Could use help making a Stormlord of Talos type cleric

[Sothron]

I am about to start playing a new campaign set in FR. Group party so far looks like this:

Half orc barbarian
Halfling bard
Elf rogue
Tiefling warlock
Deurgar cleric (that's myself)

We will be starting at 3rd level.

My favorite class in any pen and paper RPG was back when I played the Stormlord of Talos prestige class back in either 3 or 3.5 edition. I know you don't really have prestige classes in 5e but you do have the Tempest domain.

I know gray dwarf is not the best option race wise but I always <3 the deurgar and want to play one. I know taking the tempest domain is a no brainer but this is my first time playing 5e and my first time playing D&D since 3.5. I picked up Pathfinder years ago and never looked back but now my group is wanting to give 5e a shot.

Can you guys make some suggestions on a good build to try and have that feeling of a Stormlord? My character concept is my gray dwarf up close and person with a 2h maul or some other 2h weapon wrecking faces and shouting praise to Talos. Appreciate any help in advance!

[Joe the Rat]

Tempest is going to cover most of your mechanical Stormlord needs - and you don't have to wait until 6th level to do it!

I figure you already have a sense of how to build for general effect, so I'm going to focus more on feel and flavor.

Skills and Backgrounds: Cleric of Talos is your startpoint. So how Stormlord do you want to get? One of the big fluff pieces is that you are semi-secretive, bringing the lord of destruction's devotion to all sorts of places it's not wanted, and generally being a disruptive element. If you are taking this angle, you might look at the Criminal and Charlatan backgrounds as a start point. You are after a bit of Deception and/or Persuasion. The Criminal contact can shift to local supporters of your underground faith. The self-sufficient Outlander has its merits as well.

Weapons and Fighting: You want some javelins. A big part of the stormlord aesthetic is tossing pointy sticks around. Thrown weapons use Strength, so you can keep Dex low and remain effective. Grab some javelins to toss while you're charging in. The damage die should go up with your Expansion trick. One thing you lose here is the ability to make them magical lightning javelins. I'm still working on that one.

You want to be in close typically. Getting hit can be painful to your attackers.

Magic A lot of spells, with a descriptive tweak, will give you some lightning-bolt throwing action (albeit ones that do radiant damage). If you visualize the appearance as divine bolts of lightning rather than flames, sacred flame gives you an at-will, hit anyone damage source that ignores cover, and no penalties for blasting someone while you're eyeballs deep into enemies. Spiritual Weapon lets you hit people with a Bonus action, so you can stab with the might of Talos, and hit someone else with a hammer. Spirit Guardians described as a field of crashing bolts of energy gives you a lovely AoE of death and disruption that travels with you (and you can make your allies safe from, but what's the fun of that?) If you stick to the deep end of the alignment pool, we're talking black bolts of necrotic damage. For something purely fluff and social, Thaumaturgy lets you do a lot of scary as hell supernatural tricks. harmless tremors, booming voice, glowing eyes. You are a walking incarnation of destruction, why not bring the special effects to show it off?

More magic (Multiclassing and Feats) There are some spells on the arcane side of things that would be nice to have, but that requires multiclassing (so you need Charisma at 13). Since you do not get Extra Attack, the scaling cantrips are beneficial. I'm a fan of Booming Blade - it's a spell that requires a melee attack (so you hit with your Strength), and causes thunder damage if they move. Or Lightning Lure (requires save) to drag them to you. Given your "little dwarven legs", this can help bring someone just out of range into reach, and cause damage. Lightning damage, so you can max that out if you feel like it.
I keep saying Charisma, as your go-to option here is Sorcerer - The Stormborn from SCAG can add several "storm" features that blend well with your preferred damage types. Since intimidation (and maybe deception) is part of your schtick, a teritary social focus would be fitting. The risk here is that it makes you MAD as hell (STR/WIS, CON, CHA). Focusing on no-spell attack, no-save selections minimizes the problems here.
As an alternative, look at Druid and see if there's anything that would add to your options - though that may take some fluff-waiving from the DM regarding nonmetal armor.
Barbarian has a lot of stat overlap for your basic build and offers some melee enhancements, but will rely on medium armor (so you need more dex), and you can't cast or concentrate while raging. Thematically on, effectively difficult.

