Advice on ranged Fighter

[Madbox]

Meet Roland Thompson, mercenary-turned-adventurer, master of the crossbow. He's probably going to be my character for the next campaign after my current one. I'm looking for advice and criticism on my build. Here's what I've got so far:

Race: Variant Human
Stats, in order of importance: Dex, Con, Wis, Cha, Str, Int
Starting Feat: Crossbow Expert
Background: Either Soldier or Mercenary (from SCAG)

Take 5 levels in Fighter, and for my ASI take sharpshooter. Have the Archery fighting style, and go for Battlemaster as my archetype. Get trip attack as a maneuver, undecided on others. Get a Great Crossbow ASAP. At some point, take a level dip in rogue for Sneak Attack, possibly two for cunning action.

How I see it working:

By level 3, I have my weapon and archetype. If burst damage is needed, then make a Trip Attack against a target in melee range (no disadvantage due to Crossbow Expert ), then Action surge for a second attack thanks to crossbow exert letting me ignore loading. I attack with advantage, as the target is within 5 feet and prone.

At level 4, this gets way better. With Sharpshooter, I can take a -5/+10 to my attack/damage. This looks really good when combined with advantage from a trip, and even better with multiattack at level 5.

A dip in rogue for sneak attack allows even more damage from sneak attack, and potentially cunning action.

So what do you all think? Any suggestions are welcome. I am trying to keep this AL legal, so keep that in mind.

Thanks!

[R.Shackleford]

Any reason this dude isn't just a rogue? Besides fluff?

I mean, the build is pretty basic and it seems if all you want to do is ranged damage then the rogue should work quite well without you needing to multiclass.

If you need trip attack then either get the feat (ok maybe not) or MC three levels of fighter.

[Madbox]

Mainly because I want to get multiattack. That, and I'm not huge on multiclassing. Two levels is stretching what I want to put up with already.

[Ghost Nappa]

I would either grab a Finesse weapon or raise your priority on STR. You're going to get caught into melee eventually.

You might also consider the Hunter Ranger.

[Grod_The_Giant]

Mainly because I want to get multiattack. That, and I'm not huge on multiclassing. Two levels is stretching what I want to put up with already.
I wouldn't go for it at all, then. Sneak Attack is only once per turn. A better dip would be Warlock for Hex, or Ranger for Hunter's Mark-- those will get you the same damage more consistently, along with other assorted goodies.

[Naanomi]

I'm a fan of just fighter 20 for this; sharpshooter can keep damage reasonable with 5+ attacks/round; battle master for tricks and damage; or eldritch knight for haste

[Madbox]

I would either grab a Finesse weapon or raise your priority on STR. You're going to get caught into melee eventually.

You might also consider the Hunter Ranger.
Crossbow Expert means I can attack with ranged weapons in melee.


I wouldn't go for it at all, then. Sneak Attack is only once per turn. A better dip would be Warlock for Hex, or Ranger for Hunter's Mark-- those will get you the same damage more consistently, along with other assorted goodies.
Good point, that would be way better.


I'm a fan of just fighter 20 for this; sharpshooter can keep damage reasonable with 5+ attacks/round; battle master for tricks and damage; or eldritch knight for haste

I haven't ruled out straight fighter yet. I am not a fan of multiclassing, to be honest.

[Farecry]

I'm playing a variant human battle master fighter 5/undying light warlock 3 right now with trip, precision, and goading attack. I picked up x-bow expert and sharpshooter as my feats and it's pretty fun to play. I took twf as my fighting style though so I could be as versatile as possible. I can effectively tank with l-sword and shield (half-plate), or I can use two s-swords/hand x-bow and wreak havoc with hex. Added on darkness/Devils sight for advantage on those sharpshooter shots, from up to 480 feet ignoring 1/2 and 3/4 cover. Planning on picking up dual wielder and war caster at 6 and 8 fighter levels respectively. On the maneuvers, goading attack is perfect for archers since they won't be close enough to choose you for attacks, precision for when you miss that -5/+10 and need it to hit, and trip attack for when you have melee/are melee ranged next to a hard foe.
If you do roll for stats, and you don't mind no stealth, you can bump strength up to 15 with good rolls and get plate later for an increase in ac.

[R.Shackleford]

Mainly because I want to get multiattack. That, and I'm not huge on multiclassing. Two levels is stretching what I want to put up with already.

How long do you think this game will go? If it isn't going to 11th level or 20th level then sticking with fighter doesn't really give you as much as it seems.

For a simple ranged character I would always go Rogue over Fighter as the Rogue gives you so much more at levels 1-10 that helps you get your shots off (at 4th and 10th level they have the same number of feats) and keeps you alive. If you go Mastermind then you won't really need trip attack as you will be giving advantage with a bonus action (fluff as shooting a creature off balance but they don't fall).

