Bloodline Skillpoints

[ATHATH]

If I am a Human with the Able Learner feat, do I gain one skill point per level from Bloodline levels?

[Necroticplague]

If I am a Human with the Able Learner feat, do I gain one skill point per level from Bloodline levels?

No. Bloodline levels don't give HD, and by extension, no skills either. They do increase you're max skill levels, though.

[Ruethgar]

If I am a Human with the Able Learner feat, do I gain one skill point per level from Bloodline levels?

Yes you do. Human grants skill points based on level and Bloodline levels count toward that end.

[Andorn]

Bloodline level RAW explicitly says they don't give skill points. They are more ranks than actual levels, where you pay XP for a string of abilities/bonuses that you gain with actual levels.

Actually, they are somewhat similar to the prestige races from Oathbound and Dragon #304, page 47. You pay XP flat out to gain abilities, it's pretty cool, but a bit pricey. The stuff in Dragon is open content. There are a lot more in the Oathbound campaign books.

[Ruethgar]

The level itself doesn't grant skill points, the racial feature is doing that. So a Human, Bloodline 3/Fighter 1 with 10 Int has 15 skill points with a cap of 7.

[Necroticplague]

Re-reading the exact wording of the humans skill point, I have to change my stance to agreeing with Reuthgar. The bloodline level does increase your character level, which Human makes cough up a skill point.

[Ruethgar]

Except bloodlines don't increase character level, but do increase level which is what the Human skill trait(and Nymph Kissed) care about.

[ATHATH]

Is there any ability that gives you skill points before you choose the next class that you will take upon leveling up, but after the skill cap is raised due to your increased level? I'm trying to get into Chameleon at level 2.

[T.G. Oskar]

Think of Bloodline levels as "special LA", where you get no HD or actual level, cannot be bought-off, but does grant some minor benefits which include increasing the value of certain class features that increase by class level.

This presents a predicament - first, anything based on racial HD, as it's not a class level, doesn't increase - that includes, for example, the Githyanki/Githzerai access to Plane Shift. As you may imagine, gaining skill points is a factor of character level, albeit modified by your current class - if you get one racial HD, you still get skill points, except they are defined by your race, and not by your class levels. Therefore, because skill points increase based on your character level (but modified by your class or race, which determines the actual amount), Bloodline levels don't increase skill points - both specifically (specific trumps general, remember?), and through understanding of the mechanic itself. Being Human doesn't change that. Having Nymph's Kiss doesn't change that either.

[Extra Anchovies]

If I am a Human with the Able Learner feat, do I gain one skill point per level from Bloodline levels?

No, and I don't see how you'd think it could. Able Learner doesn't increase how many skill points you have. It adjusts the skill point costs for skill rank increases.

Also, bloodline levels don't have a base number of skill points per level to increase - they don't give zero skill points each, they give Ø skill points per level. Adding a number to Ø doesn't change it from Ø; putting a headband of intellect on an iron golem has no effect, and the same goes for applying a [skill points per level]-increasing effect to a bloodline level.

Bloodline levels do increase the maximum skill ranks per skill, though, so you could retrain previously allocated skill points to meet the higher cap.

[Ruethgar]

Think of Bloodline levels as "special LA", where you get no HD or actual level, cannot be bought-off, but does grant some minor benefits which include increasing the value of certain class features that increase by class level.

This presents a predicament - first, anything based on racial HD, as it's not a class level, doesn't increase - that includes, for example, the Githyanki/Githzerai access to Plane Shift. As you may imagine, gaining skill points is a factor of character level, albeit modified by your current class - if you get one racial HD, you still get skill points, except they are defined by your race, and not by your class levels. Therefore, because skill points increase based on your character level (but modified by your class or race, which determines the actual amount), Bloodline levels don't increase skill points - both specifically (specific trumps general, remember?), and through understanding of the mechanic itself. Being Human doesn't change that. Having Nymph's Kiss doesn't change that either.

Except you do gain an actual level, just not ECL. And neither Humans nor Nymph Kissed increase class skill points, they simply grant extra dependent upon level(not character level), which would include racial classes, template classes, and bloodline levels no mater their interaction with your character level. The Bloodline itself isn't granting any skills, your race is.


No, and I don't see how you'd think it could. Able Learner doesn't increase how many skill points you have. It adjusts the skill point costs for skill rank increases.

Also, bloodline levels don't have a base number of skill points per level to increase - they don't give zero skill points each, they give Ø skill points per level. Adding a number to Ø doesn't change it from Ø; putting a headband of intellect on an iron golem has no effect, and the same goes for applying a [skill points per level]-increasing effect to a bloodline level.

Bloodline levels do increase the maximum skill ranks per skill, though, so you could retrain previously allocated skill points to meet the higher cap.

If Human increased class skill points rather than simply granting extra based on level, you would be correct, Ø+1=Ø.