Shield Charge + Pounce + Improved Trip

[leobahmed]

Hey guys,

I want to start a new character for a new quest and I would like to build a charger/shield basher tanker.
The thing is I would like to combo Shield Charge (If you make a charge attack with your shield you get the chance to trip the enemy) + Pounce (you get the chance to do a full attack round if you hit an enemy in a charge attack) and Improved Trip. Since I hit the charge I would get the trip the enemy using Improved Trip.

Is it a good combo? Does it actually work?

Thanks for your help guys!

[Darrin]

Since I hit the charge I would get the trip the enemy using Improved Trip.

Is it a good combo? Does it actually work?


Yes, it works. You can combine this with Pounce, although you only get the trip if you actually hit with your shield. If you get a full attack as part of Pounce and all your shield bashes miss, then you don't get a trip attack.

There is a slight quibble in that the rules for shields only specify that you can make offhand attacks with a shield bash. The rules never explicitly say you can attack with a shield as a primary weapon. However, I imagine most DM's don't stick to the absolute letter of the rules on this.

Ideally, you want to add Shield Slam for the Fort save vs. dazed for 1 round. Dazed is a powerful condition, and very few things are immune to it.

Some other thoughts:

You can get Improved Trip without Int 13 and Combat Expertise by taking a Barbarian 2 dip for Wolf Totem (Unearthed Arcana). You can also pick up Spirit Lion Totem (Complete Champion) for Pounce along the way. Swapping rage for Whirling Frenzy is also pretty nifty (Unearthed Arcana).

Likewise, Knock-Down (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/divine/divineAbilitiesFeats.htm#knockDown) is always fun to put into a Tripper build, but there's the headache of whether the Sword & Fist errata should be enforced (my recommendation: don't, but check with your DM). The boards were arguing about this a few weeks ago, but hopefully I can nutshell it: in 3.0, Knock-Down doesn't work with Improved Trip because of errata. When the Divine section of the SRD was published in the 3.5 era, the errata was not included. We don't know if this was deliberate or an oversight. Some DM's lose their sh*t when melee meatbags get a free attack and don't respond very well to this, but in the grand scheme of things it's not that overpowered unless your player group is unfamiliar with any degree of Character Optimization. Bottom line: ask your DM to clarify how he/she feels about this feat.

As with any charge-based build, Leap Attack and Shock Trooper are generally recommended. A heavy shield counts as a one-handed weapon, and thus can be gripped two-handed for Power Attack multipliers. Travel Devotion allows you to back up and make multiple charges (swift action to back up, full round to charge, rinse & repeat for 10 rounds).

What books are available? Do you have a particular goal in mind for this build?

[leobahmed]

Thanks for your post Darrin, it was very helpful!

My build is based on the Smitedin by Jaronk (I can't post links yet! :smallfrown:) But I found it on the brilliantgameologists forum with the name of Optimized Shield Use.

The main differences are I don't plan taking Improved Bull Rush cause I think it's useless for this build and I want to add Knock-down. It will help when I am in situations I can't charge. I already checked with the DM and it's fine to take it.

I will go Lion Totem Barbarian Lv.1 and then Wolf Totem Barbarian Lv.2 so I can get Pounce + Improved Trip. It fits in my character history causa he was adopted by a new tribe.

The build also suggests going for the Shield only as a weapon but I will maybe consider taking Agile Shield Fighter feat and play it as a TWF. The only thing is I am not completely sold which way I should go.

The last thing I was trying to do but don't know exacly how yet is to add some AoOs Feats. I was thining about Combat Reflexes and Robilars Gambit but I don't know if it's the best way to go as well.

It's my first time building a Shield Basher/Charger/Tripper so I am kinda lost.

[Ellowryn]

Robilars Gambit is always solid on a tripper as while you explicitly do not interrupt the first attack if your subsequent attack + trip is successful you could prevent more (or they provoke even more AoO's).

Unless you can get a decent source of extra damage i would recommend against TWF (shields or otherwise). You are better off just wielding the shield in two hands and power attacking for obscene amounts.

[leobahmed]

Robilars Gambit is always solid on a tripper as while you explicitly do not interrupt the first attack if your subsequent attack + trip is successful you could prevent more (or they provoke even more AoO's).

Unless you can get a decent source of extra damage i would recommend against TWF (shields or otherwise). You are better off just wielding the shield in two hands and power attacking for obscene amounts.

Thanks for you help Ellowryn.
I might need to show to my DM I can use the shield with 2 Hands. Do you know where I find it? :smallconfused:

[Ellowryn]

Thanks for you help Ellowryn.
I might need to show to my DM I can use the shield with 2 Hands. Do you know where I find it? :smallconfused:

In the PHB (pg 116), its listed as a 1 Handed Martial Weapon. Which means you can wield it in two hands for 1.5 times Str and power attack.