Roy's fights in general

[Atheist_Cleric]

I was looking back at some of the more recent strips that involve Roy fighting, usually with Miko or Xykon, and something weird occurs. Miko, Hinjo and pretty much every other fighter-type character we've seen seems to be able to do a few attacks per round, slash-slash-slash etc. But in just about all of his fights, Roy seems to be doing one slash or stab at a time. Now I play D&D 2nd edition, so im unsure on the rules, but shouldnt a fighter of Roy's level with a weapon specialisation in Greatsword be getting a few attacks per round, or something? Maybe he is but im just not seeing it through the art correctly. Someone willing to venture a solution?

[Morty]

It's probably because picturing all Roy's full attacks would take all strip.

[Aducabar]

Or because he talks so much that talk can't be treated as free action any more :smallwink:

[Spiryt]

You know, Miko and Hinjo fights with katanas, and Miko is Two Weap. fighter, Roy fights with Greatsword. Yeah according to the rules on 11-14th level, (they are around that) they both (Roy and Hinjo) should be able to do 3 attacks per round.
But guy swinging big sword every 2 seconds will look kinda silly. He obviously prefer few, yet powerful blows. I don't remember any 3.5 rules which could allow something like that, but it doesn't matter.
It's comic, not D&D session diary. Could you imagine Roy swinging as fast as Miko?

EDIT: Also, notice that for example in 409 Hinjo also is doing single slash.
I believe only Miko makes 3 or more. It her reflects fierce and zealous way of fighting. Which reflects that she was zealous and fierce.

Reasuming, it has nothing to do with rules.

[Fighteer]

There are several strips (such as the last fight scene with Xykon) that seem to represent Roy's multiple attack sequence in separate panels.

Generally, though, it seems to be an artistic convention. Roy likes to Power Attack, and Rich likes to treat Power Attack as a single mighty blow rather than showing each hit.

[Shatteredtower]

That single attack has also made for a neat visual on Great Cleave, since it makes the sword appear to just carry through on the one swing. And he does charge a lot, which limits him to just the one attack (not including cleave attempts).

The PHB has a few options for alternative class features that might fit well with the general presentation we see for Roy. Either the Counterattack or Overpowering Attack would work -- the latter might even be perfect, if it wasn't for the fact that Roy would have to be 16th level to take it.

[JaxGaret]

The PHB has a few options for alternative class features that might fit well with the general presentation we see for Roy. Either the Counterattack or Overpowering Attack would work -- the latter might even be perfect, if it wasn't for the fact that Roy would have to be 16th level to take it.

You mean PHBII.

[TheGrimace]

or he has the dirty fighting feat...
not likely, but possible.

make one attack as a full round action to deal 1d4 extra damage...

why did they even make that feat?

[Jefepato]

why did they even make that feat?

Because they hate freedom.

[Shatteredtower]

You mean PHBII.Yes. Yes, I do.

[sealemon]

or he has the dirty fighting feat...
not likely, but possible.

make one attack as a full round action to deal 1d4 extra damage...

why did they even make that feat?


I'm not familiar with it but if that's all it does...then I have no idea.

[Poeir]

There's nothing in the D&D rules that says multiple attacks can't be part of a single maneuver. You could reasonably say that a full attack on a single target is a single mighty blow. It would certainly make more sense for weapons like a greatsword.

[Thoughtbot360]

You know, Miko and Hinjo fights with katanas, and Miko is Two Weap. fighter, Roy fights with Greatsword. Yeah according to the rules on 11-14th level, (they are around that) they both (Roy and Hinjo) should be able to do 3 attacks per round.
But guy swinging big sword every 2 seconds will look kinda silly. He obviously prefer few, yet powerful blows. I don't remember any 3.5 rules which could allow something like that, but it doesn't matter.
It's comic, not D&D session diary. Could you imagine Roy swinging as fast as Miko?

EDIT: Also, notice that for example in 409 Hinjo also is doing single slash.
I believe only Miko makes 3 or more. It her reflects fierce and zealous way of fighting. Which reflects that she was zealous and fierce.

Reasuming, it has nothing to do with rules.

Technically, a historical Greatsword was not swung, nor was any other big weapon (Great axes were ceremonial, AKA just there to look pretty and/or menacing but utter useless. A battle axe-which closely resembles the lumberjack's primary tool- held in two hands is more appropriate), there were all Reach weapons, made with stabbing and poking in mind. Some spears and other polearms had a few techniques that involves spinning over head or tripping, but the greatsword in particular add flat edges with just a sharpened tip.

If you want a "big" sword that is still multi-functional, your are limited to the longsword.

[Quietus]

There's nothing in the D&D rules that says multiple attacks can't be part of a single maneuver. You could reasonably say that a full attack on a single target is a single mighty blow. It would certainly make more sense for weapons like a greatsword.

That's basically what I was figuring. After all, it's all about fluff. You still roll the same number of dice, you still do the same amount of damage, you're just describing those three hits that all hit and did damage as a single massive swing that sliced the target neatly in half.

