Necropolitan Help

[LiL KiNG]

Hi, I'm trying to design a NPC that will travel with a new low level party but will be a necropolitan in disguise who will attempt to appear a living breathing being (living mask from LM) - I hold my NPCs to the same creation rules as PCs and I'm still rather new to this. I can't quite figure out how the necropolitan template will work with a +1LA race;
If starting level 3 it would need to start with 3001 exp because you die (lose a level), which brings it to level-2 at 1001 exp, and then you lose another 1000 exp on top of that so he'd be at 1 exp. Now how does a +1LA race deal with that?

Alternately, and probably necessary, starting at level-4 (6000 exp), die, now at 3000 exp, lose the 1000 exp, now at 2000 exp or halfway through level-2... now what? this is where I'm stuck. Do I treat the +1LA as 1000 exp and subtract that which still leaves him at 1000 exp thus level-2, do I drop him to 999 exp so he's level barely under level-2, or is there another way I should approach it?

I don't want to change the race for racial trait reasons and necropolitan is the template I want on him, I just need to know the correct way to do this at the lowest possible level (I'll worry about the gold cost of the template after I figure out the experience logistics of it). Thanks in advance.

[ExLibrisMortis]

Your LA +1 creature starts at ECL 2 (1 HD), requiring 2000 XP total to hit ECL 3 (2 HD), and then 5000 XP total (+3000) to hit ECL 4 (3 HD). In this case, you can't get away with undergoing the ritual at ECL 3 (2 HD). The ritual will cause you to lose 1 hit die, from ECL 3 (2 HD). Hit die loss, by default, puts you halfway between levels, in this case halfway between ECL 2 (1 HD) and ECL 3 (2 HD). Halfway is 1000 XP exactly, which is the XP you lose from the ritual as well. End result: you're ECL 2 (1 HD) with zero XP exactly. The necropolitan rules say: "if the level loss and the 1,000 XP cost drains a creature to 0 XP or less, it is destroyed, turned to dust, and can never be raised or revived again using any means." - in other words, you must have 1 XP remaining in the end. That, together with the 'halfway' XP clause, requires ECL 4 (3 HD), which first puts you at ECL 3 (2 HD, 3500 XP), and then reduces that XP by 1000, for 2500 total (2500 to level).

Hope I got the numbers right :smalltongue:.

[LiL KiNG]

Hi ExLibrisMortis,
I had to read through that twice, but I think I'm tracking now. Thank you very much!

[theboss]

Hi, I'm trying to design a NPC that will travel with a new low level party but will be a necropolitan in disguise who will attempt to appear a living breathing being (living mask from LM) - I hold my NPCs to the same creation rules as PCs and I'm still rather new to this. I can't quite figure out how the necropolitan template will work with a +1LA race;
If starting level 3 it would need to start with 3001 exp because you die (lose a level), which brings it to level-2 at 1001 exp, and then you lose another 1000 exp on top of that so he'd be at 1 exp. Now how does a +1LA race deal with that?

If he's level 3 with 3001 XP and +1LA template means he was supposed to be level 4.(but with HD,BAB,Saves as level 1....)



Alternately, and probably necessary, starting at level-4 (6000 exp), die, now at 3000 exp, lose the 1000 exp, now at 2000 exp or halfway through level-2... now what? this is where I'm stuck. Do I treat the +1LA as 1000 exp and subtract that which still leaves him at 1000 exp thus level-2, do I drop him to 999 exp so he's level barely under level-2, or is there another way I should approach it?
No, the +1LA race isn't lowering you a level, Well technically yes, but it's already count in the level. Means if he's level 1 with +1LA race he suppose to be against CR 2 monsters.
Then you die, lose a level and 1,000 xp. So now, let's see he started at level 1, Tiefling, advancing to level 3. now he's adding his necropolitan template which means he'll lose a level and 1000 xp.
Bringing him to level 2 but with a CR of 3.

[Gildedragon]

Hi, I'm trying to design a NPC that will travel with a new low level party but will be a necropolitan in disguise who will attempt to appear a living breathing being (living mask from LM) - I hold my NPCs to the same creation rules as PCs and I'm still rather new to this. I can't quite figure out how the necropolitan template will work with a +1LA race;
If starting level 3 it would need to start with 3001 exp because you die (lose a level), which brings it to level-2 at 1001 exp, and then you lose another 1000 exp on top of that so he'd be at 1 exp. Now how does a +1LA race deal with that?

Alternately, and probably necessary, starting at level-4 (6000 exp), die, now at 3000 exp, lose the 1000 exp, now at 2000 exp or halfway through level-2... now what? this is where I'm stuck. Do I treat the +1LA as 1000 exp and subtract that which still leaves him at 1000 exp thus level-2, do I drop him to 999 exp so he's level barely under level-2, or is there another way I should approach it?

