Swashbuckler / Fighter

[TexasHays]

Hey everyone!

I posted recently about a Storm Sorcerer multiclass and some of the ideas listed by some folks made me think of something else. I'll be starting up another campaign in about two months and I think I want to run this:

A fighter / rogue swashbuckler, mostly likely 15 fighter / 5 rogue (5 for uncanny dodge) and I still get 6 ASIs this way.

I'm thinking Human Variant so I can start Dex and Con at 16, Cha at 14, and also take the Dual Wielder feat at lvl 1.

That, I believe, lends itself to starting Fighter for TWF right off the bat so I can start with rapiers for max damage.

The primary reason for this post though is progression from that point on. Do I immediately jump into rogue for 3 levels (or more) to get swashbuckler and then go back to fighter? Or stay in Fighter for the first 5 to get my ASI and extra attack as quickly as possible? In the long term it won't make much difference, but what do you think will be best for the low levels?

Oh, and for Fighter, while Battlemaster probably works best for this multiclass, I'm probably going to go Champion, just for the straightforwardness, just in case that changes anyone's ideas.

[Foxhound438]

as always, get 5 in something first. i've tried multiple 3/2 splits and it always feels bad.

after 5 however, it's more or less whatever you think is fun gets priority. champion's 7th level ability isn't super great, so I'd personally get 5 in rogue after that.

[Captain Thorn]

as always, get 5 in something first. i've tried multiple 3/2 splits and it always feels bad.

after 5 however, it's more or less whatever you think is fun gets priority. champion's 7th level ability isn't super great, so I'd personally get 5 in rogue after that.

Sorry for the slight thread steal. I'm pretty new to the D&D scene and I'm approaching this multi class from the other way (Starting as Swashbuckler first, then going into fighter)

I was planning on reaching lvl 4 for the stat increase then taking 3 levels in Fighter to become a Battle Master. Is there a specific reason you would reckon taking 5 levels in a class first? And would you recommend taking 5 levels in fighter instead of the three?

[Arkhios]

A fighter / rogue swashbuckler, mostly likely 15 fighter / 5 rogue (5 for uncanny dodge) and I still get 6 ASIs this way.

I'm thinking Human Variant so I can start Dex and Con at 16, Cha at 14, and also take the Dual Wielder feat at lvl 1.

The primary reason for this post though is progression from that point on. Do I immediately jump into rogue for 3 levels (or more) to get swashbuckler and then go back to fighter? Or stay in Fighter for the first 5 to get my ASI and extra attack as quickly as possible? In the long term it won't make much difference, but what do you think will be best for the low levels?

Oh, and for Fighter, while Battlemaster probably works best for this multiclass, I'm probably going to go Champion, just for the straightforwardness, just in case that changes anyone's ideas.

Do eeeet! At 13th (character) level (with Rogue 3/Fighter 10) you can have both the Defense Fighting Style and Two-Weapon Fighting Style, combined with Dual Wielder your base Armor Class will be +2, as if you were wielding a shield. You can easily act as your group's "tank", with a whopping 19 before any magical bonuses to AC (which there are plenty to find; if your DM decides to give them).


as always, get 5 in something first. i've tried multiple 3/2 splits and it always feels bad.

after 5 however, it's more or less whatever you think is fun gets priority. champion's 7th level ability isn't super great, so I'd personally get 5 in rogue after that.

I'll have to disagree with that. Half your proficiency bonus (rounded up) to your Initiative Check is amazing. That's a Dexterity check which you'll never become proficient with. Swashbuckler 3/Champion 7 is going to beat just about everyone in initiative most of the time with a minimum initiative bonus of +7 (assuming the starting ability scores haven't changed up to this point); grab the Alert feat and you'll never again be surprised as long as you're conscious and your Initiative Bonus is +12!


Sorry for the slight thread steal. I'm pretty new to the D&D scene and I'm approaching this multi class from the other way (Starting as Swashbuckler first, then going into fighter)

I was planning on reaching lvl 4 for the stat increase then taking 3 levels in Fighter to become a Battle Master. Is there a specific reason you would reckon taking 5 levels in a class first? And would you recommend taking 5 levels in fighter instead of the three?

While you can deal sneak attack damage only once per turn, having Extra Attack improves your offensive potential remarkably (for example, twice the chance to hit and deal the sneak attack damage), so it would be a wasted opportunity if you dipped into fighter but didn't take it up to at least 5th level. Also for this same reason, it's advisable to take fighter levels first, since Extra Attack is such a big boost for a character that solely relies on weapon combat; the sooner you get Extra Attack, the better. Waiting until 6th character level isn't too bad though, since a Valor bard gets Extra Attack at 6th as well, if you absolutely need that 1d6 sneak attack and Expertise ASAP. If you delay it further than 6th level, you're gimping yourself.

[Specter]

Start on Fighter for the better save, or Rogue if you're starving for skills.

As all rogues, finding a way to attack with your reaction is solid. With your high AC, Sentinel maybe?

And yes, taking five levels in something is important, but you can take one level of the other class for flavor without delaying stuff too much. I'd go F1/R1, then F5, then R5, then all Fighter.

[djreynolds]

Have you've seen "Kits of Old" or something like that? They have a scout fighter archetype, their specific parry ability is awesome... you add SD to AC and then get uncanny dodge if it hits. Awesome. And precision and a skill booster. Pretty cool

[Fflewddur Fflam]

Sorry for the slight thread steal. I'm pretty new to the D&D scene and I'm approaching this multi class from the other way (Starting as Swashbuckler first, then going into fighter)

I was planning on reaching lvl 4 for the stat increase then taking 3 levels in Fighter to become a Battle Master. Is there a specific reason you would reckon taking 5 levels in a class first? And would you recommend taking 5 levels in fighter instead of the three?

Level 5 tends to a big step up for every class. For martial characters, it's when they get Extra Attack which is significant to double your damage and double your chances. Consider what you were proposing by taking 4 levels of Swashbuckler and then 3 levels of Battle Master. You are a 7th level martial character with only one attack, while everyone else around you got two attacks two levels ago, and you still don't have it nor have any way to get it for at least 2 more levels, you are way behind damage-wise.

If you really want to start rogue for the skill proficiencies, saves, etc., you could do 1 level rogue, then levels 2-6 fighter and then back to all rogue. That way you will be at level 6 instead of level 5 when you get Extra Attack. That's not too bad.

Optimally, a fighter/rogue multiclass is probably best at F15/R5 or F12/R8, at F12/R8 you've got evasion plus 3 attacks from the fighter (or four if you are doing two-weapon fighting, which you really should be doing with a swashbuckler).

[Laserlight]

Level 5 tends to a big step up for every class. For martial characters, it's when they get Extra Attack which is significant to double your damage and double your chances. Consider what you were proposing by taking 4 levels of Swashbuckler and then 3 levels of Battle Master. You are a 7th level martial character with only one attack

Why wouldn't he have been getting two attacks via TWF since Swash3?

[Jarlhen]

Why wouldn't he have been getting two attacks via TWF since Swash3?

At the cost of your bonus action. Which is a very steep cost for a rogue.

[krugaan]

isn't it numerically better to go the opposite route, like F5 / R15 to maximize the sneak damage?

the fighter side is mostly for riposte to get delicious off-turn sneak attacks.