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Arkhios
2016-05-10, 04:24 PM
As I was reading this (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?487770-quot-Brawler-quot-Monks&p=20769474) thread, I had an idea:

Monastic Tradition: Brawler

Brawling. At 3rd level, you gain proficiency in light armor and improvised weapons, and you treat improvised weapons as Monk Weapons. While you are wearing light armor and not wielding a shield you can add half your Wisdom modifier (rounded down) to your AC. Additionally, you can use your Dexterity instead of Strength for grappling if you don't wear any armor. Once per turn, when you succeed in a Grapple check, you may deal damage to your target equal to your Martial Arts damage die.

Master Grappler. At 6th level, you can spend 2 ki points and make a grapple attack as a bonus action. If you take the Attack action while you are also grappling a target you can instead Pin the target, making a grapple check as normal, and if you are successful, the target gains the restrained condition. If you take the Attack action against a target that you have restrained with Pin, you can instead attempt to Bind the target. Make a grapple check, and if you are successful, your target is incapacitated for as long as your grapple holds. By the end of its next turn, if still incapacitated by your Bind, the target must also make a Constitution saving throw or be knocked unconscious for 1 round. The DC of this saving throw is equal to 8 + your proficiency bonus + your Strength or Dexterity modifier (your choice). The target may reroll the saving throw at the end of each of its turns.

Mobile Grappler. At 11th level, you are no longer considered having the grappled condition while grappling a target, and you can grapple a target up to two size categories larger than you. If the target is two size categories larger than you, you can't forcibly move it, but by grappling it you can prevent it from moving away from you.

Chokehold. At 17th level, when you hit a target with unarmed strike at least twice on your turn, you can spend 3 Ki points to immediately strangle the target. The target makes a Constitution saving throw against a DC equal to 8 + your Proficiency bonus + your Strength or Dexterity modifier (your choice), or be knocked unconscious for 1 minute.

Arkhios
2016-05-12, 05:11 AM
Bumping this up, as I changed the contents of the thread entirely. Waste not, want not, and all that :smalltongue:

Final Hyena
2016-05-12, 07:37 AM
Brawling. At 3rd level, you gain proficiency in light armor, and you can benefit from Martial Arts while wearing light or no armor and not wielding a shield, but only with unarmed strikes, and you can use Martial Arts' increased damage die for improvised weapons. Additionally, you can use your Dexterity instead of Strength for grappling if you don't wear any armor.
This feels almost like a dead level, to survive level 1/2 you would expect a monk to have decent wisdom anyway. Light armour preventing the use of weapons reduces your first attack from a d6 to a d4. The improvised weapons thing is nice, but ultimately it is unneeded when your fists do the same damage. So the only bonus is dexterity over strength to grapple.

I would get rid of the light armour stuff, improvised weapons is pretty much flavour and can be left in without any concern, keep the dex grapple but add in something else to make grappling worth while compared to the massive value of open hand or death monk.

Arkhios
2016-05-12, 08:44 AM
This feels almost like a dead level, to survive level 1/2 you would expect a monk to have decent wisdom anyway. Light armour preventing the use of weapons reduces your first attack from a d6 to a d4. The improvised weapons thing is nice, but ultimately it is unneeded when your fists do the same damage. So the only bonus is dexterity over strength to grapple.

I would get rid of the light armour stuff, improvised weapons is pretty much flavour and can be left in without any concern, keep the dex grapple but add in something else to make grappling worth while compared to the massive value of open hand or death monk.

The reason why I added light armor proficiency was that the thread where the idea originated spoke of strenght based monks, and because traditionally monks don't have armor proficiency, I tried to find a middle ground where monks might still use some armor, while not having to rely so much on wisdom.

What if I put something that would let the brawler benefit from both light armor and wisdom, somehow. To make the trade worth it.
Like in addition to dex and light armor, you could add half your wisdom modifier (rounded up) to your AC while wearing light armor but still no shield.

What if Brawling would let you deal your martial arts damage simultaneously when you succeed in grapple attack. maybe once per turn, if not with each check?

Final Hyena
2016-05-12, 09:00 AM
The reason why I added light armor proficiency was that the thread where the idea originated spoke of strenght based monks, and because traditionally monks don't have armor proficiency, I tried to find a middle ground where monks might still use some armor, while not having to rely so much on wisdom.

What if I put something that would let the brawler benefit from both light armor and wisdom, somehow. To make the trade worth it.
Like in addition to dex and light armor, you could add half your wisdom modifier (rounded up) to your AC while wearing light armor but still no shield.
Half wisdom would essentially give you dex (3) + wis (1) + light (2) which is roughly as good as what any other monk can do, but it frees you up to go for a higher con. It would make wisdom tertiary, meaning you max dex & con leaving you with 14-16 wisdom. End game dex (5) + wis (1) + light (2). This is arguably as good as or maybe a bit better than a standard monk. So in the end not really a boon but a side grade.


What if Brawling would let you deal your martial arts damage simultaneously when you succeed in grapple attack. maybe once per turn, if not with each check?
That might work.

Arkhios
2016-05-23, 02:51 AM
Updated original post with discussed improvements. Further feedback is welcome.

Final Hyena
2016-05-23, 08:55 AM
Mobile Grappler. At 11th level, you are no longer considered having the grappled condition while grappling a target, and you can move your target with you up to half your speed. This movement doesn't provoke opportunity attacks from the grappled target.
Isn't that unneeded? Being able to drag an opponent is already a thing and as you are dragging them with you, you never leave their threatened area, right?

One other thing you could include perhaps at level 11 is the ability to grapple something up to two size categories larger than you.

Arkhios
2016-05-23, 09:09 AM
Isn't that unneeded? Being able to drag an opponent is already a thing and as you are dragging them with you, you never leave their threatened area, right?

Ah, alright, I'll scrap that bit then.


One other thing you could include perhaps at level 11 is the ability to grapple something up to two size categories larger than you.

Hmm, sounds great. I'll implement it when I can. Thanks for help!

Arkhios
2016-05-24, 02:50 AM
Changed 11th level ability as suggested above. I made an oversight about moving a grappled target, believing it was impossible by default. Seeing that it isn't, improving your general capability to grapple bigger creatures seems appropriate. Although, I feel it's not plausible to let you forcibly move a target you're grappling if it is two size categories larger than you.