Original Ideas for Out of the Abyss

[Gastronomie]

WARNING: CONTAINS SPOILERS FOR OUT OF THE ABYSS.

So, I am gonna run Out of the Abyss for a group of IRL friends, and I have looked through the book. Most of the adventure, I found wonderful, but what I found rather dissatisfied with were these points:

1. Cultists being lame.
So like, it starts in Velkynvelve when the Gray Ooze comes screaming "Flesh for the Faceless Lord!". It's fine back then.
Then, in the Hook Horror hunt, the Gnolls come screaming "Sacrifices for Yeenoghu!"
And then, in the Darklake, the Merrow come screaming "Blood and salt for the Prince of Demons!"
There's probably like a gajillion more cases I already forgot in which the "worshippers of the demon lords" are basically being like "FOR BLAHDEMONLORDBLAH", and nothing more. Yes, yes, I understand, that's how cultists are in D&D. They're normally depicted as being cookie-cutter, I know, but it's boring nonetheless. I personally don't like these ideas - I feel it could be more diversified, and apart from that, getting to know what's happening spoils the horror (yes, most of the time, since these are uttered in uncommon languages, the player characters don't understand what they mean, but still).
Now, I personally love villain NPCs who have clear motivations. Now, "I wanna help Demon Lord X rise in power" is not a motivation. That's a goal. I'm asking here what's making this antagonist wanna help Demon Lord X.
The clear answer is "he's gone mad". But this doesn't satisfy me, personally. At least not when it's a major NPC, not some random mob cultist.
For instance, there could be a mad necromancer who worships Orcus and is helping him collect souls for whatever plan. But what if the necromancer's actual reason for becoming a necromancer in the first place was to restore the life of his long-lost love (something Orcus promised - whether he really meant it or not)? And what if the DM laid out tons of hints for it? Yes, this is a very orthodox reason, but it's still better than "because he went mad by seeing Orcus". At least, for me. It especially works well if he seemed mad all the time, but was actually working for a pretty logical (or at least sorta understandable) reason.
What if the Pudding King's "children" (Prince Livid and Princess Ebonmire) were named after the deep gnome's own, real children who were killed by some cause? Or what if Livid and Ebonmire were the real names of Topsy and Turvy, and the Pudding King was their father (who had believed the two dead after they were abducted by the drow)? If he succumbed to madness as a result of losing his children, it would make more sense as to how he accepted the idea of having two children - "filling in a gap in his hollow heart". It also adds drama to the story.

2. The lack of Graz'zt or Orcus's activity.
Sure, in Gravenhollow you see all these vision of Orcus mind-controlling mind flayers, and Graz'zt keeps a spy on the Duergar king, but... that's it. I mean, Graz'zt and Orcus are supposed to be the strongest demon lords lined with Demogorgon, and that's it.

One idea I have is to add Orcus's influence (less so Demogorgon's) to Gracklstugh. This is because of these reasons:
-Having too much Demorgorgon in a row can seem sorta repetitive. I'd rather add other ideas too.
-I personally want to make Buppido secretly a warlock influenced by Orcus (either knowingly or unknowingly), able to control undead in his lair. Who knows? Maybe he even lost his love, and aspires to become a god because he thinks "only gods can revive the dead".
-I want Orcus's cultists to turn Themberchaud into a dracolich (or the PCs can stop it before they succeed). Either way, the idea of witnessing a dracolich's birth seems pretty epic, and it also makes sense, especially since the duergar are plotting to kill Themberchaud (if the dragon hears of this, he will no doubt be enraged with the duergar - and may want to surprise them before killing them all, by becoming immortal before he is killed). Also, once Themberchaud becomes a dracolich, all of his bulk and fat will rot off, making him no different from a normal dracolich in terms of mobility and speed - a shocking change in his appearance and image, a sure "surprise" for the players. If Themberchaud destroys the entire city, that's another cool scene. If it's the players who warned Themberchaud of the Keepers' plans to kill him, Themberchaud might even swoop down and personally say thank you to the adventurers (with a hideous, demonic grin - just as one of his eyes rots off and splatters in front of them) before he destroys the buildings, floods the streets with his necrotic breath weapon, and goes on killing everybody - an ironic ending to be sure.
The players may later confront Themberchaud, or Themberchaud may aid Orcus in the battle against Demogorgon. Or he might simply remain to become the new tyrant of the duergar.

