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skreweded
2007-06-27, 05:40 PM
Hey, I am new to DMing and the Serenity RPG in general and was wondering if anyone has any reccomendations... thanks! :smallbiggrin:

ShneekeyTheLost
2007-06-27, 05:43 PM
I've got a reccomendation. Throw the book in the trash and free-style it. Or use Star Wars D20, or even D20 Modern. The game system stinks on ice.

Yakk
2007-06-27, 05:56 PM
The mechanics are cute, but they don't fit the genre very well.

Don't throw out the book -- RPG books are half mechanics and half story-content. :)

I would actually recommend against running d20 as your first game: d20 is very much a war-game like RPG, with lots of rules attached.

What games have you played?

TheOOB
2007-06-27, 05:57 PM
I've heard many many bad things about the that system, though I've never played it myself. I'd suggest using True20, it handles modern and future campaigns better then d20 modern in most cases.

Kizara
2007-06-27, 06:25 PM
Is this RPG based off the Firefly series?

Corolinth
2007-06-27, 06:35 PM
Yes, it is.

I don't have much of an opinion, because my gaming group only tried one session as a one-shot to try and learn the system. One of the other guys didn't like it too well, though.

Kizara
2007-06-27, 07:05 PM
It's a pity the system is apparently terrible then.

Since the series and its world were very interesting and I'd very much like to RP in it.

skreweded
2007-06-27, 07:11 PM
i actually enjoy the system, atleast somewhat. It needs to be deeper, it seems like some parts are missing, but it is also very nice for the content in it. Mostly I am asking about pitfalls not to hit. I have run two meets so far, but they dont connect. The first allowed the players to land on canton and get rid of the magistrate. They decided to encite a riot by knocking down the jayne statue... :smalltongue: And the second is starting what will be myfirst campaign GMing. Thus I am wondering about Pitfalls. Ways to keep players interested. Get rid of distractions.. etc etc. I will be using the system as is, mostly because its a new system i am interested in trying out, and so far doesnt seem to be TOO bad.

GenLee
2007-06-27, 07:26 PM
IMO, it's not a bad system, and the rulebook is full of 'Verse-themed flavor. I only wish there were more suggestions about what difficulty various tasks ought to be. I'm kinda lazy that way.
I also wish there were more support than there is-- so far, it's just the GM screen and one adventure (OK, but sloppily written and not edited) beyond the rulebook. There are rumors of more coming. There is quite a lot of fan-generated stuff at the Waves in the Black forum.
I've GMed it three times so far.
If you're determined to keep the fluff and dump the rules, I suspect either west End Games' d6 system or GURPS (especially Traveller) ought to work just fine with the setting.

Kizara
2007-06-27, 07:57 PM
Is it d20 based and largely-compatible with 3.5ed d&d? Like say, the most recent version of star wars was?

skreweded
2007-06-27, 08:31 PM
Is it d20 based and largely-compatible with 3.5ed d&d? Like say, the most recent version of star wars was?

Not even close. if you only plan on playing serenity, you can throw the d20 out. It only uses d2-d12. Very interesting system, which just feels natural to me. Very very GM bases. To attack someone, you roll [skill]+[atribute] both of which are decided on by the GM. Of course, if it is a gun, its gonna be [gun] but from there its GM fiat. If the GM thinks its strength, so it is. If the GM thinks its agility, then it be.

Corolinth
2007-06-27, 08:52 PM
I don't know that I'd call it terrible. I haven't really looked at it enough. It's vastly different from d20, though. Even if it was compatible, I wouldn't recommend running Serenity in d20 - the d20 system is really only good for D&D, despite that every game under the sun seems to have d20 rules. Other games and settings just don't feel right under d20 rules.

Greenfaun
2007-06-27, 11:32 PM
I bought it but still haven't had a chance to play it.

The system is nothing like D&D, but that doesn't mean it sucks. I don't know if it works or not, but it seems like a good example of that new-school rpg that's less about combat simulation and more about giving players a chance to influence the narrative. If all you want is crunchy powergaming, this clearly ain't your system. But I think it looks fun.

As a GM, I think in a system like this you need to either come up with a strong plot with interesting conflict (not just a big scary villain, but a struggle that matters) or stay out of your player's way as they ride roughshod over the verse and turn it into what they want it to be. If you trust your gamers and don't have a story you want to tell, try the latter. There's lots and lots of player collaboration built right into the mechanics, so if you're willing to fly by the seat of your pants and improvise, the story points and whatnot make it easier.

