Becoming a 20 man raid boss! (HP help)

[Bluuegg]

Hello forums! TL:DR after text

I have an unexpected game starting in less then 24 hours! The DM is green and I'd like to be able to focus on helping her run the session when I'm not focuses on my character.

My remedy for this is to make the largest HP sponge I can so I can just kind of run in and support the group while keeping an eye on the mechanics and game flow.

I will be playing a Hill Dwarf and starting at level 2. We will be running this campaign in an accelerated way with xp and we will be leveling with every session to level 5 then adding a session per level until 10. So progression should be quick.

I am unfortunately unversed with the barbarian and Druid in 5th edition and it seems these classes have the bones for the highest hit points, the I am not limited to just these classes. Any help on this would be greatly appreciated.

TL:DR
Goal : tons of hit points! Layouts appreciated but not required.
Info: level 2 starting, quick leveling
Hill Dwarf preferred
Feats allowed
Keep it simple (new DM)
Bonus : usefullness in combat is not necessary but isn't unwelcome!

Thanks everyone in advance.

[JeffreyGator]

So you probably want to read more about Barbarians and Moon Druids as HP batteries.

For a Hill Dwarf I would think about Monk1/Moon Druid X.

If you switched to Mountain dwarf you could look at fighter 1-2/Barbarian X.

The fighting style and 1/short rest second wind definitely add to the barbarian damage soaking capability.

You could also play the not taking damage fighter with heavy armor shield and defense style. AC 20+ Get shield master and battlemaster to avoid more damage.

[ImKaaarn]

I'm running my current character the same as you're aiming so maybe you might find something useful from what I'm doing.

It's a hill dwarf barbarian.
I chose barbarian because at level 3 I got to choose a totem path with the bear feature.
What it gives you is half damage to all damage except psychic when enraged, which is beefy.
I set my character up to have max CON and high DEX with little care for STR at the moment and the way barbarian works is that your CON and DEX modifiers are added together with 10 to determine your unarmoured AC (so 5 in both gives you a flat 20 without using shields). So not only are you rarely getting hit, when you are hit, it's no biggie.

I haven't been playing so much to assist the party, more so to keep myself alive and it works like a charm. I've still been able to do good damage even though I've been keeping a shield at all time.
Something I may note is that I intend to get the tough feat at later levels which'll maximize HP in the end.

I should also note that my buddy is a Paladin with max STR, and he's a damage soaker as well but also does an insane amount of damage paring his spells with his attacks, and in addition he can heal himself and others. This however is more complicated than a barbarian with the spell choices whereas barbarian are pretty damn simply.

I'd suggest a Hill Dwarf Barbarian though
Hit Points: Damn high, Barbarian 1d12 hit die with CON Modifier+1 HP per level (I'm level 6 with 80ish)
Feats: Tough makes you supa tough later on
Simple: Barbarian is really simple, you rage and hit and move around fast
Bonus : Fairly good attack even being CON based

[Bluuegg]

Thank you guys for the replies here! I am weighing the pros and cons for both the HP Bear Druid and the Bear Totem Barbarian(or BTB). Both seem really fun for different reasons.
In the end, it seems the BTB has more overall lasting power with effectively x2 HP in most situations. But the Idea of being a HP hoarding Bear is just so appealing! The overall simplicity of the BTB has me leaning that way as well...

[Dark Ass4ssin 1]

Early level the Barbie is going to tank the crap out of everybody else, but as the scale shifts the druids get the advantage. This is because things begin to get around resistance to nonmagical damage, and the druids get multiple health bars that all have to be dealt with.

But(ts) for simplicity the barbarian is the best option, and open up for better multiclass dipping.

[JNAProductions]

Early level the Barbie is going to tank the crap out of everybody else, but as the scale shifts the druids get the advantage. This is because things begin to get around resistance to nonmagical damage, and the druids get multiple health bars that all have to be dealt with.

But(ts) for simplicity the barbarian is the best option, and open up for better multiclass dipping.

Barbarians resist ALL physical damage. Not just non-magical.

[Dark Ass4ssin 1]

Barbarians resist ALL physical damage. Not just non-magical.

Whoops, just checked and your right. But still, if the game doesn't just end at the higher levels the druid is still gonna have like 3 health bars per short rest with some serious Hp.

[Farecry]

Why not do both?

[Bluuegg]

Why not do both?

Can I barbarian rage while in bear wildshape? x_x

[Bluuegg]

I can't seem to figure out how to determine how much HP shifting into a brown bear would grant at later levels. Does it always stay at a set "34" as listed in the MM, or is there a number I'm missing that let's me determine differently as a druid would level up?

Follow up to the above ; if the hit points were to remain static with each form, how does this net a druid more health then most classes?

[Farecry]

Yes you can as you keep your class abilities. And you get better beasties to change into that have more hp.