If Graz'zt is summoned to the material realm, I think he'd be smart enough to realize the demon lords' invasion is all caused by Lolth's plans. He's probably gonna try to stop Lolth from invading his realm at all costs, at the same time as trying to invade the realms of the other demon lords, especially those of Orcus and Demogorgon. Either he sees this as a chance and tries to stay in the Realms, or tries to go back to Zeletar as fast as possible, I dunno. He does have a lot of smart minions in his home realm, so he might as well leave the stuff there to them and simply enjoy the material realm (and when he enjoys stuff, stuff start to get "for 18 and older").
Maybe he may even try to troll Lolth by corrupting the drow. He might even become a back-up force for Ilvara (or at least something that affects her mind), enjoying as she basically ruins her own life by keeping on pursuing the PCs, ignoring all the duties she left at Velkynvelve. Obsession is said to be one partof "Graz'zt's Madness", so it does make sense if Ilvara is unknowingly (or knowingly) affected.
I also want to hear from people about their own ideas and alterations. Do any people have interesting ideas they wanna share? (Be it original, or simply a way of expressing something that was in the book, such as "ways to make the drow seem more intimidating", or "ways to make the hook horror hunt more fun".)

[Mjolnirbear]

Ok I love your idea for Themberchaud. I didn't realise until now how un-"the world is ending" Gracklstugh is until you mentioned that. Just in time for Whorlstone

[Mjolnirbear]

Also Google the companion card system. Turns the NPCs into add-on abilities that greatly simplify their use.

Pre-roll your random encounters. I have one for Underdark travel, one for darklake travel, and will use one for Whorlstone Tunnels too.

Make each random encounter terrain + creature. Because "you see a stream" is very boring.

[mgshamster]

Also Google the companion card system. Turns the NPCs into add-on abilities that greatly simplify their use.

Pre-roll your random encounters. I have one for Underdark travel, one for darklake travel, and will use one for Whorlstone Tunnels too.

Make each random encounter terrain + creature. Because "you see a stream" is very boring.

I was doing that with the terrain encounters, and the one time I didn't my players kept expecting a creature to pop out any moment. They're rightfully paranoid. :)

[Theoboldi]

Ooooh. Those are some pretty interesting ideas. I've wanted to do something similar with the Pudding King in my own version of the game, but not quite to the extent of involving Topsy and Turvy like that. That's actually a really cool idea. And the thought of tying Buppido into Orcus makes so much sense I can't believe the actual writers didn't think of it.

That said, the one thing I am personally disappointed with in OotA is the utter lack of Mind Flayers. You've got a renegade one you can meet, potentially get an random encounter with one that is infiltrating Menzoberranzan and enslaving the poor, Orcus has reanimated an Elder Brain which orders a whole community of them to worship him, and it all leads up to.....nothing.

An idea would be to write up the community, placing into the campaign somewhere around the fetid wedding. Earlier points of the adventure could serve as foreshadowing for it, with the PCs encountering thralls and intellect devourers inside the major cities as either random encounters or traps to lure in powerful adventurers, to be turned into powerful undead. Later on, Illithid with undead servants could show up, and one could even add some resistances and immunities on an Illithid to create undead versions of them. Visions in the library and researching nearby mindflayer settlements could then lead them into Cyrog's lair, where they then fight and kill the elder brain. Which of course would need to be statted up.

And there'd also need to be a reason for Orcus not to show up and protect his servants.

Dunno, I haven't gotten very far with this yet.

[Goober4473]

I've been posting "Improving <OotA Chapter Name>" threads here (and on En World) as I go. They might be worth checking out for inspiration. I and others have posted a lot of good ideas there.

I mentioned in my latest one (Improving OotA Act 2) that I plan to have the act 2 component gathering quest be more related to the demon lrods themselves, instead of just some random rare components, and that means dealing with Orcus and Graz'z't too. Check that thread for more details, but for my game, Jimjar is Graz'z't in disguise, with knowledge of the future given to him when the players eventually meet him in Gravenhollow and he has a telepathic conversation with himself. He wants to go back home to his (very large) realm. I'll be sowing some seeds of Orcus pretty soon as the party heads to Blingdenstone, but nothing too concrete. Just some undead, possibly already destroyed by minions of Demogorgon.

