The Perfect Shield?

[Eladrinblade]

I made a thread in homebrew, but that may not be the correct place for this.

So, I like tower shields because they bring a unique mechanic to the game (especially with the FAQ interpretation (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=17835372&postcount=3)), along with some hefty drawbacks (huge ACP, +2 max dex bonus, massive spell failure, -2 on attacks, 45 lb weight). A darkwood tower shield helps this somewhat (would it raise the max dex?). However, at higher levels it just can't keep up; it's too easily sundered, the max dex ends up negating it's own AC bonus, and a few other things. You can apparently get an animated tower shield, so that frees you up for two-handed fighting while still letting you use the total cover option, but at high levels even a +5 tower shield can get sundered very easily, so:

A +5 animated force tower shield that can be activated or deactivated as a free action, like a ring of force shield, and is likewise weightless and invisible.

Weightless, so no max dex or acp.
Invisible, so even when using total cover, you can see what's going on on the other side of it.
Animated, so you can use both hands.
Can be enhanced, unlike like a force shield (supposedly?).
Force, so cannot be sundered and is immune to damage (except disintegrate and the like).
The activation/deactivation isn't necessary, it's just convenient.

Can it be done?
Would you ever allow it?
If so, at what cost?

[Troacctid]

If you're worried about getting it sundered, why not just make it out of adamantine? Seems like that would be a lot cheaper than making it out of force. You could make it dwarvencraft (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20040807a&page=6) as well while you're at it.

[Ruethgar]

A Dwarvencraft Ada intelligent shield with Shield Other as a spell it can cast would be interesting. If it fails to protect you with AC, it will still halve your damage. Not so great with magical attacks, and if the hardness doesn't reduce the damage then you have an issue but it would be cool if it works. AFB atm but it was just a thought that came to mind. Also, as an intelligent item it should get construct bonus HP(medium I think for tower shields) so that could help with this route.

[Zancloufer]

Well a Dwarvencraft Adamantine Tower shield +5 is not bad for cost effectiveness and durability.

Cost wise: 30 + 300 (Dwarvencraft) + 2000 (Adamantine) + 25000 (+5 enchantment) = 27330 GP. Would be pretty tough to with a hardness (DR) of : 20 (adamantine) + 2 (dwarvencraft) +10 (enchantment) = 32. It's HP would be no joke at : 20 (Base) + 2 (Dwarvencrft) + 50 (Enchantment) *1.33 (Adamantine MULTIPLIES HP) = 95 HP.

DR 32 (64 vs Fire/Lightning and 128 vs cold) is nothing to joke at and 95 HP can take a while to chip through. I mean it probably won't stop really high strength melee characters, siege weapons and large scale acid/sonic magic bombardment, but 90% of normal warriors, projectile barrages and fireball spamming mages won't get through it for sure. Throwning on animated would help negate that ACP and max dex as well.

[Eladrinblade]

Throwning on animated would help negate that ACP and max dex as well.

Sadly not, however everything else you guys said could work. I just don't know how I feel about metal tower shields (yes I know RoS had them). Shouldn't matter if we're throwing around Str 20+ characters though, I guess.

[Troacctid]

You can also cast Hardening, Augment Object, and/or Fortify Metal or Stone to further increase its hardness.

[Zancloufer]

Fortify Metal or Stone is a 2nd level spell that lasts hours/CL and DOUBLES the HP and hardness?

That is rather terrifying. Also since it's such a low level spell it is not exactly hard to make last for a VERY long time. Combine it with Hardening for up to 82 hardness and 190 HP. Even the famed Mailman would have trouble busting through that. 23 Empowered AND Maximized Orbs of Force to blast that shield down. That's most of his spell selection to get past a single shield. At that HP/Hardness it would be functionally immune to pretty much all fire lighting and cold damage as well.

[Ruethgar]

Fortify Metal or Stone is a 2nd level spell that lasts hours/CL and DOUBLES the HP and hardness?

That is rather terrifying. Also since it's such a low level spell it is not exactly hard to make last for a VERY long time. Combine it with Hardening for up to 82 hardness and 190 HP. Even the famed Mailman would have trouble busting through that. 23 Empowered AND Maximized Orbs of Force to blast that shield down. That's most of his spell selection to get past a single shield. At that HP/Hardness it would be functionally immune to pretty much all fire lighting and cold damage as well.
Did you include the +20HP from intelligent item?

[ExLibrisMortis]

You can also source some pure ore (Dragon #347), which doubles hp and hardness. A pure glassteel (Races of Faerûn) tower shield will set you back 13030 gp, but it has the following stats: +4 AC, +4 max dex, -7 ACP, 40% ASF, 22.5 lb, hardness 40, 80 hp (assuming the default PHB tower shield is made of wood, which has 10 hp/inch). It's also translucent, and enemies are at -4 to spot that you're carrying it.

