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View Full Version : Gish builds? =\



Nightblade
2007-06-29, 07:18 PM
I've always wanted to play a gish though I'm not sure how to build a decent gish.

The Abjurant Champion seems like a good bet, perhaps mixed with Swashbuckler (Insightful Strike) if I play an Int-based caster. The only problem is that despite his strong abilities, there are a very small selection of (from what I've seen) good Abjuration spells from the Wizard/Sorcerer list to take advantage of that are general use. I said few, not that they don't exist.

The Duskblade also seems strong, but seems to lack something. I thought about multiclassing with Fighter and adding Lasher or Master of Chains.

Eldritch Knight seems like a good fit, but is a non-gestalt Fighter/Wizard by the looks of it. I've never seen one of these played, but it has never had a lot of appeal.

Adding Marshal in there also seemed like a fun idea, especially for a mixed social/combat game. I'll take any and all advice. Materials available to me would be the Core, PHB2, Complete books, Sword and Fist, Song and Silence, Defenders of the Faith, Masters of the Wild, Tome and Blood, Oriental Adventures, Miniatures Handbook, Spell Compendium, and possibly some stuff from Tome of Battle.

Nightblade
2007-06-30, 12:48 AM
Sorry for the double post, but it seems I posted this in the wrong section. If one of the mods could move it, that'd be excellent.

Nebo_
2007-06-30, 04:04 AM
I think this is the wrong section, but I like gishes, so I'll talk. Duskblade doesn't get much of the stuff that makes other Gish builds good: buffs. It's a nice class, but full casting is much nicer. Abjurant Champion should be included in every Gish build somewhere, don't go without it. Swashbuckler is good for a wizard based Gish, but insightful strike comes at level 3 and I don't like taking more than two levels of a non casting class. I'm playing a Gish at the moment and I'm using this build: Sorcerer 4/Fighter 2/Spellsword 1/Abjurant Champion 5/Eldritch Knight 7. If you're in an Eberron game, then Eldritch knight should be replaced with Knight Phantom, from Five Nations.

InaVegt
2007-06-30, 04:06 AM
Jade phoenix mage from Tome of Battle is a nice one, martial adept capable of casting arcane spells who can explode 1/week.

Nebo_
2007-06-30, 04:10 AM
I agree, the ability to explode is a key component of any good Gish build. :p

InaVegt
2007-06-30, 04:14 AM
I agree, the ability to explode is a key component of any good Gish build. :p

While that's mostly a flavor ability, it IS a good gish PrC, it gives up a few more caster levels than EK but gains lots of nice class abilities and martial adeptism.

Nightblade
2007-06-30, 04:28 AM
I'm beginning to realize that the Tome of Battle is really something I should read through entirely. Everytime I see something new in there, I'm impressed, in awe, and wondering how it balances against everything else. My DMs generally want characters balanced against each other, and the Tome of Battle characters seem very powerful in combat while retaining some social/knowledge/puzzle skills.

EDIT: Jade Phoenix Mage looks very powerful, and the requirements aren't hard to fill whatsoever.

Archaic
2007-07-28, 05:53 AM
Spellsword from Complete Warrior always strikes me as a perfect PrC. By 10th level you can wear mithral full plate and ignore the arcane failure % and the ability to channel spells through your weapon is pretty cool. Otherwise you're restricted to no armour or spending several feats getting Automatic Still Spell at epic levels. Add in the feat Arcane Strike and you've managed to offset the drawbacks to being a gish: it's hard to be in melee and casting spells at the same time. The main issue IMO is whether to go wizard or sorcerer with pure combat spells.
I've always like the notion of:
Fighter 2/Sorcerer 5/Spellsword 10/Dragon Disciple 10

Sure, no spell slots higher than 5th, but you get a lot of extra slots from DD and the iconic attack spells of fireball and lightning bolt are 3rd levels spells that cap out at 10d6 damage. Plus you get the ability enhancements you need from Dragon Disciple (+8 STR, +2 CON, +2 INT, +2 CHA) in order to be effective, as you don't really have much option for a dump stat.
I'd also favour the Draconic Might spell from Spell Compendium as it enhances STR, CON and CHA all in one casting.

The best spell, though, for the build you describe (using swashbuckler) would be the Wraithstrike spell (resolve melee attacks as touch attacks).

ZeroNumerous
2007-07-28, 06:07 AM
In all honesty, you're better off just going Duskblade 20. Very effective gish-out-of-the-box.