I'm thinking of having Topsy and Turvy be the children of the main miner couple in Blingdenstone. In my game, they ran off during the ritual in Sloobludop after transforming into their hybrid forms, and returned home still trying to hide their nature. When the PCs show up, they'll request the secret be kept, but ultimately they'll be needed to make peace with the wererat tribe. I really like your idea though, and perhaps I will change them to be the miners' niece and nephew, with the Pudding King as their father.

And, as mentioned above, I put together a Companion System (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?459858-NPC-Companion-System-Idea) that has been instrumental in making the companion NPCs interesting, relevant, and not too much of a pain to keep around in my campaign.

[Mjolnirbear]

I'm sorry Goober, I couldn't remember who you were to credit you correctly. Thank you for making my job a LOT easier.

[Gastronomie]

Thanks for the ideas~~~~~

BTW, I personally don't like the later half of OOTA after the players start leading an army. This is cause:

-It's a pain to keep track of it all
-It doesn't make sense for a bunch of random former slaves to suddenly be in charge of an army
-It's not like Red Hand where the characters actually fight armies
-It doesn't connect to the plot

So I'd rather actually not use it as an idea. How do other people think about the leading-armies bit?

Also, I personally don't like the peacefulness of Gaumtlgrym (or however it was spelled) either - who'd ever want to go back to the Underdark after reaching the surface world? At least, the characters my players submitted probably will not.

I actually think it could be one interesting idea be that some of the demon lords have already reached the surface world - either that, or their influence is already quite growing - and even the surface world isn't so safe as the characters had initially hoped (for the first several days of travel above ground, they see normal landscapes - but they eventually stumble across eerie sites and wastelands). If there's one way to stop all the chaos, it is to go back to the Underdark and find a way to send the Demon Lords back to the Abyss.

[Goober4473]

How do other people think about the leading-armies bit?

It's really more of an expedition force than an army, allowing for a safer base camp and a handful of minions. I like it a lot because it changes the feel of the adventure a lot. They go from frantically running, with danger at every turn, to moderate safety as they travel, heading towards danger on their own terms.


It's a pain to keep track of it all

Really this is a problem for the entire adventure and all the NPCs that follow the players around. See above for my companion system to deal with that throughout the whole thing.


who'd ever want to go back to the Underdark after reaching the surface world? At least, the characters my players submitted probably will not.

I think it's important to plan ahead in character creation. I let my players know, in vague terms, that they'll eventually need motivation to return to the underdark, and if they couldn't justify it when it comes time, they'd need a new character.

Two of my PCs are royalty, two of them work for factions that would be interested in stopping the demon lords, and the last one is a pretty chill/nice guy and would want to help, so they should all have plenty of motivation when asked to lead an expedition.

See my "Improving OotA Act 2" thread for more thoughts on the second half fetch quest. I'm planning to replace the components with items closely related to each demon lord, to keep things connected to them.

[Gastronomie]

I love the idea of the companion system. Thanks~~

I wonder if the player characters will re-venture, but if it seems they're not gonna I might as well just have them create new characters. Personally I prefer that to forcing a character to bend his/her charasteristics.

[Gastronomie]

Bumped up because of another random idea:

Change Vizeran DeVir's family to the Duskryns (Jorlan's family). This is a really random idea, but if my campaign gets that far I think I'm making this this way.

Not much of a plot reason. I just want Jorlan and Vizeran to be son and father, since their characters seem so, so similar - bent on vengeance, with nothing else left in their miserable lives.

I might even have Vizeran ask the characters once he hears of their adventure.

*Vizeran hears about Ilvara and Jorlan from the adventurers*
"Dead?"
"What, Jorlan? Yes, he was killed by *insert reason*."
"No, not my son's life. Why would that even matter? I'm asking whether he achieved vengeance. Is Ilvara dead?"
"Um... yes. *Explains what's happened*"
"Hm. Now that's my son."

