Stat-row dilemma and second-guessing. Halp!

[Arkhios]

I'm having a dilemma with a character's stats. There are two possible ways to go here, and I can't decide between them.

Which one would you use? (let's go with out-of-context thought experiment; race, class/classes, and role is set in stone, as is each stat roll).

Stats as they were rolled are (let's assume I can't change their order):
Str 17, Dex 9, Con 14, Int 11, Wis 10, Cha 16

Race is Variant Human, and first level feat has already been decided.
Options for racial ability modifiers are:

Option A) Strength +1, Constitution +1; 4th level feat will grant +1 to Constitution

OR

Option B) Dexterity +1, Intelligence +1; 4th level feat will grant +1 to Strength

Either way, I aim to have Str 18 at level 4 and beyond.

So, let's hear your opinions. Remember: out-of-context!

Thanks!

So far the options have scored:
A) |||||||+|| elsewhere
B) ||||||+| elsewhere
I'm terribly sorry, but any "option C" suggestions will be ignored.

[hymer]

I don't see what class you're locked into. Is that out of context, too?

[Foxhound438]

not super certain of the importance of upping dex and int by one, unless you're going eldritch knight. I'd probably go the prior way.

[Asmotherion]

You are obviously making a paladin, and since you are supposed to tank, I'd say +con +dex... why did you dump dex anyway? You can use it for both attacks with versalite weapons and have a lot of ac...

My advice is:
dump str
Wis and Int don't need to be higher than 10
Put your 18 to dex
Third highest score to con.

If you are going for paladin, then you're either not optimising (so this thread would be irrelevent) or doing it the wrong way (so you should reconsider your restrictions). If not, please explain the concept so we can help better

Ps: Hopefully this is not a blade pact warlock. Please tell me it's not. I need it not to be a blade warlock!

[Lombra]

I'd go the former but instead of getting a feat that only ups con i'd add +1 dex and +1 con.

It's a shame that you can't swap that int for dex

[hymer]

Ps: Hopefully this is not a blade pact warlock. Please tell me it's not. I need it not to be a blade warlock!

Could be a Valor Bard or Favoured Soul Sorcerer, too. Or some sort of multiclass. Or just non-optimal stat placing.

[DanyBallon]

It's a personal preference, but given the parameters you gave us, I'd up Dex and Int in order to be more versatile.

[Asmotherion]

Could be a Valor Bard or Favoured Soul Sorcerer, too. Or some sort of multiclass. Or just non-optimal stat placing.

Still, I'd think Cha should be as high as possible for either of those options, and then look at any other stat. The only class than can afford to have cha as a secondary stat without either dumping it or having it sky high, would be the paladin. On the other hand, if we're not discussing optimisation, I really don't get the point of the thread (not in a disrespectful way, I just need the OP to clear out what exactly is his goal through the thread in order for me to be able to provide any more help)

[Arkhios]

If it helps, no, it's not a warlock, and yes, it's a paladin.

Yes, I'm concerned from optimization stand-point with the exception that I do NOT want to play neither dexadin nor paladunce, I'd much rather be versatile. Even if I didn't multiclass.

In heavy armor dexterity is irrelevant to AC, though I know it affects initiative. However, if or when Initiative is the only case where it matters, I'm okay with having low dexterity.

For higher than 10 intelligence I have my reasons (which relate to being in-character and paying close attention to the background; both of which are NOT irrelevant).

For feats, I left those vague on purpose as I know many people will always have "better" ideas than the next guy. I know what I want, and this time I wanted objective opinions; thus the attempt to fish opinions out of context regarding the two options, and only those two.

[CNagy]

Option C: +1 Str, +1 Int, Tough at level 4. You want an 18 strength, you have your reasons for Int, and while you don't get an additional +1 to Con saves, Tough boosts your HP as if you boosted your Con by 2.

[Arkhios]

I hoped I wouldn't have to say it aloud, but "Option C" was not an option. If it was, I would've mentioned it. As it is, giving me another suggestion doesn't really help me, it complicates things.

I only asked for an opinion about A) or B).

A simple A) or B) would suffice. It shouldn't be that hard?

[Firechanter]

From an Optimization standpoint, definitely option A.
The stats are just fine for a Paladin. The -1 to Dex won't make or break your character.

[Citan]

I'm having a dilemma with a character's stats. There are two possible ways to go here, and I can't decide between them.

Which one would you use? (let's go with out-of-context thought experiment; race, class/classes, and role is set in stone, as is each stat roll).

