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Elgate
2016-05-07, 06:27 AM
I want to make an interesting build, but I'm not sure I can do it properly.
I've been looking on way to play a character with bow, accompanied by an animal companion. I want to trip my opponent with my bow, letting my animal deal the damages. But here is the problem: you can't trip with a bow without a trip arrow, and these bad boys cost a lot (25gp each). Then I cm across the wolf style. If I can hit an opponent hard enough with an attack of opportunity, I can trip them. Quite hard in early game, but with a bit of damage, it should work wonderful. Problem are: I need attack of opportunity at range (which require improved snapshot or the ennemy will still reach me, and on top of that I need more attack of opportunity. Not only will it be feat intensive, it'll only work with attack of opportunity and it only come to work around level 9.

I started looking at other means, with the overwatch style. Can ready up to 4 attacks (with vortex, but a little shenanigan would allow me to take it early. 1 level of monk master of many style allow me to take style feat even if I do not have the prerequisite. with this, I can also use the sliding axe throw to trip at the max range of throwing axes. trigger for the 4 attacks would be 1) when ennemy move 2) when ennemy attack 3)after an attack from me 4)after an attack from me. when facing a caster, I could use when ennemy cast instead of attack. 3 and 4 would trigger on either 1 or 2, then in some case I would also get the 4th attack. This looks good on paper, but I'll probably lack damage later in the game. Maybe use another style at the same time (I'd get the 1 level of monk master of many style, I get improved unarmed strike) so, maybe another style would be a good combo with it.

Third thing I saw, is the startoss style. more damages (up to +6 per hit) with the feats. a second hit on whenever my axe hit.. Combine it with sliding axe and vital strike, I deal good damage on the 1st target and trip the second one. Problem is: I don't get the trip on ennemies that want to reach me. I'd need a lot of fighter level to get the feats to support snapshot, and I could not keep my animal companion relevant enough.
I also wonder with startoss style: You can't have a weapon on your off-hand weapon. but can you throw your right hand weapon two handed? I'd have quite good damage at that point (1.5 strength +6 +1 +vital strike. I think I get relevant damage each hit.

What are your opinions? Any idea how to do such build, which classes take, and/or Have I missed something?

avr
2016-05-07, 07:18 AM
You've missed the Ranged Trip and Ace Trip feats. They work with a bow - which is significantly easier than trying to make throwing axes viable. No use of AoOs is required.

A ranger with boon companion seems like the easiest way to do this, but several other ways exist.

Elgate
2016-05-07, 07:28 AM
I don't even know How I missed those feats. It's interesting, but on the other hand, I'll have to use a full round action each time I want to make a trip. Meaning that I lose all action for a single trip. With startoss comet and sliding axe, I indeed need more feats, but I can trip multiple foe. I'll keep those in mind still. They might come in handy.

Florian
2016-05-07, 01:57 PM
Gunslinger (Bolt Ace) using Targeting as 7th level deed. Hit legs, target prone, thing done?
Gunslinger is not too feat intensive, therefore Animal Soul and such would be feasible.

CGNefarious
2016-05-07, 04:05 PM
If you're able to use third party material, Path of War: Expanded has the Tempest Gale discipline, which is all about making combat maneuvers with ranged weapons. It's probably the best way to make combat maneuvers at range as well, assuming 3rd party is allowed.

Rainshine
2016-05-07, 04:44 PM
You might want to check out Dreamscarred Press, as someone just mentioned. Tempest Gale has a lot of toys, and Solar Wind has a couple as well.
Also in the same vein, their Warder (tank) has an archetype that revolves around bows and threatening from further away (Hawkguard). Maybe use VMC/something else to pick up an animal companion and use with that?

Elgate
2016-05-07, 05:19 PM
I'll look into these, thanks. I'm not sure my DM would allow 3rd party, but it's worth checking. As for the bolt ace, I actually never thought about it. Still a full round action to trip the target, although it doesn't seems to allow any saving check. Which is nice. I'm starting to think to teach my animal companion wolf style, to get trip attack on it as well and a bestow curse on prone target. Might be interesting. With bolt ace I could also get dex to damage, which is nice. Absolutely no feat required for it to work too. Thank you for the advices.

Florian
2016-05-08, 02:30 AM
As for the bolt ace, I actually never thought about it. Still a full round action to trip the target, although it doesn't seems to allow any saving check. Which is nice. I'm starting to think to teach my animal companion wolf style, to get trip attack on it as well and a bestow curse on prone target. Might be interesting. With bolt ace I could also get dex to damage, which is nice. Absolutely no feat required for it to work too. Thank you for the advices.

Try Hunter 2/Bolt Ace 7/Hunter 3+
Hunter might have the most powerful Animal Companion around and you only have to pick up Boon Companion twice but gain Precise Shot and other bonus feats in return.

Edit: If you really want to go as far an teach the wolf the Wolf Style chain, you can start with Combat Reflexes and Vicious Stomp early on, to trigger an AoO when you trip the target, latter on auto-triggering the AoO when Wolf Style is in. (Smells cheesy....)

CGNefarious
2016-05-08, 02:38 AM
you only have to pick up Boon Companion twice

Boon Companion can only be applied once to a single animal companion. So he would still be three levels behind a straight Hunter as far as his animal friend is concerned.

Florian
2016-05-08, 02:41 AM
Boon Companion can only be applied once to a single animal companion. So he would still be three levels behind a straight Hunter as far as his animal friend is concerned.

Right. I was thinking about the regular Ranger companion being behind 4 levels compared to Druid or Hunter when I wrote that.

Elgate
2016-05-08, 02:50 AM
Get's more and more interesting. This could actually works ^^
I was afraid it would be too feat intensive to work, but I like it more and more.

upho
2016-05-08, 07:20 AM
Wanna go really nuts with this? Try a Shield Champion brawler 7 (lets you trip at range "as if melee") and combine it with a Maelstrom Shield (free trip attempt with shield bash - yes, hit OR miss). Provided enemies can be tripped, you'll totally dominate the battlefield as the switch-hitter controller/defender. Gets even more silly if PoW stuff is allowed. Here's an example build (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?454387-Wolf-Trip-Shield-Champion-Intimidation-Martial-Control-of-Gravitas) (leave out the Intimidation and "Instant Imprisionment" combos if you don't want them and shuffle around the stats if PoW material isn't allowed at your table). One of the few ways, if not the only way, to make a martial build not focusing on damage at least as viable as a martial build which does.