BTW, what I have in store for Ilvara is:

Another idea is, since Ilvara is so obsessed with capturing the characters, having her either (i) make a contract with one of the Demon Lords, mutating her body and soul - Graz'zt could be one possibility, given Ilvara's original sex drive, or (ii) having Lolth punish her for completely forgeting about her original duty in Velkynvelve, turning her into a Drider. Either way, she's now a mad, demonic monster who has no resemblance to the original absolute figure of authority she once was. Her life of promised glory is now completely ruined by the adventurers. She will shriek and howl about how if not for the adventurers, she wouldn't have been forced to contract with a Demon Lord, or be consiered worthless by Lolth. She would have become the ruler of Menzoberranzan, a respected and feared figure all of the drow. Everything, because of the adventurers. They must be punished for what they deserve!

This way, the players can feel that they've definitely changed something with their deeds. Seeing the life of the sadistic priestess (who enslaved the adventurers and turned their life into a miserable wreck) become a miserable wreck in return is surely a sweet moment that they'll never forget. And since that's pretty much caused by Jorlan (and how he set free the adventurers), Vizeran will be happy about what his son grew to be.

Not an important scene plot-wise, but character-wise this should be sufficient to show that regardless of how calm and polite he seems on first glance, inside, Vizeran cares for absolutely nothing except vengeance. He thinks Jorlan's life is a success, since he's managed to make Ilvara pay for what she did (even if Jorlan's life was still a wreck, and he was killed in the process). It emphasizes how he will do really anything for his own vengeance against Menzoberranzan.

I think this will be a pretty neat scene.

[Blue Lantern]

Bumped up because of another random idea:

Change Vizeran DeVir's family to the Duskryns (Jorlan's family). This is a really random idea, but if my campaign gets that far I think I'm making this this way.

Not much of a plot reason. I just want Jorlan and Vizeran to be son and father, since their characters seem so, so similar - bent on vengeance, with nothing else left in their miserable lives.

I might even have Vizeran ask the characters once he hears of their adventure.

*Vizeran hears about Ilvara and Jorlan from the adventurers*
"Dead?"
"What, Jorlan? Yes, he was killed by *insert reason*."
"No, not my son's life. Why would that even matter? I'm asking whether he achieved vengeance. Is Ilvara dead?"
"Um... yes. *Explains what's happened*"
"Hm. Now that's my son."

BTW, what I have in store for Ilvara is:
And since that's pretty much caused by Jorlan (and how he set free the adventurers), Vizeran will be happy about what his son grew to be.

Not an important scene plot-wise, but character-wise this should be sufficient to show that regardless of how calm and polite he seems on first glance, inside, Vizeran cares for absolutely nothing except vengeance. He thinks Jorlan's life is a success, since he's managed to make Ilvara pay for what she did (even if Jorlan's life was still a wreck, and he was killed in the process). It emphasizes how he will do really anything for his own vengeance against Menzoberranzan.

I think this will be a pretty neat scene.

Mind if I "borrow" (ie. shamelessy steal) some of those plot points, I am thinking of running Out of the Abyss in a few months.

[Gastronomie]

Mind if I "borrow" (ie. shamelessy steal) some of those plot points, I am thinking of running Out of the Abyss in a few months.Of course! No actual need to ask, really. It's not like you're harming me by using my ideas~

This is a place where I post my ideas so that (1) others can borrow, (2) others can suggest other ideas to make my stuff better, and (3) I don't forget.

If you guys have any extra ideas of tweaks or new events, please tell them here too.

[Blue Lantern]

Of course! No actual need to ask, really. It's not like you're harming me by using my ideas~

You sure about that? I might be a very polite mind flayer... whistles innocently


If you guys have any extra ideas of tweaks or new events, please tell them here too.

So far I have just skimmed the adventure, I plan of more in dept study during my vacation, so so far my ideas are on a more embryonic state.

I definitely want to add some more of my brethens *coff* er Mind Flayers and expand the part of Orcus.

I am also thinking to have Graz'zt hide in Menzoberranzan around Gromph, after finding out he was the summoner, and find a way escape the trap at the end to extend the adventure a bit more.

[Goober4473]

If you guys have any extra ideas of tweaks or new events, please tell them here too.