[Spiryt]

Technically, a historical Greatsword was not swung, nor was any other big weapon (Great axes were ceremonial, AKA just there to look pretty and/or menacing but utter useless. A battle axe-which closely resembles the lumberjack's primary tool- held in two hands is more appropriate), there were all Reach weapons, made with stabbing and poking in mind. Some spears and other polearms had a few techniques that involves spinning over head or tripping, but the greatsword in particular add flat edges with just a sharpened tip.

If you want a "big" sword that is still multi-functional, your are limited to the longsword.

You know, I realise that "zweihanders" were used by Landsknechts to disorder/destroy enemy pikes, but still cut made with it will be deadly. And Roy's sword ( and gennerally D&D greatswords) isn't historical zweihander. It definetely looks like something like between greatsword and longsword.
Like claymore (wider near end) or maybe scottish lowland sword.

I agree that there were not very practical weapons. But still, you must agree that good strike with one is guaranteed "one shot", if only enemy isn't in good plate.

[Dunamin]

I don't really have much to add here - I also think that Roy technically gets 3 attacks, but the presentation of combat does not necessarily strictly adhere to having the number of swings in a single panel reflect this.

One point though:

Now I play D&D 2nd edition, so im unsure on the rules, but shouldnt a fighter of Roy's level with a weapon specialisation in Greatsword be getting a few attacks per round, or something?
Weapon Specialization does not influence number of attacks in 3rd Edition, although I do recall them doing so in 2nd. It's merely a feat available for fighters of at least 4th level that allows you to deal +2 damage with a chosen weapon.

[Amphimir Míriel]

Technically, a historical Greatsword was not swung, nor was any other big weapon (Great axes were ceremonial, AKA just there to look pretty and/or menacing but utter useless. A battle axe-which closely resembles the lumberjack's primary tool- held in two hands is more appropriate), there were all Reach weapons, made with stabbing and poking in mind. Some spears and other polearms had a few techniques that involves spinning over head or tripping, but the greatsword in particular add flat edges with just a sharpened tip.

If you want a "big" sword that is still multi-functional, your are limited to the longsword.

These guys seem to disagree with you:

http://www.thearma.org/essays/thrusting_vs_cutting.html

http://www.thearma.org/essays/2HGS.html

[Grod_The_Giant]

I think that he does get multiple attacks, they're just in multiple panels. Look at 442: he attacks 5 times before :xykon: does anything.

[Miklus]

Did we ever figure out when that green glow appears? Is it on a critical?

[Atheist_Cleric]

Way too many attacks in a row get the glow for it to be on crits only. I'd say it's activated by a strong surge of emotion, the most common being anger, but in his final flurry of attacks against Xykon the emotion could have been determination.

[ThorFluff]

http://www.thearma.org/Videos/mov37.mpg

Greatswords weren't all that defensive, but if you just let loose, it ain't a slow weapon. Why? one word:

Momentum

Velocity time mass equals energy.

[BardicLasher]

Clearly, Roy has Wild Talent and Psionic Weapon, so before he makes any attack, he uses his move action to gain his psionic focus. That's why he only makes one attack each round.


That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

[Douglas]

or he has the dirty fighting feat...
not likely, but possible.

make one attack as a full round action to deal 1d4 extra damage...

why did they even make that feat?
I have no clue why Bioware added such a feat to Neverwinter Nights, which is the only place it appears to my knowledge. It's such an utterly craptastic feat the instant you get +6 BAB that I have never even considered taking it.

[sikyon]

http://www.thearma.org/Videos/mov37.mpg

Greatswords weren't all that defensive, but if you just let loose, it ain't a slow weapon. Why? one word:

Momentum

Velocity time mass equals energy.

...

Velocity times mass equals energy.

....

....

no.

Also, greatswords have reach over weapons like shortswords, which is their main advantage. The torque (and thus slashing force) produced by a shortsword is much greater than that produced by a greatsword. If a greatsword, like in that video, get's blocked in a slashing motion then it's probably screwed as it has to start again (also momentum makes attacks predictable).

[Spiryt]

...

Velocity times mass equals energy.

....

....

no.

Also, greatswords have reach over weapons like shortswords, which is their main advantage. The torque (and thus slashing force) produced by a shortsword is much greater than that produced by a greatsword. If a greatsword, like in that video, get's blocked in a slashing motion then it's probably screwed as it has to start again (also momentum makes attacks predictable).

....
....
....

Can you explain WHY no?

Why polearms are so long then if 2feet pole would make cut stronger:smalltongue:

It makes no sense.

Anyway, cut trough six (5 or 7 maybe, can't see clearly)ribs with shortsword and show us. (http://pl.youtube.com/watch?v=YFAKTjOQJwQ&mode=related&search=)

I know that it's commercial of their procuct, so they show how cool it is, but still he did it.

[David Argall]

Did we ever figure out when that green glow appears? Is it on a critical?

I believe it is the bonus damage from attacking an undead.

[Orzel]

The other thing to consider is that D&D melee attacks are just opportunities. 3 attacks = 3 chances to damage someone. You could swing 100 times but only 3 have a chance of hitting. You could swing once and get 3 hits.

It's like a 2D fighting game.