Feat-wise, Magic Initiate can give you a few off-class spell options and avoids multiclassing. With careful selection, you can dump-stat the casting stat for the class, and still be effective. Booming blade, friendship (for advantage on social interaction - including Intimidation), anything utility. If you don't dump entirely, you can try for shocking grasp or lightning lure. There are a handful of 1st level spells that are not reliant on caster stats, and actually useful even with a 1/day casting. When in doubt, try to get Absorb Elements. If you pull from Warlock, Armor of Agathys is 5 cold damage to the first thing foolish enough to hit you (to which you can add your lightning/thunder rebuke as a reaction). Keep in mind that this route delays any other boosts you're after (stat boost, Great Weapon Mastery, Resilience (Con), Elemental Attunement for the handful of monsters that have lightning or thunder resistance.)

[Grod_The_Giant]

Another potential option is the Storm Sorcerer from SCAG. Not quite as hardy, but you get to jet through the air, spawn little thunderbolts whenever you cast a spell, and control the weather-- all at-will. Take Tough and you're basically up to a d8 HD; a level of Tempest Cleric and you can have your heavy armor back. Sorcerer gets better cantrips anyway-- Booming Blade is a definite, the closest thing you'll get to the 3.5 version's lightning spear, and stuff like Thunderclap, Lightning Lure, Gust, and Shocking Grasp complete the flavor. Run in, Booming Blade, strike everyone with lightning and use your bonus action to jet out of reach without provoking.

(And, you know, you can pick more good wind/lightning spells as you level up-- Thunderwave, Dust Devil, Lightning Bolt, Storm Sphere, that sort of thing-- with no refluffing required.

[Sothron]

Thank you guys for the suggestions. :)

To respond to some of the ideas presented I feel like I have to point out that I am the only healer in the party so I need to stay cleric as much as possible in terms of leveling. Would a one level dip in Sorc for that Storm Sorc be sufficient for the Booming Blade? I want to get up close with a 2h weapon and add lightning attacks to my melee attacks if possible as I remember that was a blast (no pun intended) on my old PrC Stormlord class.

[Grod_The_Giant]

Thank you guys for the suggestions. :)

To respond to some of the ideas presented I feel like I have to point out that I am the only healer in the party so I need to stay cleric as much as possible in terms of leveling. Would a one level dip in Sorc for that Storm Sorc be sufficient for the Booming Blade? I want to get up close with a 2h weapon and add lightning attacks to my melee attacks if possible as I remember that was a blast (no pun intended) on my old PrC Stormlord class.
A one level dip would work, yeah-- or the Magical Initiate feat, depending on which you feel you can spare more.

[djreynolds]

Another potential option is the Storm Sorcerer from SCAG. Not quite as hardy, but you get to jet through the air, spawn little thunderbolts whenever you cast a spell, and control the weather-- all at-will. Take Tough and you're basically up to a d8 HD; a level of Tempest Cleric and you can have your heavy armor back. Sorcerer gets better cantrips anyway-- Booming Blade is a definite, the closest thing you'll get to the 3.5 version's lightning spear, and stuff like Thunderclap, Lightning Lure, Gust, and Shocking Grasp complete the flavor. Run in, Booming Blade, strike everyone with lightning and use your bonus action to jet out of reach without provoking.

(And, you know, you can pick more good wind/lightning spells as you level up-- Thunderwave, Dust Devil, Lightning Bolt, Storm Sphere, that sort of thing-- with no refluffing required.

Excellent suggestion


Thank you guys for the suggestions. :)

To respond to some of the ideas presented I feel like I have to point out that I am the only healer in the party so I need to stay cleric as much as possible in terms of leveling. Would a one level dip in Sorc for that Storm Sorc be sufficient for the Booming Blade? I want to get up close with a 2h weapon and add lightning attacks to my melee attacks if possible as I remember that was a blast (no pun intended) on my old PrC Stormlord class.