I haven't quite gotten to act 2 yet, due to some delays, but I am putting together some stuff for the interlude between the halves of the adventure. You can check them out here: Tales From Below (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?494334-quot-Tales-From-Below-quot-an-OotA-Interlude-(Spoilers))

[Ashdate]

My group is about halfway through OOtA now (they are basically into chapter 7) so here's my comments on your points, as well as places where I diverged from the printed material.

1. Cultists being lame.

The way the book presents it (or at least my interpretation), the PCs are almost assuredly going to have the first tete-et-tete with Demogorgan. But unless they take a huge risk during their visit to Neverlight Grove, they won't know with any sort of certainty that there are *multiple* demon lords running around the Underdark.

They will certainly make a strong guess, but one of the strengths you can play to is that each new area presents them with a *new* big bad threat. Once they can no longer count the number of potential demon lords in play on a single hand, your players will understand both the severity of what's going down here (because remember: their goal from day one is to ESCAPE the Underdark, not fix it), and therefore have strong motivations to return.

So ration it out. Don't bring in Jubilex until Blingdenstone. The nod to Yeenoghu is fine if you put it early enough for them to forget it (and reintroduce him later). Demogorgan is going to be a highlight simply because they actually see him in the flesh (don't forget the madness check!). Zuggtomy (and plenty of madness checks) coming after the genuine hospitality found in Neverlihght Grove will work, and the wedding stuff is great (Neverlight Grove is a highlight of the early chapters).

I think you do have some good instincts however; play each different. Emphasize Jubilex by ratching up the number of oozes (I have a suggestion below). I had Fraz-urb'luu slinking in the background of Gracklstugh, nearly convincing my PCs that the cult of Demogorgan they took out was saved the city, when it reality it just killed his competition (more details below). Basically, don't focus on the cultists, focus on the demon lords and the threat they pose.

And don't discount the madness angle. The madness is what makes everything in the adventure sing. Sure, individual cultists could have a reason for their worship, but if anything I recommend introducing MORE madness into the adventure. Your ideas for things like Prince Livid and Princess Ebonmire are fine, my only worry is "how do the PCs find this out, and do they even care?"

2. The lack of Graz'zt or Orcus's activity.

Your idea to introduce a second demon lord to Gracklstugh mirrored my own thinking, although I chose Fraz-Urb'luu (who otherwise would appear in a gem in a later chapter; if I use that, I'll make that Graz'zt instead.) I also introduce Orcus through a mindflayer as they were travelling on the Darklake.

The basic setup I had for Fraz-Urb'luu in Gracklstugh:

There is a cult to Demogorgan in Gracklstugh, but it's not with the Council of Savants/Derro. Instead, it's being led by two individuals: Buppido (who in my game, believed he was invincible but this was due to his worship of Demogorgan) and Gartokkar, who I made one of the heads of the Keepers of the Flame.

Fraz-Urb'luu's cult meanwhile was being led by the succubus (who could easily be Fraz too). His worshippers--the Council--are slowly driving the city mad by distributing ancient coins enchanted to spread his whispers to the merchants. Droki is running around slipping the coins into the merchant's wares. So any inspection by the PCs will probably turn up empty. What merchant is going to complain (or notice) an extra coin in their possession? The big kicker? The cultists are worshipping "The prince with two faces." Many will probably mistake it for Demogorgan, but it's referring to Fraz-Urb'luu (two faces refering to lying/being deceitful rather than actually having two faces).

Fraz-Urb'luu and his cult are perfectly happy to make people believe they worship Demogorgan (and they might even believe that to be the case, but that is Fraz-Urb'luu pulling the wool over their eyes).

Complicating things is Buppido: as an actual worshipper of Demogorgan, he's been serial killing up a storm since he returned, and has taken out a few key players in Graz's cult. So the Council has hired the Grey Ghosts to find Buppido, and kill him. The PCs can find his lair, and no euphemisms: he 100% worships Demo.

Meanwhile the Keepers of the Flame are secretly working to corrupt the next Wyrmsmith into a follower of Demogorgan. Or they would have, if the Council hadn't stolen the egg. Themberchaud, for his part, is aware something is up, but doesn't realize the Keepers have chosen a new master in Demo. This adds an interesting twist to the PCs when they find the egg: they may not realize that giving it back to the Keepers is actually a bad idea (just as destroying the egg would give Themberchaud A LOT more negotiating strength in Gracklstugh; classic lose/lose).

