Help Locating a Template

[samduke]

As the Title suggests I am looking for help with locating a Template.

The Template should be along these lines...

applies to: any living, corporeal creature
OR
applies to: undead

either is fine But they must type becomes monstrous humanoid

I have done some looking but my google-fu is failing me - is there such a template out there 3.0/3.5 materials are fine just need source, if in a dragon magazine I would need issue and page.
thanks

[Jack_Simth]

As the Title suggests I am looking for help with locating a Template.

The Template should be along these lines...

applies to: any living, corporeal creature
OR
applies to: undead

either is fine But they must type becomes monstrous humanoid

I have done some looking but my google-fu is failing me - is there such a template out there 3.0/3.5 materials are fine just need source, if in a dragon magazine I would need issue and page.
thanksI can think of a combination of templates that will do that... but the end result has serious drawbacks, so the question becomes "why"? What's your end goal?

[Gildedragon]

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?281882-3-5-Master-Template-List-(sorted)

Pretty much every template is there
There doesn't seem to be any that fits. Not even by chaining the templates. Can get you to humanoid but not monstrous (Dustform > Incarnate Construct) but most humanoid into monstrous humanoid are inherited (and thus would need to be applied before Incarnate)
What are you trying to template?

[Jack_Simth]

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?281882-3-5-Master-Template-List-(sorted)

Pretty much every template is there
There doesn't seem to be any that fits. Not even by chaining the templates. Can get you to humanoid but not monstrous (Dustform > Incarnate Construct) but most humanoid into monstrous humanoid are inherited (and thus would need to be applied before Incarnate)
What are you trying to template?

Dustform (Any Living -> Construct) > Incarnate Construct (Construct -> Humanoid) -> Thoon Thrall (Humanoid -> Monstrous Humanoid).

However: The drawbacks are absurd.

Could also go
Aleax (Any Creature -> Construct) > Incarnate Construct (Construct -> Humanoid) -> Thoon Thrall (Humanoid -> Monstrous Humanoid)

[ExLibrisMortis]

Undead are typically ex-living, so it's possible to use (true) resurrection and then change to monstrous humanoid. Alternatively, you can use polymorph any object to change your type.

[the_david]

If you're the DM you can forget about the template and just turn your creature into a monstrous humanoid. There are rules for creature types in the back of the monster manual, so you just need to change the things that differ from the original creature type. (Hit dice, saves, skills, etc.)

If you're a player I can't help you. Maybe you can ask your DM. Maybe.

May I ask what this is for? More details would probably help us figure this out a bit quicker.

[samduke]

questions on what is this for -a PC-

the -
Aleax (Any Creature -> Construct) > Incarnate Construct (Construct -> Humanoid) -> Thoon Thrall (Humanoid -> Monstrous Humanoid) - is interesting

I thought there might be a way on the undead, necropolitain or something but anyways I will look that link over though se eif some odd combo might work

[Jack_Simth]

questions on what is this for -a PC-

the - - is interesting

I thought there might be a way on the undead, necropolitain or something but anyways I will look that link over though se eif some odd combo might work

Well, there's few templates that turn an undead creature into something other than an undead creature.

If it's for a PC, then you've got a problem: There are a number of templates that are LA -, rather than having an actual LA - which means they're not suitable for player use, officially.

If you need to go from a very specific type to monstrous humanoid, that's a LOT easier. Arbitrarily turning just about any creature into a monstrous humanoid? Very difficult.

[Divide by Zero]

If you explain what exactly you're starting with and why you need to make that change, perhaps we could find another workaround?

[samduke]

DM says make the biggest bad*&! creature you can at ECL 4, most 3.0/3.5 sources are accepted..
my thought Tauric Creature..
to that end this is where I have it I think it works by RAW.. in theory

top
Vanara
Magic-Blooded (Dragon #306)
Effigy
Incarnate Construct

bottom
Phynxkin (Dragon Magic 116) -base creature
Magebred (Eb p295)
Chameleon (Und p83)
Mineral Warrior (Und p96)
Woodling (MM3 p198)
Symbiotic Creature (ss 131)
Half-Fey (FF p89)
Half-Celestial (MM 144)
Half-Troll (FF 93)
Half-Minotaur (DR313 p94)
Half-Ogre (DR313 p95)
Primordial Giant (SoX p81)
Spellwarped (MM3 162)
Dungeonbred (Dungeonscape 112)
Half-dragon (mm 146) (RotD p70)
Aleax (BoED 158)
Incarnate Construct (SS 120)
Feral (SS 115)
Monster of legend (MM2 p213) (3.5up p35)
Half-Illithid (Und 89)
Shadow (MotP 190)
Paragon template (ELH 209)