If you use matter manipulation (EPH), you can instantaneously (that is, permanently and nonmagically) improve the hardness by 5 (to 45) and the hit points to 55 hp/inch (110 hp). After that, hardening can increase the hardness by 1/2 CL, which should be at least +6 by the time you get to cast it, but possibly up to +30 (with Circle Magic and consumptive field).

Further improvements: dwarvencraft (RoS), soulforged/pitspawned/hellforged (DMGII), and some of the improvements from Dragon #358.

[Troacctid]

Fortify Metal or Stone is a 2nd level spell that lasts hours/CL and DOUBLES the HP and hardness?

That is rather terrifying. Also since it's such a low level spell it is not exactly hard to make last for a VERY long time. Combine it with Hardening for up to 82 hardness and 190 HP. Even the famed Mailman would have trouble busting through that. 23 Empowered AND Maximized Orbs of Force to blast that shield down. That's most of his spell selection to get past a single shield. At that HP/Hardness it would be functionally immune to pretty much all fire lighting and cold damage as well.

I mean, it might be terrifying if enemies ever actually tried to sunder your shield. But that basically never happens.

[Zancloufer]

I mean, it might be terrifying if enemies ever actually tried to sunder your shield. But that basically never happens.

Except you can use a tower shield to grant total cover. So they kind of have to go through your shield first to hurt you. Essentially anything with an attack roll (or an AoE) has to break through your shield first to hurt you. DR 82 is enough to negate a lot of attacks, and as said it's 2x or 4x even against some attack types.

Also, no I did not include the +20 HP if you made it intelligent. DR 83+ and 230 HP makes for some hardy mobile cover.

[LTwerewolf]

Half the effort here can be removed simply by making the shield riverine (stormwrack) instead. All you need to do is guard it vs disintegrate. It's immune to damage.

[Darrin]

Flying Force Surfboard (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=10294124&postcount=5) already does most of this. All it needs is invisibility, so... cast greater invisibility + permanency before it's enchanted, about 5900 GP.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

If you're Small, get yourself a collar of perpetual attendance (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/fools/20030401c) and a Small darkwood tower shield for an unseen servant to carry. Direct it (as a free action!) to follow you around and set the tower shield on the edge of your space to protect you from a direction of your choosing.

[Jowgen]

Is there any way to cheat Fortify Metal or Stone to work on a wooden (or otherwise non metallic/mineral) object?

Kind of like an ironwood spell, but without that pesky "Spells that affect metal or iron do not function on ironwood" line?

[MaxiDuRaritry]

Is there any way to cheat Fortify Metal or Stone to work on a wooden (or otherwise non metallic/mineral) object?

Kind of like an ironwood spell, but without that pesky "Spells that affect metal or iron do not function on ironwood" line?Polymorph any object. Remember, effects only check to see if they're applicable when they're first applied.

So have a caster cast that on you when you've metamorphosis'd into a stone statue...

[PraxisVetli]

DR 32 (64 vs Fire/Lightning and 128 vs cold) is nothing to joke at and 95 HP can take a while to chip through. I mean it probably won't stop really high strength melee characters, siege weapons and large scale acid/sonic magic bombardment, but 90% of normal warriors, projectile barrages and fireball spamming mages won't get through it for sure. Throwning on animated would help negate that ACP and max dex as well.

Where are you getting the DR and Resistances from?
Does Addy do WAY more than I thought it did?

[torrasque666]

Where are you getting the DR and Resistances from?
Does Addy do WAY more than I thought it did?
They're basically treating hardness as DR and Resistances, as it reduces incoming damage from both physical (DR) and energy (resistance) sources.

[PraxisVetli]

They're basically treating hardness as DR and Resistances, as it reduces incoming damage from both physical (DR) and energy (resistance) sources.

Fair enough, thanks for the clarification!


For bonus points (and a heftir price tag) add a Spell Turret, DMG II, with Major Creation, Lesser Ironguard, Fabricate, and Touch of Adamantine. Turret fires one spell a round, in order, then heals itself I think 4d8+20.

[Thurbane]

Half the effort here can be removed simply by making the shield riverine (stormwrack) instead. All you need to do is guard it vs disintegrate. It's immune to damage.

If you're trying to get immunity to your shield being damaged/sundered, you pretty much can't go past this.

[Jowgen]

Disclaimer on Riverine: it is arguably also very vulnerable to the Forceward spell.