MIN MAX: So much Time, Forms, and CHEESE. What do I do with them???

[CalleroftheDeep]

Hey guys,

My friend and I decided that we wanted to do an almost no-limits, crazy arena-style duel using 3.0/3.5 material. We have stated that all levels of cheese are on the table, so long as the DM says they work. This is an excuse to build the most game-breaking level 20 characters available, and set them loose on each other because otherwise we would never be able to play them in any sane DM's campaign.

Bearing that in mind, I am currently building a Planar Shepherd 10, Druid 10 connected to the plane of Xoriat, for the ability to gain 10 rounds of action per normal round, as well as use the Pseudonatural Creature template (native to Xoriat according to the Mastery of Madness spell (PGtE)) to be able to apply the Outsider subtype to any corporeal creature, effectively letting me change into any corporeal creature with Wildshape and gain their abilities. The DM ruled that the application of this template was okay.

Now, my character would normally have 24 hours ahead of time to prepare buff spells/mess with shenanigans before going into battle, but I plan on turning into a Pseudonatural Chronotyryn (FF) and activating my Planar bubble to stretch that into (2 actions * 10 * 1 =) 20 days of preparation. So do you guys have any ideas for time sinks before the battle? I can only bring what I can buy, which is a considerable sum, and I can't bring hired workers or use the leadership feat, but bringing anything from dead bodies to golems is on the table.

Other than that, with a list of all corporeal creatures available to be changed into, what are some suggestions as to what I should become? I have the Chronotyryn for action economy, Efreeti for several wishes a day, and Zodar for general tankiness, but I am SURE that there are several other ways to abuse this ability that I have overlooked in my search for the tastiest cheese.

Thanks for the feedback in advance!

[ATHATH]

Be Pun-Pun. Congratulations, you win.

In all seriousness though, check out Eggynack's Druid Handbook. It has some really good advice for Druids.

[Ortesk]

Throw a planet at him. Done.

Build a Psion Thrallherder. Your thralls are Thrall herders. Your second is command is a thrall herder. You take dragon leadership. Your dragons all have leadership. There cohorts are thrallherders. Rinse and repeat until you have to buy a cart of m&m's to represent your army. Then throw them all on the enemy. Death by numbers

[MisterKaws]

Pseudonatural Sarrukh while having a Fleshraker as a companion, then give the Sarrukh's abilities to it and then have him give them to you. Now be Pun-Pun.

[CalleroftheDeep]

Be Pun-Pun. Congratulations, you win.

In all seriousness though, check out Eggynack's Druid Handbook. It has some really good advice for Druids.

I will definitely check out that handbook; I've looked at Treantmonk's, but it's a little outdated.

[CalleroftheDeep]

Throw a planet at him. Done.

Build a Psion Thrallherder. Your thralls are Thrall herders. Your second is command is a thrall herder. You take dragon leadership. Your dragons all have leadership. There cohorts are thrallherders. Rinse and repeat until you have to buy a cart of m&m's to represent your army. Then throw them all on the enemy. Death by numbers

I would LOVE to do that, but all of the leadership feats are banned. Yeah, I know, it sounds sort of contradictory to do so, but we wanted to focus on the class optimization rather than just taking a broken feat :P.

[CalleroftheDeep]

Pseudonatural Sarrukh while having a Fleshraker as a companion, then give the Sarrukh's abilities to it and then have him give them to you. Now be Pun-Pun.

Now that.... That could work. Where is the Sarrukh located again? Book wise?

And although it's tempting to use, it's not the most interactive. If pun pun shows up in any form, the whole match is over, and so I'd rather just tell him "I could have Pun Pun'ed and won," and done a different build that he could actually stand a chance against.

[CalleroftheDeep]

Also: I can have lots and lots of wishes every day as a result of efreeti form. We have agreed to allow the "Create a magic item, or add to the powers of an existing magic item" version of it to add up to 25,000 gp worth of enhancement every time it is used.
So are there any stacking enhancements that I should be adding to any magic items to do something crazy?

[Inevitability]

Now that.... That could work. Where is the Sarrukh located again? Book wise?

Serpent Kingdoms.

