New Fighting Style - Daisho

[quinron]

Quick little brew: a new fighting style, probably for Fighters and Paladins only.

DAISHO
While wielding two melee weapons whose damage dice differ (for example, a shortsword and a dagger or a longsword and a shortsword), you gain a +1 bonus to AC.

Is it too powerful? I know AC is a premium commodity. It would make sense thematically if you only got the bonus on turns where you didn't use the offhand weapon to attack - would that be better?

[PoeticDwarf]

Quick little brew: a new fighting style, probably for Fighters and Paladins only.

DAISHO
While wielding two melee weapons whose damage dice differ (for example, a shortsword and a dagger or a longsword and a shortsword), you gain a +1 bonus to AC.

Is it too powerful? I know AC is a premium commodity. It would make sense thematically if you only got the bonus on turns where you didn't use the offhand weapon to attack - would that be better?

Fighters and paladins? Those wear armor 90%+ encounters

So defense is better and then you can get 2d6 weapons

Do something as. +10ft when one hand is empty or when damage die is different

Idk

[Foxhound438]

Seems far from stellar. You need 2wfs to have decent damage to start, you need the tw feat to be able to use longsword and shortsword, and at that point you're losing damage for the same 1 AC that you could have gotten from defense FS.

[TheTeaMustFlow]

Very weak. Strictly inferior to defence, still inferior to two-weapon fighting. I might - might - take this as a third fighting style, but never before.

[quinron]

Good points all - I hadn't considered Defense at all when I made this. Would increasing the AC bonus to +2 balance it out, or would that be a step in the other direction? It would invalidate shields, but unless you have Dual Wielder you'll still have to wield weapons weaker than you could with a shield.

Or is there just a better way in general to go here than giving an AC bonus?

[RakiReborn]

how about something to do with your reaction? Since this needs a lower damage output to work, that might be nice. I am thinking of something like 'if you ........, when you are missed by a melee weapon attack within 5ft of you, you may use your reaction to make one weapon attack with your main weapon'.

[quinron]

how about something to do with your reaction? Since this needs a lower damage output to work, that might be nice. I am thinking of something like 'if you ........, when you are missed by a melee weapon attack within 5ft of you, you may use your reaction to make one weapon attack with your main weapon'.

Thank you - I should've thought of this myself when I came up with this! Since the offhand weapon is usually defensive, I've been thinking in terms of AC, but in real life (at least in terms of nitojutsu) the philosophy is less "block attacks" and more "parry and counterattack." So, updating with your suggestion:

DAISHO
While wielding two melee weapons whose damage dice differ (for example, a shortsword and a dagger or a longsword and a shortsword), you can use your reaction to make an attack against any creature within 5 feet of you that misses you with a melee attack.

Better? More useful? It kind of steps on the toes of the Battlemaster's Riposte maneuver; I suppose you could always just take Daisho and not take Riposte if you went Battlemaster.

[Foxhound438]

Thank you - I should've thought of this myself when I came up with this! Since the offhand weapon is usually defensive, I've been thinking in terms of AC, but in real life (at least in terms of nitojutsu) the philosophy is less "block attacks" and more "parry and counterattack." So, updating with your suggestion:

DAISHO
While wielding two melee weapons whose damage dice differ (for example, a shortsword and a dagger or a longsword and a shortsword), you can use your reaction to make an attack against any creature within 5 feet of you that misses you with a melee attack.

Better? More useful? It kind of steps on the toes of the Battlemaster's Riposte maneuver; I suppose you could always just take Daisho and not take Riposte if you went Battlemaster.

much better.

[RakiReborn]

It is less powerful than riposte per hit, which is good (no superiority die in extra damage). If it is too powerful this way (as there is no use restriction), you can tone it down to once per short or long rest, although that is not usually done with fighting styles.

[JacobTheAussie]

Question... How would you see this in combination with the 'Duel Wielder' feat

[PoeticDwarf]

With the change is seems good. Makes TWF interesting and balanced with normal TWF feat I'd say.

[quinron]

Question... How would you see this in combination with the 'Duel Wielder' feat

It's meant to work well with it, as well as with Two Weapon Fighting if you have the option to take both styles. The combination of having one weaker weapon and having to be missed by a melee attack to use the AoO keeps things pretty balanced, considering you're meant to balance monsters with the assumption that every attack they make hits.

Assuming Str 20, one Attack and one bonus action per round (because Extra Attack won't affect the balance here), and the strongest possible weapons:
TWF style + DW: 19 damage - 2*(1d8+5)
Daisho + DW: 22 damage - 2*(1d8+5)+1d6, or 13 damage without AoO - 1d8+5+1d6

[Zman]

You could allow one dual wielded weapon to not be light so long as they have different damage dice, i.e. d8 Longsword/Rapier and d6 Shortsword. Also if a Mainhand attack hits and the bonus action attack hits roll the damage dice of the offhand attack twice.

[quinron]

You could allow one dual wielded weapon to not be light so long as they have different damage dice, i.e. d8 Longsword/Rapier and d6 Shortsword. Also if a Mainhand attack hits and the bonus action attack hits roll the damage dice of the offhand attack twice.

The problem with that is, as the math shows, you'd be dealing damage comparable to the Dual Wielder feat without having to take it. And while I like the idea of doubled damage dice on the offhand attack - although not for this style - your damage averages (which are what are used for balance across the edition) are higher if you just take Two Weapon Fighting and add your Str/Dex bonus.