Either way, I'm interested in hearing how it goes. I'd still love to find a game of this someday.

Darth Mario
2007-06-28, 12:03 AM
I've played using the system, and it actually works really well, despite being.... slightly incomplete. The rules seem to fit the flavor of the show IMO.

Anyway, I'm going to echo what everyone else is saying: if you're going to ditch the rules, don't use D20. I personally reccomend the Shadowrun system (which involves lots and lots of d6s and nothing else, you roll a number of them equal to your attribute+skill, 5s and 6s count as successes).

skreweded
2007-06-28, 12:22 AM
Err.. not gonna ditch rules... Not quite sure where people got that from.. Just kinda wondering what experiance people had with this specific system, and what pitfalls to miss.

ClericofPhwarrr
2007-06-28, 01:12 AM
Unarmed combat is the first thing that pops to mind that you need to watch out for. You'll want to use one of the fan variants; most any of them will do. Also remember that any combat is VERY deadly in this system. A combat-oriented game will likely end up with the PCs dead (or slaughtering their enemies effortlessly, depending on what equipment they have).

A lack of supporting material has already been mentioned. But! I have links with stuff you can use to make up for that.

Awtry.com (http://www.awtry.com/RPG/Welcome.html) has very well done listings of new ships, vehicles, and weapons--with stats, descriptions, and floor plans for the ships. There's quite a bit more too; it's one of the best Serenity RPG fan-sites out there.

The Cargo Hold (http://home.comcast.net/%7Ewavesintheblack/wavescargohold.htm) has a bit of stuff you can use; some sample character sheets you can use as examples or NPCs, and a ship design.

Waves in the Black (http://wavesintheblack.aimoo.com/), the forums. There is more useful (and quite a bit of unhelpful) material here than I can describe, if you are willing to take the time and effort to go through it.

Hope that helps! I enjoyed the Serenity RPG myself, even though the system needs work (probably just my rabid love of Firefly making me not care about any of the system's weaknesses). Good luck to you.

Curmudgeon
2007-06-28, 09:50 AM
There are a few things to watch out for that I can think of:
There are multiple ways to get particular specializations. Intimidate, for instance, is available under both Discipline and Influence. They're not cross-linked; the index just says pages 58, 59 for Discipline. You'll need to work through all the specialties that appeal to you to see how you can acquire them.
Unarmed combat is tricky. Brawling seems to be more versatile than traditional disciplines like Karate.
Furthering trained skills after character creation is slow. You're better off with a few well-trained skills at character creation rather than a more numerous set of lower rank skills. Try to achieve balance in the party rather than in each character, at least initially.
Some roles just lead to limited play potential, so avoid putting all your effort into one specialization. Lots of piloting skills won't matter much if most of the game is spent dirtside. Choose your skills for a couple of roles suited to different situations.
Having few dice can lead to trouble, because you botch on rolled 1s on all your dice. If you can afford to bump up skills to d12+d2, do so, as this adds a third die to your rolls.
Because the GM determine the sets of abilites that get rolled together for particular checks, ask in advance what the default primary ability is for your most-used skills. If you're going to play a haggler you'll want to know whether Intelligence or Willpower is used with Persuasion before you determine your abilities.

Catharsis
2007-06-28, 10:18 AM
Serenity just seems to be tailor-made for the Alternity system IMHO. And it sounds of loads of fun; I don't think I have the time to join, though.

Jades
2007-06-28, 05:00 PM
Read the system VERY carefully. Personally, I despise the Serenity system, but I bought it for the information on the ships and planets. But, if you're intent on using the system, just make sure that you know it very well.

Serenity
2007-06-29, 10:40 PM
Yeah, combat needs refining and/or a more thorough example, and there needs to be a better way to heal. Combat should be deadly in the thick of it, but afterwards, you ought to be able to get yourself relatively patched up fairly quickly. That said, I really love the shifting attribute/skill set relationships and the Traits are a lot of fun.

ShneekeyTheLost
2007-06-29, 11:23 PM
Yeah, combat needs refining and/or a more thorough example, and there needs to be a better way to heal. Combat should be deadly in the thick of it, but afterwards, you ought to be able to get yourself relatively patched up fairly quickly. That said, I really love the shifting attribute/skill set relationships and the Traits are a lot of fun.

Not really... if you watch the series, there were several cases where people almost died. Heck, two main characters died in the movie. There isn't magic, so no waving a wand and making someone safe. No Trek-Tek to bounce a particle graviton beam off the main deflector dish with to heal someone instantly either. It's a gritty, grizly world, where death is never far off if you screw up.

