in D&D with "magic yeast". The dwarves having this would EASILY cover off your "foolishly strong ale" all on its own.
I'm honestly impressed by that number having now dug a bit and found it. SCIENCE! I'd also assume this stuff is artificially primed. If not, I'm more impressed.

That 24% is the highest I knew about, and I'd be astonished if that yeast strain was produced by any technique that didn't involve inserting and removing DNA with primers. So, it might be a bit much for dwarven ale, particularly as most medieval ale was deliberately pretty weak by modern standards, and the precise temperature control and such is probably not there. On the other hand, there's always dire yeast (http://rustyandco.com/comic/critical-missives-12/)...

[RickAllison]

That 24% is the highest I knew about, and I'd be astonished if that yeast strain was produced by any technique that didn't involve inserting and removing DNA with primers. So, it might be a bit much for dwarven ale, particularly as most medieval ale was deliberately pretty weak by modern standards, and the precise temperature control and such is probably not there. On the other hand, there's always dire yeast (http://rustyandco.com/comic/critical-missives-12/)...

Maybe that's why dwarfish wizards and druids seem to be less common, they have joined together to create the fine dwarfish ales that are critical for operation of dwarfish cities.

[RulesJD]

I suppose my question to anyone quoting (much) higher than 15% is how have you used fermentation to get past that? I can *distill* to 60%+ and labs can get functionally to 100%. But at that point its not a beverage. Its an industrial solvent. And its sure as hell not 'ale' in any conventional sense.

Most strains of yeast die in the 12-14% range. The high tolerance yeast I can get could go to 18% in theory, but I'm not a pro and don't have half degree temp control or lab sterile conditions.

Scale and control wise I have the kind of set up someone in the dark ages would have to make some beer for themselves and their neighbours. With a bit more understanding about sanitation and far more soap. I can do a 16 gallon keg (60 litres) every few weeks (I don't). I'm sharing personal brewing experience and understanding.

Some specially breed/created ones can apparently go to 25% or so, but these are not what most people would use and are probably best emulated in D&D with "magic yeast". The dwarves having this would EASILY cover off your "foolishly strong ale" all on its own.
I'm honestly impressed by that number having now dug a bit and found it. SCIENCE! I'd also assume this stuff is artificially primed. If not, I'm more impressed.

At 7% you are talking some strong beer. I've seen nothing over 9% labeled beer - likely for legislative reasons. The strongest I'd make and still be able to have enough live yeast to prime (get the bubbles in) would likely be 8-10% - I'm not doing the math but that feels right. I've not tested it at this end though, I'd have to be quite careful about my measurements and test frequently. I settle in the 4-6% range and it comes out tasty enough to serve guests and doesn't need me to test it every 3 hours for a full week.

Human used to the 4-6% range will get DEMOLISHED by 15-25%. Dwarves, used to 15-25%, will wonder what the deal is with the humans funny tasting water. "wait... this is your BEER?" (pours it into a potted plant, swears of booze till they get home)

Um, the typical West Coast style IPA will easily be in the 9-12% range.

[Sigreid]

I would guess that fire wine is just wine and dwarven ale is just ale, and they are given fantasy sounding names from the same obnoxious impulse that has poker called "three dragon ante" and chess "dragonchess"

I've had fire wine in Portugal. It was literally wine pressings run through a still.

[kaoskonfety]

Um, the typical West Coast style IPA will easily be in the 9-12% range.

"likely for legislative reasons" - west coast of where, the US I assume? I'm in Canada.

There are alot of regional rules about what can and cannot be called beer, wine and mead. Getting into its probably 'politics' so I'm not going into detail. I'm curious how they do it though. I would not mind a couple more reliable percent on my beers if its not crazy technical.

Interestingly the existence of such rules in a fantasy setting might be another layer to the demand of Elven and Dwarven as the human guilds have different rules creating a different, otherwise unattainable product

[Knaight]

There are alot of regional rules about what can and cannot be called beer, wine and mead. Getting into its probably 'politics' so I'm not going into detail. I'm curious how they do it though. I would not mind a couple more reliable percent on my beers if its not crazy technical.

How technical it gets varies - you can get really technical on it, or explain the simple parts. As for how you do it, up to about 14% ABV or so most yeast can pretty well handle the alcohol. You need more brewing time, you want barley with more of the chemicals that get converted to sugars (mostly polysaccharides).

[Joe dirt]

for alcohols from subterranean species such as dwarves, gnomes, dark elves... i would have ingredients that subterranean... like rare mushrooms, and other lichen... and they would not taste good at all for non subterranian species

for surface based races i would have more traditional but i would always keep in mind where your races live and what they live on