If things go fine, the PCs will discover that the Keepers worship Demogorgan, and that the Council worship the Two-Faced Prince. But will they (pun intended) put two and two together and realize that they are actually fighting each other?

More than willing to answer any follow-up questions about this.


For introducing Orcus meanwhile, I had the PCs (after having their boats fall down a short waterfall) come to a closed sluice gate next to a duergar outpost. A lone duergar answers, and brings them into the dining room. No other duergar can be found. As he scurries off... surprise! The gates slam an undead (duergar crossbowskeletons) take shots through portcullis.

The PCs find no one alive, eventually finding some mysterious tunnels in the outpost (dug by an umber hulk; judge your PCs levels at this point if they should actually fight it) and eventually find the duergar who yeah is an Intellect Devourer (don't run their devour ability as a permanent effect). After defeating the Devourer, a mind flayer appears when the PCs are ragged.

He doesn't attack tho, offering them a deal: he'll let them live and show them a route to the surface, if they go to Gracklstugh and stop Demogorgan's influence. The twist of course, is that he totally worships Orcus, and is doing it to weaken Demogorgan (he doesn't know there are two demon lords fighting for Gracklstugh, as above). And he'll probably try and kill them if they return. But w/e!


Other significant deviations from the book:

These are common suggestions I've seen elsewhere:

1) I didn't use Topsy and Turvy. There are too many NPCs early, and the lycanthropy is a pain in the butt to keep track of.
2) Save the intelligent sword for a later chapter, and feel free to modify it. The weapon is insane, and it's guardians are pushovers. I replaced the sword with an intelligent chaotic good +2 greatsword (my two-weapon fighter got a +2 short sword in Neverlight Grove per book, and our Barbarian needed something good too) that deals extra damage on a critical hit and can use Command 1/day. I asked the players to name the sword, they chose Beyonce.
3) Travelling is boring as heck IMO so I put a secret teleporter beneath Blingdenstone that led to an area close to Gracklstugh. Even worked into a small Drow invasion of Blingdenstone to cap off that arc (more below).

Major change:

So my players went to Blingdenstone before Gracklstugh. As per the books suggestion, the reason they then went to Gracklstugh is to pick up armaments for the deep gnomes (i.e. crossbows and bolts). One other thing: the book REALLY misses the mark with the relations between the deep gnomes and wearrats, making it "oh, there are oozes lets fight together and now we're friends." Heck with that!

My Dorbo HATED the wererats, believing there is no chance that living with creature *immune* to every weapon they have, and who occasionally *goes berserk during moon phases that they can't see* is a good idea.

So I had him send my PCs through that secret teleportation circle to Gracklstugh with a note for a merchant there (I chose Ylsa), and a bag of holding sealed with a password and carrying several thousand gold meant not just for crossbows and bolts, but a nice supply of SILVERED bolts. The message is enchanted with that spell (I forget it's name, it's level one) that tells everyone but that specific merchant that it's just normal bolts the town is after. The PCs might not put two and two together, even when they see the merchant dump several thousand GP worth of gems onto the table.

Anyway, slight change to the ooze fight: rather than 1d6+3 random ooze fights (totally weak and boring) it was many many rounds of "fight through the oozes!" players would roll a d6 at the end of the init (1 = grey ooze attack, 2 = psychic gray ooze attack, 3 = ochre jelly attack, 4 = gel. cube engulf, 5 = black pudding attack, 6 = roll again twice ignore 6's), requiring them to do X amount of damage/Y skills checks to cut through the oozes (aim for 10 rounds) while they are all swarmed (all ooze attacks had advantage too as they were working together).

The homebrew companion system was mentioned; I let players choose one ally each round (gnome archers = +3 dmg/hit, Glabbagool = one PC can use the friendly cube to remove the Ooze's advantages on their attacks) and wererats (limited supply, can use to take hits). You can run a potential earth elemental either as a companion or an extra attacker to whittle down oozes.

After defeating the Pudding King, the PCs exit to find many dead wererats... with silvered arrows in their backs. Silvered arrows they didn't realize they brought back to Dorbo.