[Douglas]

I can't seem to figure out how to determine how much HP shifting into a brown bear would grant at later levels. Does it always stay at a set "34" as listed in the MM, or is there a number I'm missing that let's me determine differently as a druid would level up?

Follow up to the above ; if the hit points were to remain static with each form, how does this net a druid more health then most classes?
If you keep shifting into a brown bear, then yes it will always stay at 34. So you shift into things like polar bears, elephants, various dinosaurs, etc. instead as you level up.

The primary way this gets druids more health is that, when those 34 hp are gone, your normal druid-as-a-human (or whatever) hp are completely untouched. And then you turn into a bear again and you have 34 hp again, and you go through all of those and turn back into a human and still have full normal hp. Minus any overflow from the hits that turned you back, but still.

[Cespenar]

Can I barbarian rage while in bear wildshape? x_x

Yep. So, at level 3, you get basically 34x2 + 34x2 + your normal hit points (against physical damage anyway), if you use everything you have. Normally, one rage + one bear form is enough for one hard encounter.

It's crazy good in lower levels, and still moderately effective in later levels.

[Bluuegg]

I'd like to again thank everyone for their input on this thread. It's very much appreciated.


Yep. So, at level 3, you get basically 34x2 + 34x2 + your normal hit points (against physical damage anyway), if you use everything you have. Normally, one rage + one bear form is enough for one hard encounter.

It's crazy good in lower levels, and still moderately effective in later levels.

That does seem very powerful at low levels! How would you try and stay as relevant as possible as you progress into higher levels? Also, I'm guessing that you would mainly level Druid for more forms and dip into Barbarian for the access to rage?

[Cespenar]

That does seem very powerful at low levels! How would you try and stay as relevant as possible as you progress into higher levels? Also, I'm guessing that you would mainly level Druid for more forms and dip into Barbarian for the access to rage?

Yep, later it's Barbarian 1/Druid X, and staying relevant is not an issue, since you get better shapes with even more HP and damage, and also eventually with swimming and flying speeds. Not to mention that your awesome druid spells will always be there. I usually open with an Entangle, and then wild shape as a bonus action and close up with my move.

Also your exploration capabilities will be through the roof. Even before shapes with flying speed, you can jump amazing distances as a raging lion (adv. on Athletics), or skitter on the ceiling as a giant spider. The spider form even has a +7 stealth modifier and blindsight to boot, if you want to take over the scouting role.

[Sir cryosin]

Your forgetting a moon druid can burn there spell slots to heal while in there animal form. We had a moon druid solo a adult red dragon.

[JellyPooga]

Level 1: Barbarian - Rage = Resistance
Level 2-3: Moon Druid - Wild Shape = Temp HP (effectively)
Level 4-8: Rogue - Uncanny Dodge = Double Resistance
Level 9-10: Warlock - Armour of Agathys = Temp HP (actual)

You don't have a great offensive capability and your spellcasting is woefully lacking for a 10th level character, but you can soak damage like a Boss on steroids.

HP = 12+9d8+10x(Con mod) +34 per Wild Shape (Brown Bear) +5 per spell slot level spent on AoA. Effectively doubled for Resistance and doubled again for Uncanny Dodge.

That's an average of roughly 300 base HP (with Con mod +1 and the Hill Dwarf Bonus; with higher Con, this increases fairly significantly, obviously, with each +1 effectively granting an additional 40HP), +260 per short rest from Wild Shape plus an extra 10 tempHP per short rest and another 40 per long rest (assuming Arcane Trickster and expending all slots on AoA). Assuming 2 short rests a day, that's a total of around 900 HP a day, give or take, at level 10.

It's not quite an accurate tally, as you can only Rage 2/long rest and Uncanny Dodge is only against a single attack per round AND it largely ignores non-weapon damage coming your way, but you're still looking at a solid 600+ HP per day.

[ruy343]

OK, so everyone on here is focusing (rightly) on the abilities that those two classes have to give you more hit points. Truly, if you want to be an HP sponge, a barbarian is a great way to go (because rage really lets you get the most out of healing spells, since all physical damage is halved, and bear totem barbs halve all damage), and at early levels, moon druid is amazing as a HP sponge. Barbarians are also easy to play, so you can help the DM out as you mentioned earlier.

However, you can still go the Fighter (Champion) Route, and be tough to kill by virtue of having a very high AC. Although you could get a few extra hit points and damage resistance as a barbarian, the highest your AC could be (with standard array) at that level is 18 (starting with a +2 in dex and a +3 in con, ASI to raise one of those, using a shield). However, a champion fighter with defense fighting style wearing Half Plate and shield (I'm assuming that you don't quite have the wealth yet to have Full Plate) is 20, with the possibility to actually put your dexterity score somewhere else (like wisdom or intelligence), and put your ASI into Strength instead of a score that increases AC. You're not as Multi-Ability Dependent (MAD), and the character is a bit simpler. Also, with access to second wind on a short-rest basis, you might be able to heal yourself and stay afloat longer than the barbarian might without magical support. (If you do have full plate, that goes up to 21!)