[Gildedragon]

Pretty sure you've exceeded ECL 4

[samduke]

Pretty sure you've exceeded ECL 4

pretty sure that as it sits it is ECL 2 ( as tauric is +3 based only on the humanoid side and the animal side is completely ignored for LA, with Incarnate Construct that drops the LA to +1 )
so LA+1 and 1 class level = 2 ECL last I checked

[MisterKaws]

DM says make the biggest bad*&! creature you can at ECL 4, most 3.0/3.5 sources are accepted..
my thought Tauric Creature..
to that end this is where I have it I think it works by RAW.. in theory

top
Vanara
Magic-Blooded (Dragon #306)
Effigy
Incarnate Construct

bottom
Phynxkin (Dragon Magic 116) -base creature
Magebred (Eb p295)
Chameleon (Und p83)
Mineral Warrior (Und p96)
Woodling (MM3 p198)
Symbiotic Creature (ss 131)
Half-Fey (FF p89)
Half-Celestial (MM 144)
Half-Troll (FF 93)
Half-Minotaur (DR313 p94)
Half-Ogre (DR313 p95)
Primordial Giant (SoX p81)
Spellwarped (MM3 162)
Dungeonbred (Dungeonscape 112)
Half-dragon (mm 146) (RotD p70)
Aleax (BoED 158)
Incarnate Construct (SS 120)
Feral (SS 115)
Monster of legend (MM2 p213) (3.5up p35)
Half-Illithid (Und 89)
Shadow (MotP 190)
Paragon template (ELH 209)


Effigy is not legal for PCs.

[Dromuthra]

The worst single template abuse I've ever seen would be this thread. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?284796-The-real-way-to-break-the-Symbiote-Template-and-the-best-LA-1-for-a-wizard). However, if you go that far, there's not really much point in playing DnD anymore.

[Jack_Simth]

Effigy is not legal for PCs.

Yep. Top half has an LA of -, and - +3 = -. Also has a HD problem for ECL 4. +3 LA from Tauric, 1 HD from the Phynxkin, and one HD from the base humanoid (special clause for Tauric). So even just subbing the top critter for a basic human or something, it'd still be ECL 5.

[Divide by Zero]

I found this (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=16918028&postcount=6) at ECL 10. You can drop it to ECL 5 by taking off the class levels, but I'm not sure how to bring it down to 4 and looking at it is starting to give me a headache.

[Jack_Simth]

I found this (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=16918028&postcount=6) at ECL 10. You can drop it to ECL 5 by taking off the class levels, but I'm not sure how to bring it down to 4 and looking at it is starting to give me a headache.

Oh, that's simple. The "Host" is what determines nearly all of the ECL. Remove the various bits that just apply to the host, and you're fine. Basically the Tauric template all over again.

[Vizzerdrix]

Obah blessed incarnate tauric warforged maybe?

[Inevitability]

The Yuan-Ti Tainted One template (MoF + online update) says it can be applied to 'any human'. No restrictions on corporeality, no restrictions on type, any human can just drink a yuan-ti's foul brew, get this template, and become a monstrous humanoid. It gives a 1/day poison ability, a 3/day polymorph ability, spell resistance (that will be near-useless at high levels) and some other stuff.

Even if you aren't quite human, you can take Human Heritage to qualify for the template. Just say your great-grandfather was a human with a vanara fetish.

[Yogibear41]

Feral Template from SS makes you a monstrous Humanoid. Surprised no one has mentioned it yet.

Believe there is a prestige class in one of the dragon magazines that has to do with waking the Tarrasque up which also turns you into a monstrous humanoid if I recall, was either a 3 level or a 5 level class, that might suit your needs too.

[Divide by Zero]

Feral Template from SS makes you a monstrous Humanoid. Surprised no one has mentioned it yet.

Believe there is a prestige class in one of the dragon magazines that has to do with waking the Tarrasque up which also turns you into a monstrous humanoid if I recall, was either a 3 level or a 5 level class, that might suit your needs too.

Feral can only be applied to a humanoid or monstrous humanoid (and it's inherited so it can't be applied to an incarnate construct), which really limits its use in this situation. Likewise, you probably aren't going to pull off even a 3-level PrC at ECL 4.