Honestly, if they hadn't taken Simon on, there'd have been more main character deaths, with Zoe the only one with even bare first aid training. Even then, it takes a good while to heal from a bullet wound, or laser burn, or knife stab... just to name a few injuries he's had to treat that could have been deadly without his expert assistance.

Jades
2007-06-29, 11:27 PM
Uh... I remember a few long lasting injuries. Hell, Book's was so bad that they had to take him to an Alliance station.

Jerthanis
2007-06-30, 04:24 AM
... Mostly I am asking about pitfalls not to hit. ...Ways to keep players interested. Get rid of distractions.. etc etc. I will be using the system as is, mostly because its a new system i am interested in trying out, and so far doesnt seem to be TOO bad.

Okay, so a few things I learned from running Serenity a little bit...

A.) Don't allow any illegal tech at creation, no matter how much they're willing to pay for it. It's all pretty unbalanced, to be compensated by it being hard to find and risky to obtain and keep around.

B.) keep grenades to a minimum, I had someone buy 20 of the suckers and walked through every encounter in the (short) game.

3.) Ignore the stat blocks for Reavers and give them nasty poisons and guns, because their knives will be pointless against a few people with guns. I had twenty reavers vs 4 gun hands and the reavers swung their knives non-menacingly while they got blown away effortlessly.

%> Study the heck out of how much reward to give the players, and never let them fall below what they need to pay to keep flyin', but also never let them have enough to outfit everyone with tactical alliance battle armor, because nothing will ever challenge them again short of DM fiat. Find a way to keep them constantly in a range where they can't afford not to take your crazy plothooks, as that was where the show was.

Q) Always vary your plots. Salvage op followed by a manhunt followed by escaping a frame-up. This will help players feel like it's not the same old thing.

+) Look out for some expensive specialties... there are a lot of important sub-skills under some of them. Intrusion experts, for example, need a lot of different skills very high, remember to keep some of the more eldrich skills of a low DC so the general skill can succeed.

...uh... I can't think of what else to say, other than take your time, experiment, and go with whatever works for you. Don't worry about screwing up at first. As the great Stan Lee once taught me, an artist's greatest creative tool is his/her eraser.

Serenity
2007-06-30, 09:55 PM
Not really... if you watch the series, there were several cases where people almost died. Heck, two main characters died in the movie. There isn't magic, so no waving a wand and making someone safe. No Trek-Tek to bounce a particle graviton beam off the main deflector dish with to heal someone instantly either. It's a gritty, grizly world, where death is never far off if you screw up.

Honestly, if they hadn't taken Simon on, there'd have been more main character deaths, with Zoe the only one with even bare first aid training. Even then, it takes a good while to heal from a bullet wound, or laser burn, or knife stab... just to name a few injuries he's had to treat that could have been deadly without his expert assistance.


Yes, a combat situation should be able to kill you stone dead in a split second if things go wrong. I'm not asking for Ressurect, or even a wand of CMW. But there should be a slightly more effective way of recovering hit points than long periods of bed rest; the players shouldn't have to be crippled and unable to contribute for the rest of the campaign.

ShneekeyTheLost
2007-06-30, 10:08 PM
Yes, a combat situation should be able to kill you stone dead in a split second if things go wrong. I'm not asking for Ressurect, or even a wand of CMW. But there should be a slightly more effective way of recovering hit points than long periods of bed rest; the players shouldn't have to be crippled and unable to contribute for the rest of the campaign.

But you see... that's not how the 'verse works. When Book was shot and had to get taken to an alliance vessel for healing, he was out of it for the rest of the episode. When Kaylee was shot, she was out of it for nearly two full episodes. In short, the rest of that campaign. So yea, being down for a good while is perfectly in keeping with the 'verse the game is set in.

This is not a 'Charge the guys with guns, and if we get hurt, who cares' type of system. This is a 'Don't get hit, because even if you live, which is doubtful, you'll be out for a long time' sort of world. Competent medical care can fix someone up, but it takes time. Honestly, they aren't able to shave much time off of how quickly it takes to recover from a similar wound in modern day. That's not really the direction their tech went.

Combat is bloody and brutal, and really shouldn't be the main point of any campaign run in the Serenity system. Look at all the plotlines... never ONCE did they actually come in 'guns blazing', other than possibly the time they pulled all the reavers into the Fed's laps... and really they were counting on the Feds being too busy having to deal with the Reavers to shoot at them. And they were right... it was a Reaver who ended up following them. And as you recall, a main character died there.