I don't want to change the race for racial trait reasons and necropolitan is the template I want on him, I just need to know the correct way to do this at the lowest possible level (I'll worry about the gold cost of the template after I figure out the experience logistics of it). Thanks in advance.

Look let's make it easier: what ECL you want? If it is 3+ just handwave the particular trajectory they took to get there: they have gone necropolitan and have bought out their LA and are finally, at long last, and after much trouble ECL 3 at level 3
Gold cost is subsumed in their wbl (if they got spellstitched count stitching as magic items or as the cost of hiring a character of the necromancer to do the stitchwork

[LiL KiNG]

Look let's make it easier: what ECL you want?

Hi Guigarci, I think my issue was misunderstanding how the LA would affect experience gain as I was counting it as a level in and of itself as theboss pointed out (thanks!). I was just trying to find the lowest ECL a +1LA race can apply the necropolitan template and not die from hitting 0 exp during creation (lose a level and 1000 exp). I'd love to add spellstitched but with a 15 wis it's too cost prohibitive right now.

[LiL KiNG]

Ok, I think I've got it.
Tiefling - Wizard 3 (3HD/3000 exp) (ECL 4 - we'll ingnore this LA for a moment)
Dies as part of the ritual to become Necropolitan, loses 1HD,
Level Loss states "The victim’s experience point total is immediately set to the midpoint of the previous level",
So should now be 2HD/2000 exp (2000 being halfway between 3000 and 1000 of course),
Now, as part of the ritual you sacrifice another 1000 exp,
Which brings him to down to 1000 exp even, which is enough to stay level 2 (2HD/1000 exp) and then bring that +1LA back into play so he's (ECL 3).

Does this appear right?

Usually in character creation we'll say start at level 2, so if you want to use a +1LA race then you start at level 1 and your ECL is 2. Pretty simple. This if the first time I've had to try and factor level loss and experience loss into that though, so thank you very much for all of your replies.

[Gildedragon]

Any reason for not using Lesser Tiefling instead?

[LiL KiNG]

Any reason for not using Lesser Tiefling instead?

I would if I could, but no lesser outsiders is a group ruling to combat...cheese. Small group so we rotate DMing once or twice a year so everyone gets a chance to play as a pc in an adventure, so I will follow the agreed upon rules.

[Sword-Geass]

Not exactly. The tiefling has an LA+1, this means that the NPC needs to have enough xp to be of one level higher than what he truly is. A lvl 3 Tiefling has 6000xp, not 3000 like a human would.
To recap:

Level
Level
Minimum XP


Tiefling Level 1
0


Tiefling Level 2
3000


Tiefling Level 3
6000


Tiefling Level 4
10000





Level
Minimum XP


Human Level 1
0


Human Level 2
1000


Human Level 3
3000


Human Level 4
6000



See the diference?

Now, lets say our Tiefling tries to become a Necropolitan at Level 2. He dies, and loses a level, so now he is halfway between Lvl. 1 (which requires 0xp) and Lvl. 2 (which needs 3000xp), so (3000-0)/2=1500xp. Now he loses 1000xp to finish the ritual, 1500-1000=500xp, since the ritual needs you to end with at least 1xp to be succesful, we can say that this Tiefling is still alive! (or not, actually). The Tiefling only needs to reach level 2 to undergo the necropolitation (?) process, while an LA+0 race would wait to level 3, but even if they would be of diferent levels, both of them would have the same XP at the moment of starting, so no both can would start at the same time, although the Tiefling would end with less total xp that the other race.

As a bonus, look for Feign Life, a Wiz/Sor lvl 2 spell of the Necromancy school which makes it so that a dead body appears to be alive by making it breath, and having its blood flow, specifically works on corporeal undeads. It from one Dragonlance book.

[ATHATH]

I'd just like to remind you guys that a basic Tiefling (no templates) is an Outsider, and thus cannot (normally) receive the Necropolitan template. Making it a Lesser Tiefling or giving it the Humanoid Heritage feat should fix that, though.

[LiL KiNG]

Good point Athath, no feats have been selected yet so I'll make sure that's covered.

Thanks Sword-Geass, now that I sorta kinda understand what we're talking about here that makes sense.

[Gildedragon]

You could buy off the Tiefling level adjustment when he hits Wizard 3 (ECL 4), dropping him to Wizard 3 (ECL 3) and then take necropolitan to be Wizard 2 (ECL 2) (and get another batch of spells when you level up to wizard 3 again)

[LiL KiNG]

You could buy off the Tiefling level adjustment when he hits Wizard 3 (ECL 4), dropping him to Wizard 3 (ECL 3) and then take necropolitan to be Wizard 2 (ECL 2) (and get another batch of spells when you level up to wizard 3 again)

Done! Muchas gracias!