Why is a higher AC important? For a creature with a +4 to hit, they would hit the AC18 barbarian 3/10 swings, while the AC 20 half-plate fighter would only be hit on 2/10 of their swings - a 33% reduction in damage. Not taking damage is huge! Of course, this is assuming both the barbarian and champion would use shields, along with the assumption of a +4 to-hit (which is a bit low at that level), but nonetheless, it's a significant damage reduction that's always active.

This is all in contrast, of course, to the bear form that the druid has access to. although it does come with 34 hit points, its AC isn't all that great, so although it can soak the damage, it tends to go through the bonus HP rather quickly.

In other words, you can still achieve what you were aiming for as a champion fighter, and you'll still be incredible at doing it. Don't underestimate the champ!

But, if you're interested in making things interesting... A Fighter (Eldritch Knight) with the shield spell available to them a few times per day and access to the blade ward cantrip can be even tankier on demand (at a loss of extra criticals, which can be super-fun)...

EDIT: OOF! I forgot the most important point to this post: Your DM is green. Many new DMs don't really know how to handle Moon Druids, and they may impose penalties on your character if they perceive it as too powerful or too complex. I'm not saying that your DM is going to do this, but it's something to keep in mind - if you're a simple character, your DM will likely thank you.

[JellyPooga]

However, you can still go the Fighter (Champion) Route, and be tough to kill by virtue of having a very high AC.

High AC and related abilities is also another peg for Rogue. Level 7 Rogue grants Evasion; no damage from [Dex for Half] effects is a massive boon in some campaigns, especially those that involve dragons (and their ilk) and arcanists as foes. Rogue also has a decent AC combined with Barbarian; even unarmoured, a Rogue with good Dex and Con can expect an AC in the 20's if using a shield and additionally, with advantage and double proficiency from Expertise, a Rogue/Barbarian has a remarkable offence from knock-downs if he picks up Shield Master.

Rogue 7/Barbarian 2/Druid 2 is level 11 but is about as tanky as it gets and also has decent offensive capabilities.

[Farecry]

You're assuming that the barbarian won't be wearing armor. Wearing the same armor plus shield as a barb, you are only losing 1 ac compared to the champion you described. Taking half damage when you get hit, by anything(almost).

[ruy343]

The last two posters here have made good points, but I fear that both are making an assumption about having feats (the rogue would need to pick up medium armor proficiency to use a shield, and a barbarian, with standard proficiencies, can only use +2 of their dex modifier with medium armor, making their total still 18). I'm not saying that it isn't possible to have a higher AC due to various game effects, and since he's 4th level, it's find for those classes to have those feats, but my point is that the champion fighter doesn't need to use that feat to add to his defensive capability - his ASI could go into strength or the "tough" feat (which actually might be a great choice for the character he's going for).

[JellyPooga]

The last two posters here have made good points, but I fear that both are making an assumption about having feats (the rogue would need to pick up medium armor proficiency to use a shield

Not so much. A straight Rogue is a surprisingly good tank, but really needs multiclassing to do it effectively. Whichever MC he goes for, he'll get shield proficiency without having to burn a Feat. By Multiclassing, he delays his access to them, or an ASI, for sure and perhaps Multiclassing shouldn't be an assumption either.


and a barbarian, with standard proficiencies, can only use +2 of their dex modifier with medium armor, making their total still 18). I'm not saying that it isn't possible to have a higher AC due to various game effects, and since he's 4th level, it's find for those classes to have those feats, but my point is that the champion fighter doesn't need to use that feat to add to his defensive capability - his ASI could go into strength or the "tough" feat (which actually might be a great choice for the character he's going for).

A Barbarian can have 20 AC with a shield; no better or worse than a Full-plate & Shield Fighter. The same can be said of any worthwhile Barbarian multiclass, too. A Fighter, aside from having more ASI's/Feats than other Classes, has no significant advantage as far as AC is concerned compared to other martials, except where heavy armour negates the need for Dex (though, in my opinion, no Fighter should neglect their Dex score).

[Naanomi]

The most basic, straightforward approach is:

Hill Dwarf Barbarian 20, with point buy go...
15/14/17/8/10/9
ASI... (+1 STR/+1 CON), +2 STR, +2 STR, +2 CON, Toughness)
HP at level 20 is... 19d12+212... between 231 and 440... average 335.5... 'Adventure League' HP of 345

Battle Rager for refillable temp HP battery, or Totem for Bear's 'virtual double HP'

Use a Shield and Battle Axe; wear armor as available if it can beat your Unarmored (Half-Plate will win until level 16, when Beard Armor will tie; and at level 20 the Beard Armor beats it by 2