[Luklan]

Longer weapons have more speed, and thus potentially more force, at the end.

Why? Because the tip of a six foot blade is moving faster than the tip of a two foot blade, so it stays attached.

That's all I'm adding to the off-topic discussion on this thread.
---

I think there's also the matter of the fact that Roy's fights often start with him running up to someone, thus, by the rules of DnD, he's not allowed to make a full attack (which is a full round action)

[Dancing_Zephyr]

E=0.5mv^2

If a greatsword were screwed if blocked it wouldn't have been used as a weapon in actual battles. A shortsword may have more torque, but torque has little to do with the energy delivered by an attack, which determines the damage done. The greatsword has a longer swing radius, thus if you swing both with the same speed at the arm, the greatsword's cutting edge is moving much faster and can impart more energy to its target.

On topic
It's hard to draw a many power attacks in a row without it looking the same.

Darn simu-ninjas...

[Luklan]

E=0.5mv^2

If a greatsword were screwed if blocked it wouldn't have been used as a weapon in actual battles. A shortsword may have more torque, but torque has little to do with the energy delivered by an attack, which determines the damage done. The greatsword has a longer swing radius, thus if you swing both with the same speed at the arm, the greatsword's cutting edge is moving much faster and can impart more energy to its target.

That's what I was trying to say, but I think you did it far better.

Hard to be so articulate at 7:14am though

edit: Fear my leet SimuNinjutsu :smallamused:

[BelkarIsAGod]

Way too many attacks in a row get the glow for it to be on crits only. I'd say it's activated by a strong surge of emotion, the most common being anger, but in his final flurry of attacks against Xykon the emotion could have been determination.

It could be that, but the greatsword is a +5 undead bane greatsword, and that smith said that the green energy WAS particulally damaging to undead, so...

[Gygaxphobia]

Does Giant ever show misses? I think every attack he shows causes a wound doesn't it? That could explain it.

[Spiryt]

Does Giant ever show misses? I think every attack he shows causes a wound doesn't it? That could explain it.

Dont know why you think so. Giant shows misses and it looks pretty nice.
(Miko dodging blow with rather nonchalant step back - gives idea that she is good)

200 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0200.html)

for example

[Spiky]

A shortsword may have more torque, but torque has little to do with the energy delivered by an attack, which determines the damage done.

Actually, that's more or less the definition of torque. But torque is different at each point on the sword. If only the very tip is considered to hit something, then the shorter sword has more torque given the same force since it travelled less far in the swing. But if you select the same point on each sword, say 5" down the blade, torque would be the same with equal force in the swing.

(although IRL it would be affected by the greater mass of the larger sword, it gets complicated)

Is torque really common in D&D discussions? Seems a little strange to me.

[Pyrian]

Technically, a historical Greatsword was not swung, nor was any other big weapon (Great axes were ceremonial, AKA just there to look pretty and/or menacing but utter useless. A battle axe-which closely resembles the lumberjack's primary tool- held in two hands is more appropriate), there were all Reach weapons, made with stabbing and poking in mind. Some spears and other polearms had a few techniques that involves spinning over head or tripping, but the greatsword in particular add flat edges with just a sharpened tip.

If you want a "big" sword that is still multi-functional, your are limited to the longsword.I don't know where you got those ideas, but it seems to me you're wrong on every count. Great swords are almost exclusively cutting weapons; they virtually have to be, the weight is all in the blade. You'd have to wield it like a spear to make it a thrusting weapon (yay gauntlets) - though I suppose that sort of thing DID happen, supposedly some heavy-armored sword combat training actually looked more like short-staff fighting. Even broad swords are mostly slashing weapons, pointed tip notwithstanding. I think the largest truly thrusting sword is the early rapier. While certain "great axes" were indeed ceremonial, two-handed axe weapons like sparth and halberds were feared battlefield weapons. (If you're using D&D terminology, and battleaxe is an axe that can be used one or two-handed; a two-handed axe is either a great axe or halberd.)

[Atheist_Cleric]

It could be that, but the greatsword is a +5 undead bane greatsword, and that smith said that the green energy WAS particulally damaging to undead, so...

True, the energy is "Particularly" damaging to undead, as shown by its ability to overcome a dragon zombies damage reduction and wound a level 20 (probably) lich sorcerer. But as the glow has appeared in Roy's fights with Sabine (unfortunatley a miss) and Miko (direct hit, and she howled in pain), im guessing that it doesnt exclusively hurt undead. Its most likely a complete homebrew effect, extra damage to all enemies, and extra EXTRA damage to undead. I stand by that it's activated by emotion though, rather than fighting undead or extraplanar creatures. Every damn time its showed up, Roy has been either yelling something angrily, or in the case of just before Xykon MS'd him, grim with determination. Only other explanation is that it is activated by plot necessity :smallamused:

Also, where did the "undead bane greatsword" term come from? Its a starmetal greatsword, a +5 greatsword that has a green energy power that causes extra damage, definetly to undead and probably to all enemies.

[F.H. Zebedee]

I'll support the "Fluffs it into one 00ber swing" theory. Sounds about right for Roy.