View Full Version : Scout vs. many low level mooks

2007-06-25, 10:29 AM
The scout faces down the BBEG's lieutenant and inwardly smiles as he notices the ork's full plate and large axe. Before the ork can blink, the scout dances back to a more favorable position, draws and looses several arrows at once hindering the ork's movement. The fighter, now hindered by the multiple arrows embedded in his thighs, is unable to reach his tormenter and quickly falls under a storm of precisely placed arrows. As the scout gloats over his kill, a group of the ork's runty, puny, three-times-removed cousins, no longer fearful of getting squashed by their larger and stronger bretheran, charge the scout. The scout easily dispatches one of the runtlings as they close, and shortly thereafter, another receives an arrow between the eyes for it's trouble, but the remaining orklets jab and prick the scout with tiny daggers until the scout falls.

As far as I can tell, a ranged scout is pretty good at doing decent amounts of damage to one target. Move ten+ feet, shoot one arrow (or more with Manyshot), and do 1d8+xd6 skirmish. Similarily, if you take some levels in OotBI, you can add some d8's, but again, it's a standard action, hence one arrow (or more with Manyshot, as I understand it).

How does a ranged scout take a five foot step and pump out arrows at their full BAB at multiple targets and do more than 1d8 damage? (For example: BAB of 11/6/1, 3 arrows total at 3 different targets). I'm not asking for much, say a quarter to a third of the normal skirmish damage. As I understand Greater Manyshot, you can shoot the arrows at different targets but still only get skirmish damage against the first.

I am looking for a class or ability or feat that can add damage to each shot, preferably one that would scale up with levels and one that does not depend on a specific condition (flat-footed for Rogue sneak attack). Weapon improvements are a possibility but they don't scale all that well (exponential costs and all that), and there are a lot of critters walking around with resistances to one or more elemental type. Besides, a ice/fire/shock/acid/sonic/whatever burst arrow is a little off putting in my mind. I would really like to avoid those cheesy boots that turn a 5 foot step into a 10 foot step, thus "allowing" skirmish damage on all shots. Other than that, any suggestions?

2007-06-25, 10:41 AM
Hmm, does not the scout still have greater average speed than any ordinary orc? Why not just run away to a fairly safe distance and bombard with projectiles from long range. As the enemy throng closes to medium range, skirmish. And then, when they get too close for comfort, run away again and then repeat process.


2007-06-25, 10:43 AM
Greater Manyshot (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/psionicFeats.htm#greaterManyshot) is exactly what youīre looking for. Skirmish is applyed to each arrow, thatīs why itīs a "Greater" feat.

2007-06-25, 10:45 AM
Greater Manyshot allows precision damage on all shots, it's only Manyshot that doesn't allow it.

Greater Manyshot [General]
You are skilled at firing many arrows at once, even at different opponents.

Dex 17, Manyshot, Point Blank Shot, Rapid Shot, base attack bonus +6.

When you use the Manyshot feat, you can fire each arrow at a different target instead of firing all of them at the same target. You make a separate attack roll for each arrow, regardless of whether you fire them at separate targets or the same target. Your precision-based damage applies to each arrow fired, and, if you score a critical hit with more than one of the arrows, each critical hit deals critical damage.

A fighter may select this feat as one of his fighter bonus feats.

(damn ninjas!)

2007-06-25, 11:00 AM
SWEET! Thank you. (How did I misread Greater Manyshot?!?!)

As a follow-up question, does the xd8 damage of OotBI, stack with all those juicy Greater Manyshot arrows?

Ranged Precision (Ex): As a standard action, an initiate may make a single precisely aimed attack with a ranged weapon, dealing an extra 1d8 points of damage if the attack hits. When making a ranged precision attack, an initiate must be within 30 feet of his target. ...snip...

Unlike with a rogue's sneak attack, the initiate's target does not have to be flat-footed or denied its Dexterity bonus, but if it is, the initiate's extra precision damage stacks with sneak attack damage. Treat the initiate's ranged precision attack as a sneak attack in all other ways.

Hunter Noventa
2007-06-25, 11:19 AM
Yes, it would stack.

Also, if you have ToB available, check out the White Raven stance "Press the Advantage", if you can get that for your scout you are goled.

2007-06-25, 12:03 PM
Ranged Precision (Ex): As a standard action, an initiate may make a single precisely aimed attack with a ranged weapon...

Greater manyshot is also a standard action, so you canīt activate both at the same time.

2007-06-25, 12:17 PM
So, yes it would stack and no it would not stack...

Anyone else like to weigh in?

2007-06-25, 12:19 PM
I would have to agree with Ryuuk. Using the Order of the Bow Initate's Ranged Precision is a class ability requiring a standard action. It's not a generic single attack made with a standard action that you could replace or enhance with an appropriate feat. As far as I know, there is no way to get Ranged Precision on multiple attacks within the bounds of RAW. Unless your DM is willing to flex the rules, Initates are stuck making a single attack if they want their extra d8s.

Miles Invictus
2007-06-25, 09:07 PM
Brief tangent: why is Greater Manyshot in the Psionic feats section? Just because it was included with that book doesn't mean it belongs there.

Jack Mann
2007-06-25, 10:08 PM
Because it's not from the PHB, and thus not Core. If your DM doesn't allow material from the XPH, you couldn't use Greater Manyshot. By putting it in with the other material from that book, it makes thing clear.

2007-06-27, 05:04 PM
Greater Many Shot is a game changing Feat, and as JackMann says, it is rightly placed outside of the core material. It also has the potential to seriously challenge the versimillitude of the game, as the method by which this single shot dispenses Arrows in any and all directions is never explained; great Feat for Scouts, but definitely smacks of Power Creep - it makes being anything but a Ranged Scout a crazy suggestion.