Stats as they were rolled are (let's assume I can't change their order):
Str 17, Dex 9, Con 14, Int 11, Wis 10, Cha 16

Race is Variant Human, and first level feat has already been decided.
Options for racial ability modifiers are:

Option A) Strength +1, Constitution +1; 4th level feat will grant +1 to Constitution

OR

Option B) Dexterity +1, Intelligence +1; 4th level feat will grant +1 to Strength

Either way, I aim to have Str 18 at level 4 and beyond.

So, let's hear your opinions. Remember: out-of-context!

Thanks!
Hi!

Considering those stats and suggested feats, I guess you are playing a Paladin and competing feats are Heavy Armor Master and Resilient: Constitution.

Frankly, I'm not satisfied by either of your propositions, because negative modifier to Dex is puzzling me, but Resilient in Constitution would be great also. ^^

So I'd suggest option C: +1 DEX, +1 CON and take Resilient Constitution later. Sure, having an odd attack stat is a bit sad, but if you chose Devotion or Vengeance oath it will be compensated as far as to-hit is concerned. And if you took GWM then 1 more damage won't make much of a difference.

Also, if you don't care so much about feats, then bump STR and DEX to start with all even stats... But I guess this idea is irrelevant to the thread. :)

[Arkhios]

Considering those stats and suggested feats, I guess you are playing a Paladin and competing feats are Heavy Armor Master and Resilient: Constitution.

Frankly, I'm not satisfied by either of your propositions, because negative modifier to Dex is puzzling me, but Resilient in Constitution would be great also. ^^

Sorry to disappoint you, but neither of those feats were correct :P

Half-reason to not mention the feat/feats was that I know most of the Giants would disagree with my choices. That's why I don't want to discuss them. I hope you can appreciate it.

[Fighting_Ferret]

If you are going for a rounded character over an optimized one, then B... leveling your Dex to 10 is average and having a 12 Int means you are slightly above average wise in Int, so you won't be a dunce, as you put it. Optimization aside (not a big fan of optimization) your 18 Str and 16 Cha are more than enough to carry you through an entire campaign from level 1-20 without ever increasing them.

[hymer]

If you are going for a rounded character over an optimized one, then B... leveling your Dex to 10 is average and having a 12 Int means you are slightly above average wise in Int, so you won't be a dunce, as you put it. Optimization aside (not a big fan of optimization) your 18 Str and 16 Cha are more than enough to carry you through an entire campaign from level 1-20 without ever increasing them.

All-right, I'll say the opposite. The difference between before and after option B is minuscule. Unless they see your stats or scrutinize your rolls, the other players are unlikely to ever guess whether your Int is 11 or 12. It makes virtually no difference. You can fluff it however you like.

[Gwendol]

B. Negative Dex mod can hurt.

[Citan]

Sorry to disappoint you, but neither of those feats were correct :P

Half-reason to not mention the feat/feats was that I know most of the Giants would disagree with my choices. That's why I don't want to discuss them. I hope you can appreciate it.
Dang. I was confident in my guess too. :smalltongue:
Well then, to stick back to initial question I'd choose B over A, because having a penalty in DEX saves and initiative seems too significant to me. :)

[JeffreyGator]

B. You will have no negatives or odd numbers and may get a flavorful feat most likely.

[gfishfunk]

Option A. I like characters with obvious flaws for RP purposes.

[Corran]

Well, since your strength and your charisma are already exceptional and since they stay unaffected no matter what you choose, you cannot go wrong with either option.

My first thought was that you should go with option A, as the few added hp seemed to me more desiable than being better at a few skill checks. Add to that the con saves are generally considered to be if only but a bit more important than dex saves. Moreover, with your good stats, it would be a shame not to have your paladin enjoy a higher (than in most cases) constitution score. So because of this line of thinking, my first thought was that you should go with option A.

But lets examine option B. The intelligence buff does not seem impressive at first, though being proficient in 3 lore skills (arcana, nature, religion - additional info about the OP's build) certainly puts more value in it. Still, it wont make a huge different, but it is certainly a far from worthless raise in the modifier. Raising dex also means a better initiative. But since you employ variant rules of initiative at your table, I am not exactly sure what difference that would make (it would depend on roughly what percentage of monsters have a +0 initiative I guess, of which I am completely unaware). Last but not least, I have something to say about saves. As I said earlier, con saves are considered to be generally better than dex saves. Though, with your aura of protection in play, I think it would be better to improve your dex saves rather than your con save. Dex saves are going to be your weak point (despite having aura of protection) as far as defenses go, so 1 extra point in your dex saves rather than in your con saves, would serve you better imo. But...... There is also something to be said about concentration saves. Focusing a bit more on con saves by going with option A, means that you con saves will be at +8 once you bump your charisma to 20, which is close to auto-save territory, at least as far as most concentration checks are concerend. That could perhaps let you spare a feat and instead of dedicating it on either resilient con or warcaster, you could use it for something else.