I'm biased because I see the Rogue as a better Fighter than the Fighter. So many things that are classical warrior show up with the Rogue instead of the Fighter. Plus with their dash/disengage/hide BA they just make better ranged characters.

The fighter's extra attack and earlier ASI or "bonus feat" just doesn't compare to all the toys the Rogue gives you (plus if you take Swashbuckler you can double up on initiative)

I've played a lot of Fighter and Rogue so I have my bias, take my advice with a dash of salt.

[bid]

Mainly because I want to get multiattack. That, and I'm not huge on multiclassing. Two levels is stretching what I want to put up with already.
Fighter 5, then rogue, has better DPR than straight fighter most levels.

OTOH, you already have 2 attacks from crossbow expert. This gives you a 3rd.

On the gripping hand, getting a 4th or a 5th has lesser value than extra SA dice.

[Foxhound438]

take precision attack as one of your maneuvers, it does quite nicely for canceling out the -5 to attack roll that sharpshooter's power attack gives you. Trip attack on the other hand might be a trap for you, since ranged attacks against prone targets are made at disadvantage. It could still be useful if you only use it on your last attack in a round, but it won't be your go-to on every hit.

For the rogue v. fighter argument, go fighter. 2 attacks with sharpshot outpaces rogue's higher sneak attack by miles. 2 level dip in rogue would be nice for cunning action, as would 3 for a boost to sneak attack damage, but as others have said 2 in warlock or ranger are generally better, as a hunter's mark/hex applies to every hit.

Ranger is a bit of a hard sell since the first level is flavor ribbons galore, while warlock gives you immediately once per short rest hex, and a second level gets you a second slot and invocations. Fluff wise it might be difficult to fit into this character, but in the end it would probably be worthwhile. I'd avoid getting eldritch blast happy if you do take lock levels though, as it's redundant with your heavy crossbow and would require you to spread your stats out farther to be effective. better to take utility cantrips and invocations, but alas I would probably go full fighter.

Also remember that your crossbow mastery lets you fire up close without disad, so a melee weapon on your person would be there purely as backup. it wouldn't be "necessary" to keep a rapier handy for close encounters, as you already have a fine weapon as your primary.

[Foxhound438]

Fighter 5, then rogue, has better DPR than straight fighter most levels.

OTOH, you already have 2 attacks from crossbow expert. This gives you a 3rd.

On the gripping hand, getting a 4th or a 5th has lesser value than extra SA dice.

that's only with hand crossbow, OP is wanting to use heavy crossbow.

[Scaleybob]

I'm building very much the same thing for a new game at the moment - this has been quite a help.

I was trying to decide whether to go Ranger rather than fighter, but the Maneuvers were the deciding factor. I don't think I'll multiclass with him, as Fighter's get so many cool options each level, that I wouldn't want to delay any of them.

One thing my character does have is a Handcrossbow as well as a normal crossbow, so if something does get close, I can then shoot in close combat and then get the bonus attack from Crossbow Expertise.

Love the PC's name - he really should be a revenant, so he can be headless.:smallsmile:

[Veldrenor]

Another option is to go Eldritch Knight rather than Battlemaster. Minor Illusion for stuff to hide behind while shooting, Shield for emergency AC, no one can take your crossbow from you, and you can cast assorted buff spells on yourself (including Haste for extra AC and attacks), freeing up your party's main caster from doing so. EDIT: you could also pick up other illusion spells, to strike fear into the hearts of your foes by appearing as a headless corpse. Or you could use a hand crossbow alongside your heavy crossbow and be two Rolands in one.

[djreynolds]

Meet Roland Thompson, mercenary-turned-adventurer, master of the crossbow. He's probably going to be my character for the next campaign after my current one. I'm looking for advice and criticism on my build. Here's what I've got so far:

Race: Variant Human
Stats, in order of importance: Dex, Con, Wis, Cha, Str, Int
Starting Feat: Crossbow Expert
Background: Either Soldier or Mercenary (from SCAG)

Take 5 levels in Fighter, and for my ASI take sharpshooter. Have the Archery fighting style, and go for Battlemaster as my archetype. Get trip attack as a maneuver, undecided on others. Get a Great Crossbow ASAP. At some point, take a level dip in rogue for Sneak Attack, possibly two for cunning action.

How I see it working:

By level 3, I have my weapon and archetype. If burst damage is needed, then make a Trip Attack against a target in melee range (no disadvantage due to Crossbow Expert ), then Action surge for a second attack thanks to crossbow exert letting me ignore loading. I attack with advantage, as the target is within 5 feet and prone.

