[3.5] Muscle Caster

[Thurbane]

So, assuming you were allowed to have the Lost Tradition (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=10203238&postcount=2) feat, and you keyed your casting off Strength...what would your build be.

Let's rule out (near) infinite loops (i.e. Festering Anger etc.).

How would you pump your Strength, preferably on a LA +0 build?

Cheers - T

[Bobby Baratheon]

It is a LA1, but Lolth-touched template gives you +6 strength and +6 constitution and fear immunity. It does make you chaotic evil, but hey. Power at a price :smallwink: With buyoff, that's pretty amazing. Without buyoff, it's somewhat defensible but definitely suboptimal.

[Psyren]

Cerebremancer + Midnight Augmentation(+ Earth Power/Torc/etc) + Expanded Knowledge (Strength of my Enemy). Then I play patty-cake with the strongest thing i can immobilize that isn't immune to ability damage - say, a Great Wyrm dragon I've subdued with Shivering Touch. How strong do you want to be?

I'd throw in Astral Seed and Fusion, but you said no loops, so... :smalltongue:

As for race, I guess Gnome just for the looks I'd get.

[Ellowryn]

Orc Half-Iron Golem Dustform Incarnate Construct. +20 Str, no LA. Veeeery slight chance of going insane.

[Troacctid]

I'd just be a Druid. They have this nifty little ability called "wild shape."

[Thurbane]

I'd just be a Druid. They have this nifty little ability called "wild shape."

If you're only get the Str boost when in other shapes, would it count towards bonus spells/day?

[Troacctid]

If you're only get the Str boost when in other shapes, would it count towards bonus spells/day?

I'd be in the high-STR form all day long to benefit from the higher save DCs, so, yes.

[Thurbane]

I'd be in the high-STR form all day long to benefit from the higher save DCs, so, yes.

OK...I've never played a 3.X druid, so I assumed the forms were for limited duration.

[Troacctid]

Well, the duration is 1 hour/level, so at 6th level you can stay wild-shaped for 12 hours, which is plenty long enough to last all day.

If you're not a Druid, you can take Sentinel of Bharrai levels to turn into a bear for a similar effect.

[eggynack]

OK...I've never played a 3.X druid, so I assumed the forms were for limited duration.
They are, but said duration starts at five hours a day, hits twelve hours at six, reaches 21 hours at seven, and by level eight you can spend 24 hours a day in a different form.

[Thurbane]

Well, the duration is 1 hour/level, so at 6th level you can stay wild-shaped for 12 hours, which is plenty long enough to last all day.

If you're not a Druid, you can take Sentinel of Bharrai levels to turn into a bear for a similar effect.

So..if it less that 24 hours, wouldn't it count as "temporary ability increase" which, AFAIK, doesn't add to spells known?

Or am I running on a mistaken assumption?

[eggynack]

So..if it less that 24 hours, wouldn't it count as "temporary ability increase" which, AFAIK, doesn't add to spells known?

Is that a rule? It'd clear up a lot of weirdness if it were one, but I don't think it is.

[Thurbane]

Is that a rule? It'd clear up a lot of weirdness if it were one, but I don't think it is.

Maybe I was applying the specific exception under Owl's Wisdom as a general rule?

FWIW, the FAQ seems to back up that anything other than the booster spells does add to bonus spells:


Do ability enhancing items (such as the headband of intellect, cloak of charisma, and periapt of wisdom) grantbonus spells to the appropriate spellcasters? The spells these items are based on would seem to prohibit it, but the only things specifically addressed in the item descriptions are skill points.
Yes, you can get extra bonus spells if you have an item that increases the ability score that governs your spellcasting. To get the extra bonus spells, you must wear the item while resting to regain spells and all through your initial daily preparations for spellcasting. (Even characters who don’t prepare spells need to meditate a little while at the beginning of the day; see Daily Readying of spells under the Sorcerers and bards section of Chapter 10 in the PH.)
If you lose the item, you immediately lose the bonus spell slots the item gave you, starting with any uncast spells you have of the appropriate levels.

[eggynack]

Maybe I was applying the specific exception under Owl's Wisdom as a general rule?
Plausible. And, notably, said exception is not present in, say, bull's strength. It's one of those weird things such a rule would clear up

[Eloel]

Maybe I was applying the specific exception under Owl's Wisdom as a general rule?

FWIW, the FAQ seems to back up that anything other than the booster spells does add to bonus spells:

This does mean you need 9th level, to get your sleep and prepare spells within a single wildshape.

[ben-zayb]

Wu Jen for persistent Giant Size and Shapechange, though like a Druid's Wild Shape you'll have to strike a balance between spells/day and flexibility that shapeshifting provides. You could also crib Bite of the Werebear from Wyrm Wizard. Alternative is to go Wizard and crib Giant Size instead.

[Inevitability]

Orc Half-Iron Golem Dustform Incarnate Construct. +20 Str, no LA. Veeeery slight chance of going insane.

Water orc is better than regular orc, even without the constitution bonus.