Sorcerer spell slots can be used for healing, so as long as the class is a full caster you have slots to heal with. And you get the shield spell. +5 AC every time. And your class should affect or effect those lightning based sorcerer spells such as chain lightning, yes? Unsure actually. But that should be your signature spell. And if not storm sorcerer, dragon sorcerer, the blue type.

Now that I'm thinking on it, perhaps begin as sorcerer, get con and chr saves and then just add tempest cleric to this. Access to the darkness spell will help when sunlight becomes an issue.

Either sorcerer is a very flavorful addition. But chain lightning will cost you sorcerer levels, I think 12.

Why tempest cleric does not get chain lightning I will never know. PLEASE post your build is sounds very cool and stylish. Especially the dark dwarf.

[Theodoxus]

I'd do the cleric dip... unless you need the more exotic healing with lesser restoration and mass healing word - a one level dip will get you all the pure healing you'll need with Cure Wounds and Healing Word. And unless you need healing at 1st level (hint, you more than likely won't) - go sorc first for the Con proficiency, grab Tempest at 2nd and then pure storm sorcerer all the way. It does require at least a 13 in both Wis and Cha, so depending on rolled or PB, might be an issue, but if you can pull it off, I'll certainly have the feel of a Stormlord you're looking for.

@DJ, Chain Lightning is 6th level, and domain spells only go to 5 - so there's that...

[djreynolds]

@DJ, Chain Lightning is 6th level, and domain spells only go to 5 - so there's that...

That is just sad, its the one spell they should have. It just fits.

Agreed, sorcerer will give more.

I feel a prestige class of tempest cleric/storm sorcerer coming on. In this instance that would be cool, very cool.

Who's flight is more powerful, the tempest clerics, the tempest cleric with addition of storm sorcerer, or the dragon sorcerer?

That was great 3.5E PrC, the storm lord of talos

[Grod_The_Giant]

Storm Sorcerer-- he gets a bit at 1st, and then at 18th gets what's by far the fastest fly speed, plus the ability to share it with the rest of the party.

[MrStabby]

If you are ok with unearthed arcana then consider favoured soul with the tempest domain.

If you are playing at higher levels then consider a Valor bard (ok, less ideal than favoured soul but ok).

Valor bard may seem odd but a couple of things...

1) Full caster but with a more powerful combat presence
2) You get a lot of cleric spells on the bard list
3) Magical secrets will get you some good signature lightening spells, but you may have to wait if you are starting at low levels.


If your table is open to small amounts of homebrew/tweaking then there are some other things that might interest you.

At my table we allow paladins to be warriors of their gods and swap their oath spells out for cleric domain spells. A paladin smiting hard backed up by a bunch of lightening spells might give you some of the feel you want?

If you are happy with multiclass you could combine a couple of these - storm sorcerer+paladin for armoured, smiting, casting goodness.

[Sothron]

I went with a one level dip in storm Sorc with two levels in cleric with tempest domain. My 27 point buy allotment with racials got me this:

13 char 15 wis 16 str 14 con 8 int 8 dex


Not the most ideal of stats but you need at least 13 Cha for the dip in sorc. DM agreed to let me modify the duergar racial attributes to change superior darkvision to regular darkvision which negates the sunlight sensitivity as my deurgar has lived above ground long enough to adjust to the sunlight.

I am undecided if I should invest in any more levels on sorc beyond the first. I know you get some really great storm based powers later on but that comes at such a cost to the cleric levels. As the only healer in my group I am not sure I can afford it. I am definitely using the Booming Blade on my 2h melee attacks.

[Lollerabe]

A bit late to the party here but there seems to be some misinformation being spread.
You are never gonna be able to run in and booming blade things and then leap through the air/strike everything with lightning. Both tempestuous magic and heart of the storm (the two storm sorcery features allowing this) only trigger of 1st lvl spells or higher.

As far as I can see the only thing a lvl 1 sorc dip did for you was adding some thematic cantrips but at a very steep price (13 cha) well not the only thing, but the only one you actually wanted.

The storm sorc makes for some awesome lightning themed gishes (planning a blue dragonborn fighter/storm sorc myself swinging a maul/great axe and bringing the pain) but they don't do much for a tempest cleric unless you are going tempest cleric 1/ storm sorc x.