At level 4, this gets way better. With Sharpshooter, I can take a -5/+10 to my attack/damage. This looks really good when combined with advantage from a trip, and even better with multiattack at level 5.

A dip in rogue for sneak attack allows even more damage from sneak attack, and potentially cunning action.

So what do you all think? Any suggestions are welcome. I am trying to keep this AL legal, so keep that in mind.

Thanks!

I like the build, but no human. With being a dexterity based PC and grabbing rogue, you will be stealthy... with a torch. Grab wood elf.

[8wGremlin]

I'm currently playing your build, at level 4. I'm only using a hand crossbow, the damage is mitigated by the bonus action attack.


The plan is to level 5 or possibly 6 then take 3 levels of ranger, this gets me:
both hunter's mark and horde breaker (which works on ranged attacks)
allowing you to attack another target standing next to the first for free.


it's worth considering

[djreynolds]

I'm currently playing your build, at level 4. I'm only using a hand crossbow, the damage is mitigated by the bonus action attack.


The plan is to level 5 or possibly 6 then take 3 levels of ranger, this gets me:
both hunter's mark and horde breaker (which works on ranged attacks)
allowing you to attack another target standing next to the first for free.


it's worth considering

And the darkvision spell good for 8 hours

[Spacehamster]

Battlemaster 14 / assassin 3 and warlock 3 would make a great ranged char.

One attack would do 1d10 + 2d6 sa + 1d6 hex + 5(or 15 when using sharpshooter), the others 1d10 + 1d6 + 5(+15) and when you get a surprise round you gain double the dice. :)

[Sir cryosin]

I would either grab a Finesse weapon or raise your priority on STR. You're going to get caught into melee eventually.

You might also consider the Hunter Ranger.

With the feat crossbow expert he can shoot in melee and not suffer from disadvantage.

[Sir cryosin]

This is one of my favorite builds but I mc. Most games really only go up to or around lv 10 so I take 5 lvs or fighter, 3 lvs of ranger, 2 lvs of rogue. We roll for stats. So I pick up crossbow expert as vhuman then at fighter 4 if I have a 18 dex I'll pick up sharpshooter ( with rolling getting a 17 is not that hard.) Now a lot of people will go for the 2 hand crossbow thing but are table feels that just to unrealistic with trying to reloaded to hand crossbow with in 6 sec unless you have a special set up belt quiver with gadgets and pulleys and whatnot. So that ok because I like the heavy crossbow so with this build a round looks like this.
2d10+6+2d6+1d6+1d6 that's 2 xbow attacks, 2 Hunter's mark, 1 Colossus Slayer, 1 sneak attack dice I fill tempted to drop the rogue to get a ASI tho.

[Isidoro]

I wouldn't go for it at all, then. Sneak Attack is only once per turn. A better dip would be Warlock for Hex, or Ranger for Hunter's Mark-- those will get you the same damage more consistently, along with other assorted goodies.

Although you need to spend a BA to apply HM/hex (which means one less attack for up to 1d6+dex+goodies while using a hand xbow) and spend each time your target dies, a BA to reapply it. This also implies you will run out of slots eventually. Not something I've ever seen happen during AL events, though, but still something to keep into consideration.

On the other hand rogues will apply its SA once per turn, yes, but you will have 2 attempts (3 if using hand xbow and xbow expert's BA) to dish it and scales "better" than HM/Hex (5 levels in rogue and you are on par with 3 attacks with HM/Hex damage wise)

I've yet to see an AL combat that lasts more than 3-4 rounds, which means that HM/Hex's upkeep (Action Economy wise) is way subpar than SA :)

Also you don't need to stealth to apply SA, thus it's Economy is way sounder than HM/Hex route. The only scenario (possible but improbable) where spells win over SA is where you can't apply sneak attacks effectively but your target must be not engaged by any of your friends and able to detect you (e.g. blindsight, tremorsense, etc)

[Oramac]

I'm coming in late here, but I actually played this character up to 13th level about a year ago. The only difference was I used a longbow instead of a crossbow. I was basically playing Hawkeye from The Avengers, and it was a ton of fun.

Start Vuman, like you said, and pick up Crossbow Expert and Sharpshooter ASAP.

Dex > Con > Everything Else. You can easily dump Str unless you want it for RP reasons.

Take Rogue 2 for Cunning Action. You'll love it.

If you have a lot of melee allies, Trip Attack is good, otherwise skip it, since it'll give you DA on your attacks.

An important note: your single-target damage is fantastic, but you have ZERO area damage capability. Find yourself a Wizard or Sorc if you need AOE.

Bottom Line: it's a whole lot of fun if you stick to your strengths (Dex) and play smart.