Also, you can quote multiple posts with the button to the bottom right of every message. I recommend doing that instead of replying 3+ times in a row.

[CalleroftheDeep]

Serpent Kingdoms.

Also, you can quote multiple posts with the button to the bottom right of every message. I recommend doing that instead of replying 3+ times in a row.

Thank you and thank you. That should keep down on the thread clutter

[Ortesk]

I would LOVE to do that, but all of the leadership feats are banned. Yeah, I know, it sounds sort of contradictory to do so, but we wanted to focus on the class optimization rather than just taking a broken feat :P. Thrallherd is a class. Not a feat. Cant work with Leadership. Still legal then. If it is for the lulz and the loopholes, I would do it for the fun. Literally unleash an army to rival hells size on the guy.



Also, you can quote multiple posts with the button to the bottom right of every message. I recommend doing that instead of replying 3+ times in a row.

Heck, I have been copying+backing out+pasting over and over. Make me feel derp before this

[Kraken]

Also: I can have lots and lots of wishes every day as a result of efreeti form. We have agreed to allow the "Create a magic item, or add to the powers of an existing magic item" version of it to add up to 25,000 gp worth of enhancement every time it is used.
So are there any stacking enhancements that I should be adding to any magic items to do something crazy?

Not that there's anything wrong with your proposed build, but you can get infinite wishes with a lot fewer resources. All you need is the ability to cast astral projection, or access to a willing nightmare who can astrally project you (or the ability to turn into a nightmare and use its astral projection ability yourself via the shapechange spell or similar). Astral projection creates a copy of all your items and magic items. Cast astral projection, and have your astral copy go buy you a scroll of wish (or a ring of three wishes, any wish producing item works really). Have your astral copy drop the scroll of wish at your real body's feet. Dismiss the astral copy, pick up the scroll of wish, then cast astral projection again. Your astral copy now has a copy of that scroll of wish. Use that scroll to wish yourself a pile of 25,000 GP or whatever. Place the newly acquired gold/item(s) at the feet of your real body, then dismiss that astral projection. Create a new astral projection, with a new scroll of wish, plus whatever items you acquired from the last goaround, and repeat as desired. Acquire additional scrolls of wish to increase the efficiency of the process if desired.

Functionally, this gives you infinite wealth and wishes. Use these things to create your own fortified demiplane (created from the spell genesis in Deities and Demigods). Your real body never needs to leave your demiplane. Instead, astrally project yourself out of it. Any time you're feeling low on resources, you can just dismiss your current astral projection, and send out a new one, which will have all your consumables and spells prepared again. The only ways to kill you will be to invade your demiplane, to use one of the handful of ways specifically designed to kill someone using astral projection, none of which are very easy to pull off, or more obscure and abusive tactics like mindrape+love's pain. It is for this reason that I'd recommend sending proxies to do your work for you as long as you're able to create a delay in when your enemies would know to start researching ways to take you down. For proxies, I recommend mindraped (Book of Vile Darkness) ice assassins (Frostburn) of powerful creatures. Note that ice assassins don't actually disappear once they've terminated their prey, so once you've mindraped them into servitude, they're basically yours forever. For general easiness in pulling such shenanigans off, I recommend you switch to using dweomerkeeper (Complete Divine web enhancement), which is one of the easier ways to ignore the EXP and material cost of spells. Oh, and all these ice assassin minions? Don't forget you can astrally project them too, so you can protect your copies of creatures with additional copies, basically.

[Ortesk]

If wish cheese is on the table, just take a genies beard and cast simulcrum (sp?) then start the infinite wish cycle. Wish for all the regular stuff.

Take Bound to Time or kissed by the ages so you don't die in this mad house. then just wish for similcrums of thrallherds. Then they get there powers, and there thralls. Make them elan so they don't keel over. Keep going, setting all the genies to automate. Somewish for more genies, some tell the genies what to do, some wish for more plane space, some wish for thrallherds, some wish for food/water/a sewage system.

It is a perfect, automated system that will continue to grow as long as within the infinite planes, there is infinite Elan Thrallherds and unlimited genies to steal hair from.

Yes, I will always make this about thrallherds. For we are legion, and we are many.