Fly spell underwater

[ZenBear]

I would allow it to keep working. Depends on how you interpret the locomotion is enacted. Is it force, like telekinesis? In that case an argument could be made that the resistance of pushing through water should slow you. Thoughts?

[Nicodiemus]

There is a distinction between different forms of movement. A flying speed of x gives no benefit underwater. The spell could still be maintained in case the spell caster found him/herself able to be airborne again, but I'd rule that it provides no benefit.

[Millstone85]

To make the fluff match the crunch, I would say this:
* Spells that give you a "flying speed", like fly, are air-elemental. They do not work underwater.
* Spells that do not involve a "flying speed", like levitate, are telekinetic. They work underwater.

[tieren]

I'd allow it to grant a swim speed, or at a very minimum vertical movement til you were out of the water. Otherwise it seems like there should be some other spell called swim.

[ZenBear]

Otherwise it seems like there should be some other spell called swim.

Which is unnecessary bloat imo.

[RickAllison]

Which is unnecessary bloat imo.

Also unnecessary, Alter Self gives a swim speed. No need to add a spell when we have one that already does it.

[Millstone85]

Also unnecessary, Alter Self gives a swim speed. No need to add a spell when we have one that already does it.That part of alter self also lets you breathe underwater, yet water breathing exists too. And alter self, true to its name, only works on yourself.

I think the real reason for not having a swim spell is that all the characters can already swim, even without a swimming speed, and anything that makes you faster will help you with that too.

[ZenBear]

Also unnecessary, Alter Self gives a swim speed. No need to add a spell when we have one that already does it.

Alter Self does more than grant a swim speed. For classes with limited spells (Sorc, EK, AT) this question is relevant.

[tieren]

That part of alter self also lets you breathe underwater, yet water breathing exists too. And alter self, true to its name, only works on yourself.

I think the real reason for not having a swim spell is that all the characters can already swim, even without a swimming speed, and anything that makes you faster will help you with that too.

I'm picturing an underwater campaign where you've figured out the breathing issue but you have heavily armored guys walking on the bottom. Letting fly give them the same mobility options they would have if it weren't underwater seems fine (ie leave the bottom and move about the space above the bottom, over obstacles or pursuing swimmers).

[RickAllison]

Alter Self does more than grant a swim speed. For classes with limited spells (Sorc, EK, AT) this question is relevant.

That was in response to a proposed Swim spell. Which wouldn't solve the issue anyway.

As for allowing this for Fly, I wouldn't. Based on the material component (a wing feather), it is interacting with the air somehow. It does not make thematic sense for the spell to work underwater.

Now Levitate, that is a spell that could potentially work, though I would treat it as difficult terrain. Alternatively, just swim. In addition, this devalues other character options that give a swim speed.

[NNescio]

Which is unnecessary bloat imo.

Okay then, let's deal with this from a purely mechanical perspective.

Fly gives a fly speed. Having a fly speed doesn't give you a swim speed. Ergo, you can only swim at half movement (like climbing).

(Otherwise, hawks also get a swim speed).

Levitate just flat up says the "target rises", with no reference to movement mode. Ergo, they rise unimpeded.

[Millstone85]

I'm picturing an underwater campaign where you've figured out the breathing issue but you have heavily armored guys walking on the bottom. Letting fly give them the same mobility options they would have if it weren't underwater seems fine (ie leave the bottom and move about the space above the bottom, over obstacles or pursuing swimmers).While I see your point, I would draw your attention on the fact that water breathing is (1) a ritual (2) for up to ten creatures (3) with a duration of 24 hours (4) without concentration, indeed letting a wizard solve their party's breathing issue, whereas fly is (1) just a spell (2) for a single creature (3) with a duration of ten minutes (4) with concentration, a swim version of which would still leave those heavily armored guys at the bottom of the sea for the majority of time while lighter classes laugh at them from above.

For such a campaign, I would rather homebrew an amulet of mass aquatic adaptation.