The only other one I can think of is when they were boarding the station to rescue Mal and Wash from the psycho guy. Even then, if it hadn't been for River (who has like INSANE stats and skills), their ship would have been taken.

The number one option in any combat situation is going to have to be 'run'. The players absolutely cannot afford to let themselves go toe-to-toe with any significantly armed force without some kind of trick up their sleeve. It's way too risky for any possible reward.

Athelian
2007-06-30, 10:16 PM
If I may ask...

What is the exact name of the book this material is published in?

I think I'm off to go buy one!

I am completely in love with Firefly, heh..

... Damn addictive personality.

skreweded
2007-06-30, 10:29 PM
Linky to serenity rpg book! (http://www.amazon.com/Serenity-Role-Playing-Game/dp/1931567506/ref=pd_bbs_1/105-8515192-6758845?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1183260642&sr=8-1)

Jades
2007-06-30, 10:39 PM
Adolai Niska was NOT psychotic! He's my hero!

If you are concerned about taking a character out for the whole campaign, advance the timeline a bit! Very rarely did the events of one episode directly follow the events from the preceeding episode.

Sure, in Shindig, Mal got the cow contract, and the following episode was the delivery of the cows. But how long did it take to get there?

The injury of one character shouldn't END a campaign, but it should hinder a job. If you want to let the characters heal up between jobs, just flash them forward a few weeks and say that they've got this job offer now, and everybody is healed.

Tengu
2007-07-01, 07:05 AM
keep grenades to a minimum, I had someone buy 20 of the suckers and walked through every encounter in the (short) game.


Mal: "No grenades!"

I personally think that the mechanics of Fading Suns would capture the essence of Firefly well, with added a bit more of combat (face it, characters in RPG games battle a whole lot of time), yet without being very combat-centric. Just remove stuff that does not fit the setting - aliens, psi, implants, very high tech...

ShneekeyTheLost
2007-07-01, 07:46 AM
Mal: "No grenades!"

Jayne (being chased by Reavers): Gee... it would sure be nice if we had some grenades, now wouldn't it...

nerulean
2007-07-01, 09:21 AM
No. No grenades ever. Grenades break things lots, in far too many systems.

Yakk
2007-07-04, 09:33 AM
Grenades are easy:
Make it relatively easy to botch using a Grenade. When you do, it just goes off in your hands. Splat.

If you are hit with any level of critical threshold, your Grenade goes off. Splat.

Ie, players should be afraid of using Grenades, with good reason. This lets them "pull out the stops" and bring a Grenade to a fight -- but it is insanely risky.

Yakk
2007-07-04, 09:40 AM
%> Study the heck out of how much reward to give the players, and never let them fall below what they need to pay to keep flyin', but also never let them have enough to outfit everyone with tactical alliance battle armor, because nothing will ever challenge them again short of DM fiat. Find a way to keep them constantly in a range where they can't afford not to take your crazy plothooks, as that was where the show was.

I've seen a system to deal with this (not in Serenty) -- basically, let the players sell wealth for XP. What actually happens is the character takes a problem onto themselves (a part of their ship breaks down, they lose money gambling, an old debt comes to call) that wipes out some of their wealth, and they get XP in exchange.

This can be more fun than simply taking resources away from the players via fiat, and makes earning money still attractive.

Alternatively, you can make it clear that any financial improvement over their baseline station will be temporary. Spend it, enjoy it, but it will go away.

Morgan_Scott82
2007-07-12, 01:52 PM
I missed this topic when it first started up, but I have to weigh in now.

I'm totally infatuated with this system, I may even love it but its too soon to say for certain.

It reminds me of my days playing the old WEG d6 system. I'm actually working on adapting the Serenity system to a WW2 roleplay I want to run in the near future.

One of my favorite points is that skills aren't tied to particular attributes, that everything is up in the air and can be modified to fit a particular situation is awsome. Just in general I like the way the system is a little bit fast and loose with the rules is great. I like that in combat the degree of success is automatically relevant to how much damage the attack did. I like how general the general skills are, one of my biggest frustrations with d20 modern has to be the fact that building something, repairing that something, and disableing that same something require three different skills, Serenity if anything goes too far in the other direction making Flamethrowers the same general skill as Artillery, but only up to the point that you have to specialize.

Its taking me a while to adapt to the different probability realities of a stepped die system instead of a single die or die pool system, but once you get the hang of it estimating DC gets a lot easier. All in all I really, really like the system