In short I personally would have told you to go straight tempest and maybe grab magic initiate for flavor spells

[Sothron]

It is interesting you said that because as I was building the character and looking at spell lists it really struck me that the storm sorc is far more closer to the old Stormlord PrC than the tempest cleric. Going one level dip for the cleric and then all storm sorc is probably a better idea overall.

Unfortunately for me I am the only healer in the group so I need more cleric levels.

[Lollerabe]

Yeah fighter 1/storm sorc x might emulate what you are going for better. Heavy armor, martial weapons, fight style and no need for the wisdom.

Keep in mind that healing isn't as nessecary as in older editions, just having healing word can take you far. Besides the bard can pick up aura of vitality (awesome healing) and he has healing word as well.

Play the char you want dude, healing is overrated ! :)

[Theodoxus]

Unfortunately for me I am the only healer in the group so I need more cleric levels.

What healing spells, exactly? Status effect removal? Lesser Restoration will work for most things. In fact, I'd swap your Wis and Chr scores. Your Charisma will do a lot more heavy lifting than your Wisdom. Go 3 levels in Cleric (4 max, for an ASI) and the rest in Sorcerer - you'll get the slots for your healing... and remember, HP healing is the worst thing you can do, in or out of combat, unless someone has actually fallen unconscious (and then you just Healing Word bonus action them back and cast Booming Blade on the baddie anyway). You're a priest of Talos - make the party spend their own resources on hit dice healing instead of begging you to top them off between fights...

[Sothron]

What healing spells, exactly? Status effect removal? Lesser Restoration will work for most things. In fact, I'd swap your Wis and Chr scores. Your Charisma will do a lot more heavy lifting than your Wisdom. Go 3 levels in Cleric (4 max, for an ASI) and the rest in Sorcerer - you'll get the slots for your healing... and remember, HP healing is the worst thing you can do, in or out of combat, unless someone has actually fallen unconscious (and then you just Healing Word bonus action them back and cast Booming Blade on the baddie anyway). You're a priest of Talos - make the party spend their own resources on hit dice healing instead of begging you to top them off between fights...

Yes, I'm assuming 5e works like Pathfinder/3.5 where parties need a healer for status removal and not straight heals since a CLW can take care of out of combat healing.

If status removal in 5e isn't as big of a party concern like it is in Pathfinder/3.5 then I would frankly go a completely different direction to try and get the martial Stormlord feel I want.

[MrStabby]

You basically have to decide what type of cleric you are playing.

If one of your party gets hurt, do you tell them to stop being such a ***** and man-up or do go and play nanny to them. Play the character you feel most closely matches the teachings of Talos.

[Sothron]

You basically have to decide what type of cleric you are playing.

If one of your party gets hurt, do you tell them to stop being such a ***** and man-up or do go and play nanny to them. Play the character you feel most closely matches the teachings of Talos.

He's definitely the "go take a salt tablet" as a King of the Hill reference in his mindset when it comes to injuries.

[Theodoxus]

Yes, I'm assuming 5e works like Pathfinder/3.5 where parties need a healer for status removal and not straight heals since a CLW can take care of out of combat healing.

If status removal in 5e isn't as big of a party concern like it is in Pathfinder/3.5 then I would frankly go a completely different direction to try and get the martial Stormlord feel I want.

From my experience, status effects in 5E aren't as debilitating as in 3.P Most of them are on a save per round basis - even things like Blindness/Deafness grant saves every round and are concentration to boot. I'm playing a cleric in a Out of the Abyss game, and I'm mostly just one for the Lesser Restoration to counter the madness effects we encounter.

So, yeah, healing is less important, status effects are more minor... I wouldn't discount grabbing a level of cleric regardless - the level 1 abilities of tempest (specifically the armor and weapon profs) are a huge boon to a melee competent Storm sorc - and as you're already 2 levels in, might as well go for 3 for 2nd level spells, like Spiritual Weapon and Lesser Restoration - and then decide if you need the extra ASI at 4th or not... The nice thing is, the spell slots stack per the multiclass rules, so while you miss out on actual spell levels, you don't lose out on slots (and higher level slots) by multiclassing.