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View Full Version : D&D 5e/Next Kensai - a Monk Archetype [V3]



AmbientRaven
2016-04-21, 06:43 AM
Hi Folks,

Round three of fine tuning the Kensai archetype. I have listened to feedback, and made the changes I feel appropriate. These include adding tool proficiencies and a non combat thematic/rp skill. I have also modified ki blade abilities and costs as well as completely changed the classes capstone.

I would love feedback on this, to see how people feel about the changes.

New V3 http://www.naturalcrit.com/homebrew/share/SysC848l
Old V2 for reference of changes http://www.naturalcrit.com/homebrew/share/4ysxyWo6x

Final Hyena
2016-04-21, 09:35 AM
Weapon Bond
This feature is very powerful going with a longsword you get an average +3 dmg a round or +5 on a flurry (before calc miss chance). It also allows a monk to use a weapon for all attacks getting more benefit from magic items. Maybe you should have to sacrifice a Ki from your maximum to bond?

Ki Blade
Two Talon Pierce
for 1 ki you get 1d10 damage
5.5 average damage

Hunt like the wolf
for 2 ki you get advantage on the attack
with a d8 sword and 4 dex that's 8.5 on a hit, with an average hit rate of 60% your avg damage goes from 5.1 to 7.14
2.04 average damage

Cat confuses the mouse
1 ki to give everyone a free disengage against that target
ki lost on a miss ~ this is a change from the other two and makes it less valuable.

Watch not the tail
1 ki to give disadvantage on one attack
ki lost on a miss ~ this ability is like the wolf, except that you lose it on a miss :( to be fair it is stronger for fewer stronger enemies.

I think talon pierce needs a lower damage die (d4~6), hunt like the wolf should be 1 ki, cat shouldn't loose the ki on a miss, watch is ok.

You might have balanced talon pierce against a flurry, the reason talon pierce should not be as good is because you're bursting more damage into one round than otherwise possible.

Also the feature to use wisdom over dex is neat, but it's a bit awkward at level 4/5 when you have to bump dex or wisdom, perhaps slot it into the 3rd level feature? All it does is give you better wis skills at the expense of dex skills.

AmbientRaven
2016-04-21, 12:37 PM
Thanks for your feedback!


Weapon Bond
This feature is very powerful going with a longsword you get an average +3 dmg a round or +5 on a flurry (before calc miss chance). It also allows a monk to use a weapon for all attacks getting more benefit from magic items. Maybe you should have to sacrifice a Ki from your maximum to bond?

Flurry attacks still use the Martial arts damage die, not the weapons. The monk does gain the benefit of a magic weapon, but I have never played in a game where a monk hasn't received some form of item to enhance their unarmed strikes, so this was balanced around my experience in games I guess.



Ki Blade
Two Talon Pierce
for 1 ki you get 1d10 damage
5.5 average damage[/quote

Dropped to a D8

[QUOTE=Final Hyena;20692296]
Hunt like the wolf
for 2 ki you get advantage on the attack
with a d8 sword and 4 dex that's 8.5 on a hit, with an average hit rate of 60% your avg damage goes from 5.1 to 7.14
2.04 average damage

Returned this to 1 ki



Cat confuses the mouse
1 ki to give everyone a free disengage against that target
ki lost on a miss ~ this is a change from the other two and makes it less valuable.


I honestly prefered it without the loss of Ki. I reverted it to no ki loss, and to always work even ona miss.



Watch not the tail
1 ki to give disadvantage on one attack
ki lost on a miss ~ this ability is like the wolf, except that you lose it on a miss :( to be fair it is stronger for fewer stronger enemies.

The ki loss does suck, but it is a powerful ability, especially at higher levels.

I think talon pierce needs a lower damage die (d4~6), hunt like the wolf should be 1 ki, cat shouldn't loose the ki on a miss, watch is ok.



Also the feature to use wisdom over dex is neat, but it's a bit awkward at level 4/5 when you have to bump dex or wisdom, perhaps slot it into the 3rd level feature? All it does is give you better wis skills at the expense of dex skills.

I was worried about making it 3rd level for other classes dipping. Would allow for a pure wis damage cleric that also gains bonus attacks and other such things. The 3 levels would be to good to pass up (even more than fighter 2). So I made it a deeper dip to get it, making it a non auto-include ability. The wisdom is there more thematically. Dex is mechanically better, but wis has it's benefits too.

I hope you enjoyed this class, and thanks for the feedback!

Final Hyena
2016-04-21, 02:43 PM
Flurry attacks still use the Martial arts damage die, not the weapons. The monk does gain the benefit of a magic weapon, but I have never played in a game where a monk hasn't received some form of item to enhance their unarmed strikes, so this was balanced around my experience in games I guess.
Fair enough I misread the description.


Dropped to a D8
at level 6 you do d8+4 dex+1 magic =9.5
with a 60% hit chance, average damage =5.7
advantage gives a 84% hit chance, average damage =7.98
crits happen +4.75%
crit damage 4.5
average increase =0.21375
+2.49 total damage

at level 20 you do d10 +5 dex +3 magic = 13.5
with a 60% hit chance, average damage =8.1
advantage gives a 84% hit chance, average damage =11.34
crits happen +4.75%
crit damage 5.5
average increase =0.26125
+3.5

Generally an increase of d4~d6. Unless you also consider the chance of getting a natural 1 going from 5% to 0.25% a big boon as crit fumble tables exist.


I was worried about making it 3rd level for other classes dipping. Would allow for a pure wis damage cleric that also gains bonus attacks and other such things. The 3 levels would be to good to pass up (even more than fighter 2). So I made it a deeper dip to get it, making it a non auto-include ability. The wisdom is there more thematically. Dex is mechanically better, but wis has it's benefits too.
I see your point, on the other hand having that monk cleric combo requires fairly high levels to pull off, one of the methods to do so is with 5 monk levels anyway so going up to 6 isn't a massive deal. I'm afraid I can't think about it in too much depth any more right now, I'll come back later.

PotatoGolem
2016-04-22, 11:19 AM
Looks more or less balanced to me, except the level 17 ability. Being able to perma-stun an enemy with no chance to save is too strong on its own, before you add the other stuff

Cancer115
2016-04-22, 04:40 PM
Hey mate, seems you and I had a similar idea. I went ahead and made a new class out of it, for sake of emphasis on the sword idea. I can't post any links, cuz I is new and that's a thing, but if you got a facebook go find me @ DM Troxell and look for the picture of Garrus. I will send ya the link there.

AmbientRaven
2016-04-23, 10:30 AM
Looks more or less balanced to me, except the level 17 ability. Being able to perma-stun an enemy with no chance to save is too strong on its own, before you add the other stuff

The level 7 ability is Contagion, a 5th level spell that's useable once a day, which is why I figured a 1 use ability of it as a capstone would be fine. The Open hand still reduces a target to 0 HP on a fail, so i feel against that it feels balanced.