[ShurikVch]

DM says make the biggest bad*&! creature you can at ECL 4, most 3.0/3.5 sources are accepted..
my thought Tauric Creature..
to that end this is where I have it I think it works by RAW.. in theory

top
Vanara
Magic-Blooded (Dragon #306)
Effigy
Incarnate Construct

bottom
Phynxkin (Dragon Magic 116) -base creature
Magebred (Eb p295)
Chameleon (Und p83)
Mineral Warrior (Und p96)
Woodling (MM3 p198)
Symbiotic Creature (ss 131)
Half-Fey (FF p89)
Half-Celestial (MM 144)
Half-Troll (FF 93)
Half-Minotaur (DR313 p94)
Half-Ogre (DR313 p95)
Primordial Giant (SoX p81)
Spellwarped (MM3 162)
Dungeonbred (Dungeonscape 112)
Half-dragon (mm 146) (RotD p70)
Aleax (BoED 158)
Incarnate Construct (SS 120)
Feral (SS 115)
Monster of legend (MM2 p213) (3.5up p35)
Half-Illithid (Und 89)
Shadow (MotP 190)
Paragon template (ELH 209)
1) With what it's "Symbiotic Creature"?
2) Phynxkin is illegal for "Incarnate Construct", because isn't "Humanoid-shaped"

pretty sure that as it sits it is ECL 2 ( as tauric is +3 based only on the humanoid side and the animal side is completely ignored for LA, with Incarnate Construct that drops the LA to +1 )
so LA+1 and 1 class level = 2 ECL last I checked1) Are you forgot about racial HD from "bottom" part? Unless you get ½ (or less) HD on both "top" and "bottom", you should get at least 2 HD before any class levels
2) No, Incarnate Construct doesn't drops the LA to +1, because Incarnate Construct doesn't drops LA below +0, so top's LA will be +0, not -2 (assuming you will find something better than Effigy, which isn't suitable for PC)

[samduke]

Officially, the Dungeons and Dragons 3.5 rules from the Monster Manual for applying templates supersede the Dungeons and Dragons, Third Edition rules from Savage Species, including that text's type pyramid
If a template changes the base creature’s type, the creature also acquires the augmented subtype (see page 306) unless the template description indicates otherwise. The augmented subtype is always paired with the creature’s original type. For example, a unicorn with the half-celestial template is an outsider with the augmented magical beast subtype. Unless a template indicates otherwise, the new creature has the traits of the new type but the features of the original type.

the incarnate part that describes head arms legs ect.. is an example only, nothing says otherwise.

as for the effigy template - well then there is probably some other non-la or low-la way to replace that feature..

as for tauric as a whole the only LA comes from the humanoid side period as incarnate subtracts 2 la from the total 3-2=1 LA, - but this may go up due to replacing effigy, and yes I took into account the 2 RHD 1 from human 1 from animal for 4 ECL 2RHD+2 LA its possibe to reduce that hd to 1RHD via necropolitan then it converts to class level -

as for the symbiotic guest - undecided

[ShurikVch]

the incarnate part that describes head arms legs ect.. is an example only, nothing says otherwise.The only way to apply Incarnate Construct template is to cast Incarnate Construct spell
This spell turns a humanoid-shaped construct into a living creature.


as for tauric as a whole the only LA comes from the humanoid side period as incarnate subtracts 2 la from the total 3-2=1 LAIncarnate Construct subtracts 2 from Humanoid, not from Tauric Creature; if your base humanoid had LA: +2 (or more) - good for you; otherwise - all which go below 0 is wasted

as for the effigy template - well then there is probably some other non-la or low-la way to replace that feature..Lowest I'm aware of is Dustform Creature with LA: +2; lower - only Warforged...

and yes I took into account the 2 RHD 1 from human 1 from animal for 4 ECL 2RHD+2 LA its possibe to reduce that hd to 1RHD via necropolitan then it converts to class levelCommon practice among DM is to enforce PC to take back all lost racial HD; otherwise Vampires would suddenly become the most handshakable people among races with racial HD :smallwink:

[samduke]

sometime I wish people would read the information - the update d&d update booklet - most recent source for tauric creature on page 36 - states:
monstrous humanoid, 10ft/5ft, intimidate +5, jump +13, listen+8, move silently +5, spot +7, alertness, great fortitude, iron will, LA BASE HUMANOID +3 - meaning the human portion of the tauric template is where the LA+3 happens, the animal portion ignores all LA.
done.

[ShurikVch]

sometime I wish people would read the information - the update d&d update booklet - most recent source for tauric creature on page 36 - states:
done.And how it contradict me?

[MisterKaws]

sometime I wish people would read the information - the update d&d update booklet - most recent source for tauric creature on page 36 - states:
done.

And what about it? It's still a minimum ECL 5 template, since it takes 1hd minimum from each part, and then adds 3 LA.

And you can't use Effigy to reduce LA because it's LA -, and that means "forbidden for players".