Special Mount/ Animal Companion stacking!

[Melcar]

Ok so in another post, I asked some questions about Griffon cavalry. This has something to do with that build, but since I deviates from that build specifically to more general understanding of the rules, I felt a new threat fitted better. And thanks to everyone for the suggestions for the other build. Here goes...


Is is possible to combine prestige paladin with normal paladin? Say a level: 4 paladin/ 2 prestige paladin would treat special mount as a level 9 paladin??

Would it be possible to combine Ranger Knight from DM #317 and Prestige paladin? Both have special mounts that count as a paladin of class level +5 and +3 respectively.

When combining special mount and animal companion, through Devoted Tracker feat, is the druid still under the (-X) when getting an animal companion of higher CR/HD? A griffon is attainable at level 6 druid; would that then mean that it would be druid level (-5)? My earlier example had my beast master at effective druid level 9. Would that then mean, that it only got the bonuses as a normal level 4 druid; thus +2 HD, +2nat, etc.? I am unsure how this works!

As always thank you in advance for all your help! :smallbiggrin:

[Khedrac]

Is is possible to combine prestige paladin with normal paladin? Say a level: 4 paladin/ 2 prestige paladin would treat special mount as a level 9 paladin??The rules for the variant prestige classes say that they should not be used in the same game (let alone on the same character).
If you use any of the variant classes presented here, the standard version of the class should be unavailable. For instance, you shouldn't include both the standard paladin character class and the paladin prestige class in the same game. As a DM your mileage may vary, but combining on the same character is strongly discouraged.

I don't have later Dragon issues so I cannot comment on Ranger Knight.

The Devoted Tracker feat does not allow you to choose your mount from the animal companion list, instead it allows you to transfer your animal companion abilities to your special mount. Note, it does not allow you to add ranger and paladin levels for determining the abilities of the special mount (or animal companion) so you can only choose a mount that your paladin levels allow you to get on their own. What you do is work out what mount you can get from being a Paladin X, and then work out what boosts your companion will get from being a ranger Y (since it does not say otherwise we have to assume that you use Y/2 as your effective druid level) and apply those benefits to the special mount.

[Twurps]

Would it be possible to combine Ranger Knight from DM #317 and Prestige paladin? Both have special mounts that count as a paladin of class level +5 and +3 respectively.


Yes you can, and it would give a +8 to your paladin mount level. (This is providing your DM chooses not to use the regular paladins in his game, and instead use prestige paladins.) It sounds a bit crazy, but far crazier things have happened with prestige paladin. (or Dragon mag. for that matter)

[Melcar]

Thank you for your replies.

I still have trouble understanding whether or not a special mount is under the normal rules of an animal companion of higher HD or CR. Some animals can be choosing at first level druid, some later. If you by chance have a mount that is of a kind that would come online as an animal companion at later druid levels. Let’s say at level 7 you would calculate the bonuses with a -6 to the effective druid level. So would a griffon as a mount be effected by this also or not? Because the build that I am hopelessly trying to build, would be effective level 18 paladin and 12 druids. So it would get +10 HD from the special mount bonus, but I am unsure of how much bonus any special mount would get for also being the animal companion through the use of devoted tracker. I know the feats talks about ranger levels, but a level 12 druid must then be level 24 ranger.

Again thank you for your help

[Khedrac]

You ignore when an animal companion would come online - because you are not using a druidic animal companion.

You choose a mount from your paladin variant's range of special mounts.
You then apply the animal companion boosts for a druid of your druid level to your paladin's mount.

It is irrelevant when of if a druid ever gets that creature as a companion - because it is not taking it as a companion, but as a paladin's mount (OK an enhanced mount).

If you had a mount that for paladin mount abilities counted as paladin level -n then I would apply the -n to the druid level for companion abilities as well, but that would be a houserule as the rules are unclear.

Personally I don't see how you are getting a griffon as a paldin's mount in order to apply this feat; but I accept I don't know everything involved hence I am not querying that.
If your griffon is not your "paladin's special mount" then this feat does not apply as it only applies animal companion bonuses to a paladin's special mount.
If you choose to ride your animal companion, instead of calling a special mount, then normal animal companion rules apply and the palain powers have no effect on your mount.

[Melcar]

You ignore when an animal companion would come online - because you are not using a druidic animal companion.

You choose a mount from your paladin variant's range of special mounts.
You then apply the animal companion boosts for a druid of your druid level to your paladin's mount.

It is irrelevant when of if a druid ever gets that creature as a companion - because it is not taking it as a companion, but as a paladin's mount (OK an enhanced mount).

If you had a mount that for paladin mount abilities counted as paladin level -n then I would apply the -n to the druid level for companion abilities as well, but that would be a houserule as the rules are unclear.

Personally I don't see how you are getting a griffon as a paldin's mount in order to apply this feat; but I accept I don't know everything involved hence I am not querying that.
If your griffon is not your "paladin's special mount" then this feat does not apply as it only applies animal companion bonuses to a paladin's special mount.
If you choose to ride your animal companion, instead of calling a special mount, then normal animal companion rules apply and the palain powers have no effect on your mount.

The Paladin’s mount is a griffon. It’s just an unusual mount as per the rules in DMG, page 204-205. That’s how Im gaining it. Simply by choosing it instead of a regular war horse. Therefore, the Devoted Tracker would indeed be effective here. The Griffon is gained at level 8 instead of normal level 5, because it should be 4 CR lower than the effective paladin level for mount. That means that if I can become effective level 18 paladin, the Griffon will gain the full amount of bonuses possible for being a mount.

The druid can actually choose a griffon as animal companion at level 6, so that’s why I was wondering whether it would be force in under this rule because is was both. But I guess that even though the druid cannot gain the Griffon at level 1, it is not under that rules and therefore I should not calculate my druid level as being 5 lower, as I normally would have done when getting a stronger animal companion, because even though the Griffon is my animal companion it is my special paladin’s mount first.

Seeing as my build ended op at effective level 18 paladin and effectively level 12 druid my Griffon receives: 18 bonus HD, 18 bonus nat. AC, 8 str/ 4 dex, 5 bonus tricks, and have 9 int. As well as having Empathic link, improved evasion, share spells, share saving throws, Improved speed, Command creatures of its kind, Spell resistance, Link, share spells, Evasion, Devotion, Multiattack.

I think I finally figured out how to calculate the combined bonuses, I still however have to find out whether or not its possible to combine ride-by and flyby… but I think that might be for another threat. Be warned! :smallbiggrin: