Barbarian

[Officer Joy]

So a friend I got into DnD is Playing in a game somewhere else.

And he is playing the typical dumb Barbarian, but is more interested in playing a caster.


I've suggested to multi-class Bard, but was that a good suggestion?
to go barbarian 1 Bard x

[Socratov]

Is it an option to let him rebuild his character?

[hymer]

Is it an option to let him rebuild his character?

Excellent question, particularly considering the unlikelihood of the 'typical dumb Barbarian' having the mental stats to multiclass to caster.

[Socratov]

Excellent question, particularly considering the unlikelihood of the 'typical dumb Barbarian' having the mental stats to multiclass to caster.

Not only that, but raging inhibits casting, which makes sure that you can either use one class, or the other.

[hymer]

Not only that, but raging inhibits casting, which makes sure that you can either use one class, or the other.

It inhibits Concentration, even.

[Officer Joy]

Is it an option to let him rebuild his character?

That was my first suggestion too, but he didn't want to. He's already living that character, and wants to see where his life goes.


Excellent question, particularly considering the unlikelihood of the 'typical dumb Barbarian' having the mental stats to multiclass to caster.

Well his Charisma is a 13, so he could multi-class in any of the charisma casters



Not only that, but raging inhibits casting, which makes sure that you can either use one class, or the other.

It inhibits Concentration, even.

Excellent points, I'll be sure to point those out to him.

[hymer]

Well his Charisma is a 13, so he could multi-class in any of the charisma casters

Offensive casting will suffer quite a bit.

Edit: I'm thinking it could be possible to make a workable valor bard from it (though not getting two attacks until level 7 is... bitter). Generally avoid spells that require saves or to-hit, and keep rage in reserve for when you have nothing better to do (or when you just need resistance to weapon damage above all else).
But I'm certainly no expert on bards. And it might not feel much like a caster, more like a melee fellow who happens to have a lot of spells.

[Socratov]

Offensive casting will suffer quite a bit.
that's putting it mildy

Edit: I'm thinking it could be possible to make a workable valor bard from it (though not getting two attacks until level 7 is... bitter). Generally avoid spells that require saves or to-hit, and keep rage in reserve for when you have nothing better to do (or when you just need resistance to weapon damage above all else).
But I'm certainly no expert on bards. And it might not feel much like a caster, more like a melee fellow who happens to have a lot of spells.
I see no way how this would actually work well. I think personally a warlock would be better. Both blade pact and tome pact would make for a great pact, and fiend for the free temp hp would be fine a well...

[Spacehamster]

He could take ritual caster feat to give the barbarian a shaman / tribal witch doctor feel maybe?

[RickAllison]

Do I'm guessing he wouldn't want to rebuild his Charisma into Wisdom so he could be a Druid? Because Moon with barbarian could be rather fun.

[R.Shackleford]

Two of the best classes to mix with Barabrain is Druid and Cleric.

Cleric because of their awesome non-concentration spells like Spiritual Weapon (though as a DM I have the weapon target the same target as barbarian). This essentially gives you a frenzy totem barbarian.

Barbarian 5/Cleric (Knowledge) 15 is a fun build

Druid... Wildshape is awesome but I love the Land Druid Barbarian.

Hear me out...

Urchin Bear Totem Barbarian / Druid (Underdark/Mountain/Forest) sneaking across the ceiling and then goes into rage ... Rage drops the barbarian's concentration which means the barbarian falls... You are now the "Drop Bear". (usimg Spider Climb)

With how 5e is set up you don't need to cast + rage, you can leave those two things for seperate times.

[RickAllison]

Also note that holding out for Extra Attack from Barb allows for a greater variety of combat forms with Wild Shape. A Dire Wolf goes from trading the brown bear's damage for a prone effect to actually getting more damage while having advantage. The Giant Elk gets a massive damage boost when you can combine the charge attack with their hooves. All of those creatures that get more powerful attacks at the cost of lacking Multiattack become significantly better.

[Slipperychicken]

So a friend I got into DnD is Playing in a game somewhere else.

And he is playing the typical dumb Barbarian, but is more interested in playing a caster.

Why not just retire the barbarian and play a caster?

[RickAllison]

Why not just retire the barbarian and play a caster?

Already been answered, he likes the story he made with his character and wants to continue it.

[LVOD]

Barb/bladelocks work amazingly. Temporary hp from agathys or the fiend pact go twice as far while raging with resistance.

You can get a nice armor of agathys up, and with your resistance theyll be taking more damage than you will when they hit with an attack. Plus most invocations are at will abilities that aren't really combat related, so you get that caster feel when not in combat.

[MrStabby]

So for me the best three casters are druid (for wildshape and a strong theme),

cleric:
Spiritual weapon is pretty awesome, and non concentration, some good healing spells are solid outside of combat so no conflict with rage and Warding bond is really strong when you can a) get resistance to all damage, b) have a massive load of hitpoints, c) use something like the life cleric ability to heal yourself when you heal others. Furthermore, the idea of a raging priest appeals to me.

Warlock:
Armour of agathys is the main thing here. Lots of hitpoints that get doubled with your potential damage resistance. Likewise fiend pact temporary hp go further as well.

[LVOD]

I should also mention that the barbarian in the totem path gets some cool magical stuff too (beast sense, limited flight, see super far into the distance, i think you get animal messenger or something too). So he might be able to just hold out and get a little of a feel for magical abilities as well.

Or take magic initiate. There's an awesome guide on what to pick from to add some unique options to any class

[Farecry]

If he wants to play a grappler then bardbarians are awesome. Kind of a niche build to focus on that, but with bard spells and rage features you can be awesome at it pretty much all the time.

[R.Shackleford]

Already been answered, he likes the story he made with his character and wants to continue it.

That doesn't really stop the character from being retrained. Keep the same character but change the class/ability scores.

[Officer Joy]

If he wants to play a grappler then bardbarians are awesome. Kind of a niche build to focus on that, but with bard spells and rage features you can be awesome at it pretty much all the time.

Could you explain that one more? Which bard spels are the ones too look out for?

[Sigreid]

Read a bit of the thread. I'd suggest sorc. Throw himself into his newly awakened powers and view his barb stuff as a bonus from his earlier life , not developed at all.

[Eldaran]

Why not offer him a custom Primal Path that works like Eldritch Knight, but allows casting/concentrating on spells while raging and uses Charisma with the Sorcerer spell list? He can play the same character, gets the spellcasting he wants, and it synergizes with his current build without being unbalanced.

[LVOD]

Bardbarians work well with grappling because rage gives you advantage on grapple (athletics) checks, and bards can get expertise. So your grapples are almost inescapable

[ES Curse]

Like everyone's saying, you're pretty limited on what you can actually use because of low mental stats messing up saves/attack rolls and Rage preventing spellcasting and concentration. As such, I would go for a class that DOESN'T rely on outright casting spells but gets a lot of class features to compensate. Some notable details to consider from the classes:
-Channel Divinity is NOT a spell and thus can be cast while raging
-If you put in 8 levels of Cleric, Divine strike from the Nature/Tempest/Trickery/War Domains could be useful
-Several features of the Fiend Pact work very well with melee characters, and the temp HP is great with Rage resistance
-The GOO pact might work; combine with a bear totem's resistance to have full resistance while raging with 10 Warlock levels, and you might have some fun with Entropic Ward (level 6) + Reckless Attack
-Note for a Warlock that many invocations involve casting a spell, so get ones you won't need while raging

I say take Warlock or Cleric. The other casters rely heavily on actually casting spells to take advantage of class features, but Moon Druid might work too.

[Farecry]

Bardbarians work well with grappling because rage gives you advantage on grapple (athletics) checks, and bards can get expertise. So your grapples are almost inescapable

To expand upon this you can also pick up enlarge/reduce to use outside of rages for more advantage on strength checks. It requires magical secrets to get, I'd recommend lore bard for this as cutting words help you make those grapples, and taking barbarian to 5 gets you extra attack anyways, so that's a wasted feature for valor in addition to having to wait an extra 4 levels for the spell.

[Laserlight]

Urchin Bear Totem Barbarian / Druid (Underdark/Mountain/Forest) sneaking across the ceiling and then goes into rage ... Rage drops the barbarian's concentration which means the barbarian falls... You are now the "Drop Bear". (usimg Spider Climb)

+1 Internet to you for making a Drop Bear, and--given the reputation of Australian spiders--another .5 for getting it by Spider Climb.

[Giant2005]

I agree with the Warlock suggestions.
Not only is it a particularly powerful combination, but it makes the most sense - pacts with greater beings is exactly how a big, stupid person that covets magic gets their hands on that magic.

[MrFahrenheit]

Well his Charisma is a 13, so he could multi-class in any of the charisma casters

Looking back from level 20...

Barbarian X/paladin 2/lore bard 6-8. In combat, he's raging while converting spell slots to smites. Out of combat, he can cast some spells as necessary.

[JellyPooga]

I take it from the OP that he's Level 1, considering what Class to take at 2nd, yes?

If this is the case, I recommend he sticks out Barbarian for a couple of levels; Barbarian can feel...a little dull at 1st level;

DM: "Barb, you're up."
Barbarian: "Uh, I'm raging already. I hit it with my sword/axe/stick, I guess."
DM: "What do you hit?"
Barbarian: "Uh, whatever's in front of me"

Once he hits 2nd, Reckless Attack and Danger Sense do a lot to make a character feel more awesome.

3rd level is really where things start getting interesting, though. If he's still bent on adopting some caster features, Totem Barbarian gets Beast Sense and Speak with Animals at this level. Combined with Magic Initiate at 4th, you can make a character that has a definite "magicky feel". On top of that, he'll be picking up a Totem, all of which at 3rd are pretty darned awesome.

4th level is a precious ASI/Feat

5th is Extra Attack and Fast Movement

After that is the point I'd start consider multiclassing. By that point, though, he may not want to.

Alternatively, if it's skill-based shenanigans he's after, then Rogue is probably a better bet than Bard. More synergy, quicker access to the shenanigans he's looking for and no spellcasting to worry about losing out on because of Rage.