Bottom line, if it were me, I would most likely still go with option A, probably because I would consider it a missed chance not to have a better than expected constitution with these rolled stats. Though both options are very close imo.

[Addaran]

Both options seem good, but i'd probably go B. I love dex too much to have it negative and rounding your odd scores seems better.

It would greatly depend on the feats though. One is a con half-feat the other a str half-feat. Wich feat my character get would probably be a way better reason to choose A or B then the actual stats.

P.S. I hate when people always give other answers then the choices. I get your pain. =P

[Tanarii]

If you are wearing heavy armor, A. You don't need Dex. That's the entire point of Heavy Armor classes, they turn Dex into a pointless dump stat for the character. There's no real point in bumping it up. If you care about Dex saves, you need to be a Paladin or use a Shield with the Shield Mastery Feat. How useful +1 Int bonus is going to be depends pretty heavily on your DM and party.

If you aren't wearing heavy armor, definitely B.

[Arkhios]

Alright, I think that at this point the clear answer is option A, so let's suck it up and admit it: my dex (and int) saves will suck, no matter what I do. While what Corran said is true: we use Initiative Score variant instead of rolling (kind of a "Passive" Initiative), and while (again truthful information) I have proficiency with three intelligence skills, difference in both cases is so minimal that it won't matter much if I didn't improve dex and int.
I see the benefits of both options, which made it a tough call for myself; if it was easy, I wouldn't have done this "survey" in the first place (while some of you might disagree whether this was for optimization or not, I find it's important for the whole picture in optimization sense to weigh in all possibilities instead of simply going tunnel-vision and only focus on what I'm good at).
Seeing the results by now, it was not an easy call for the whole of you either. Both options are good, despite the latter being initially sub-optimal.
Option A was also my original option, but given all the above analyzing, I began to second-guess myself (thus, Option B).
In the end, whatever builds I make before-hand might change at a later point and I'm not exactly sure which feats I will take after 4th (which, btw, is a vital part of my concept to work and thus won't change).

Summa summarum, I'm inclined to choose Option A over B, thanks to your participation.

To sate the pain of being held in uncertainty, here's the concept (and, don't bother giving me another "better" ideas, as I already have a concept that is solid enough for me, and I will stick to it) TL;DR: build is at the bottom.

A "barbaric" Oath of the Ancients paladin, "dual wielding" a warhammer and a shield. I know, I know, it might seem dumb, but consider this:
My shield can be used as a holy symbol, thus I'm able to cast most of my spells with my hands full already without War Caster. However, most of my spells are also concentration spells, and I will most likely aim to keep them each up for the full duration, so I can use my other turns going full-offense, by swinging with both my warhammer and my shield (nonproficient initially, but proficient via feat at 4th level) while still having impressive Defense.

Yes, my mysterious 4th level feat was all along the one and same feat regardless the given options: Tavern Brawler (+1 to either str or con, plus the other benefits, such as proficiency with improvised weapons, in which shield will fall). Since shield does not have any weapon properties except improvised it's by the book a non-light, non-versatile, and non-finesse one-handed weapon, having Dual Wielder as the first level Human racial feat is also vital for this concept to work properly.
Also worth to note: As I'm investing two sub-optimal feats for my fighting technique (note: not Fighting Style!), my DM said Dual Wielder's +1 to AC adds up with Shield's +2!

I might not be doing much above average DPR with my decision, but do I have to? Using a shield, I'm the dedicated tank of our group. A tank should let the damage dealers shine on what they are best at, while I'll be doing my job more than fine (additional attack with a shield is additional chance to hit, and thus another chance to critical hit). Even without any stat modifiers the critical damage with shield's 2d4 is better damage than none at all. Plus, as a Paladin does not have limitless spell slots, I'm likely preserving my Divine Smites for critical hits, which makes even the sub-optimal shield attacks frightening: 2d4+4d8 at minimum!

The Build, option A!
Str 18, Dex 9, Con 15, Int 11, Wis 10, Cha 16
1. level: Dual Wielder
4. level: Tavern Brawler (+1 to Con)
8. level: Charisma +2, to 18
12. level: a feat to be decided later (could be war caster)
16. level: Charisma +2, to 20
19. level: ASI or a feat to be decided later (could be anything)