Price for selling animated objects?

[magicalmagicman]

Thanks to dweomerkeeper PrC I can make animated objects with 0 cost. So I want to start up a business!

How would you price them?

I'm crafting them by spamming wall of stones, animating them with a Ravid's Su ability either through shapechange or lesser planar binding, and using permanency via Supernatural Spell (Dweomerkeeper) + Limited Wish.

Would NPC spellcasting price for all those spells involved be a good price? Or is it that price divided by 2 since the former would be the "market price"? Or is there a better way to price them?

On a similar note, how about Stone Golems created via Polymorph any Object and controlled with Rod of Construct Control? How much would they cost?

[Necroticplague]

Using the slavery rules in Lords of Madness.

[ace rooster]

Well, rules exist for selling loot, and you did not loot these. You are going to have to negotiate with NPCs for this, so the price is highly situational.

Additionally, animated objects are mindless, and there is no way to give them commands after creation. They can be used like poorly trained wild animals, but that is about it. They are useless as a defense except somewhere like a sewer, and even then only if it never needs maintenance. Good for sealed tombs, but this is a pretty limited market. Most tombs will be family tombs, so later access will be required.

As an NPC, I would say these are more hassle than they are worth, unless I was really desperate. We are talking "buying the rabid dire wallabies" type desperate. Most would pay more for the walls of stone!


As for the stone golems, how good is your bluff check? :smalltongue:

[magicalmagicman]

Well, rules exist for selling loot, and you did not loot these. You are going to have to negotiate with NPCs for this, so the price is highly situational.

Additionally, animated objects are mindless, and there is no way to give them commands after creation. They can be used like poorly trained wild animals, but that is about it. They are useless as a defense except somewhere like a sewer, and even then only if it never needs maintenance. Good for sealed tombs, but this is a pretty limited market. Most tombs will be family tombs, so later access will be required.

As an NPC, I would say these are more hassle than they are worth, unless I was really desperate. We are talking "buying the rabid dire wallabies" type desperate. Most would pay more for the walls of stone!


As for the stone golems, how good is your bluff check? :smalltongue:

Standard construct rules is that even mindless constructs can follow simple instructions, and their control can be given to others. As a high strength soldier/worker, it can assist in construction (lifting heavy stuff like a crane), simple bodyguard that never needs food, water, or daily payments, it can be used to perform a repetitive task endlessly forever, etc. Ways to use them are endless.

[ace rooster]

Standard construct rules is that even mindless constructs can follow simple instructions, and their control can be given to others. As a high strength soldier/worker, it can assist in construction (lifting heavy stuff like a crane), simple bodyguard that never needs food, water, or daily payments, it can be used to perform a repetitive task endlessly forever, etc. Ways to use them are endless.

Can I get a source on that? Even if those are standard construct rules, they are trumped by the rules for animate object, which explicitly state how control works for the constructs it creates. There is no provision for delegating control or providing non attack orders.

[magicalmagicman]

Can I get a source on that? Even if those are standard construct rules, they are trumped by the rules for animate object, which explicitly state how control works for the constructs it creates. There is no provision for delegating control or providing non attack orders.

It's more like lack of rules for animated object.

Animated Objects:


Animated objects fight only as directed by the animator. They follow orders without question and to the best of their abilities. Since they do not need to breathe and never tire, they can be extremely capable minions.

Golems


Golems are tenacious in combat and prodigiously strong as well. Being mindless, they do nothing without orders from their creators. They follow instructions explicitly and are incapable of any strategy or tactics. They are emotionless in combat and cannot be provoked.

A golem’s creator can command it if the golem is within 60 feet and can see and hear its creator. If uncommanded, a golem usually follows its last instruction to the best of its ability, though if attacked it returns the attack. The creator can give the golem a simple command to govern its actions in his or her absence. The golem’s creator can order the golem to obey the commands of another person (who might in turn place the golem under someone else’s control, and so on), but the golem’s creator can always resume control over his creation by commanding the golem to obey him alone.

If mindless golems can be commanded to follow another person's orders, i can't see why you can't do the same to animated objects. They are both mindless, follow their master's blindly to the letter forever, etc.

[ace rooster]

It's more like lack of rules for animated object.

Not quite, the caster can designate new targets with a move action (by redirecting the spell that created them). This implies that they cannot simply order it to "attack who I say", and then use speech to direct it (a free action).



If mindless golems can be commanded to follow another person's orders, i can't see why you can't do the same to animated objects. They are both mindless, follow their master's blindly to the letter forever, etc.

No, doesn't follow. Explicit rules for constructs created over time as versatile servants cannot be assumed for constructs created in 4 seconds. If anything, the existence of rules to say that golems can be controlled in this way implies that in general mindless creatures cannot without specialist magic. Two other points of reference are skeletons,



Skeletons are the animated bones of the dead, mindless automatons that obey the orders of their evil masters.

and zombies,


Because of their utter lack of intelligence, the instructions given to a newly created zombie must be very simple.

which both include semi-explicit provision for control. The only other spell that I know of that creates a mindless creature is Giant Vermin, which includes


Any giant vermin created by this spell do not attempt to harm you, but your control of such creatures is limited to simple commands (“Attack,” “Defend,” “Stop,” and so forth). Orders to attack a certain creature when it appears or guard against a particular occurrence are too complex for the vermin to understand. Unless commanded to do otherwise, the giant vermin attack whoever or whatever is near them.


Lack of any implication for more extensive control is enough to assume that more extensive control does not exist, as every other similar situation does explicitly provide it.

[magicalmagicman]

Oh, I see what you're saying. I've overlooked the actual animate object spell. You're right, I'm wrong. Oh well, my business ended before I even began...

Well at least PaO Stone Golems is still a viability. Simulacrums too!

[ace rooster]

Oh, I see what you're saying. I've overlooked the actual animate object spell. You're right, I'm wrong. Oh well, my business ended before I even began...

Well at least PaO Stone Golems is still a viability. Simulacrums too!

Well at least now you don't have to run from angry NPCs yelling "Your 'guard' ate my mother!" :smalltongue:

Don't forget the stone to flesh zombie hydras. Good market for them too.

Actual price is up to the DM though, and depends hugely on setting. They may turn you down to avoid upsetting the mercenary guild for example. The loot thing is important, because it basically implies that you can only assume that you can sell something if the DM gave it to you. It is a surprisingly effective piece of design.