Needless to say, one of my PCs decided to help Chiprin the wererat leader kill Dorbo (for the complete injustice of killing an ally who helped save your city). Had a nice trial (w/ angry mobs) to determine whether he would be lynched (or just imprisoned for life)! Despite legitimate ability to do so, sadly PCs didn't try and get the fighter off with an insanity defense (technically legitimate as the fighter did have one or two perm madness effects), nor tried to prove that Dorbo was under the influence of a demon lord (which would have been an interesting argument to make!)

Went well, especially when then the drow invaded the city. If all goes to plan, the PCs will be returning to the surface minus the fighter, who will then turn out to be the key to getting them into Mantol-Derith...

[Gastronomie]

I haven't quite gotten to act 2 yet, due to some delays, but I am putting together some stuff for the interlude between the halves of the adventure. You can check them out here: Tales From Below (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?494334-quot-Tales-From-Below-quot-an-OotA-Interlude-(Spoilers))Yeah, I read that thread - the idea of having the players get to play different NPCs seems pretty interesting as an interlude. I might try it out - thanks!

My group is about halfway through OOtA now (they are basically into chapter 7) so here's my comments on your points, as well as places where I diverged from the printed material.
-snip-
So ration it out. Don't bring in Jubilex until Blingdenstone. The nod to Yeenoghu is fine if you put it early enough for them to forget it (and reintroduce him later). Demogorgan is going to be a highlight simply because they actually see him in the flesh (don't forget the madness check!). Zuggtomy (and plenty of madness checks) coming after the genuine hospitality found in Neverlihght Grove will work, and the wedding stuff is great (Neverlight Grove is a highlight of the early chapters).Yeah, can't wait till Neverlight Grove. And true, I should probably keep the Demon-Lord stuff till it's after the players get to meet Demogorgon in person, especially to emphasize the shock of him rising. Thanks~~

I think you do have some good instincts however; play each different. Emphasize Jubilex by ratching up the number of oozes (I have a suggestion below). I had Fraz-urb'luu slinking in the background of Gracklstugh, nearly convincing my PCs that the cult of Demogorgan they took out was saved the city, when it reality it just killed his competition (more details below). Basically, don't focus on the cultists, focus on the demon lords and the threat they pose.The idea of Fraz being worshipped as the "Prince with Two Faces" is a fabulous mis-lead. Being the Demon Lord of Deception, it's gonna be a funny moment when the players realize that the players themselves have been decieved as well. I think I might wanna use it too. Thanks~~

And don't discount the madness angle. The madness is what makes everything in the adventure sing. Sure, individual cultists could have a reason for their worship, but if anything I recommend introducing MORE madness into the adventure. Your ideas for things like Prince Livid and Princess Ebonmire are fine, my only worry is "how do the PCs find this out, and do they even care?"Well, I suppose whether or not to make the antagonists 100% mad is probably something of personal preference, but I feel that special antagonists should have special backgrounds to prevent them from becoming the "monster of the week".
It's not hard to make the PCs find out in the final battle if Topsy and Turvy are there (I'm not statting out the prisoner NPCs, leaving them out of combat, so unless stuff happen, they wouldn't just "randomly die" before this. It might seem rail-roady but better than having to keep track of 10 NPCs during a fight).
As for "whether they care"... I will make them care. At least I will try, by throwing out lots of hints beforehand. For instance, during the labor in Velkynvelve, Topsy might talk to the PCs about their father - like, their mother died young, so their father had to take care of both of them by himself, and the twins are worried whether he'll be able to get over the "loss" of his children.


My Dorbo HATED the wererats, believing there is no chance that living with creature *immune* to every weapon they have, and who occasionally *goes berserk during moon phases that they can't see* is a good idea.
So I had him send my PCs through that secret teleportation circle to Gracklstugh with a note for a merchant there (I chose Ylsa), and a bag of holding sealed with a password and carrying several thousand gold meant not just for crossbows and bolts, but a nice supply of SILVERED bolts. The message is enchanted with that spell (I forget it's name, it's level one) that tells everyone but that specific merchant that it's just normal bolts the town is after. The PCs might not put two and two together, even when they see the merchant dump several thousand GP worth of gems onto the table.
Anyway, slight change to the ooze fight: rather than 1d6+3 random ooze fights (totally weak and boring) it was many many rounds of "fight through the oozes!" players would roll a d6 at the end of the init (1 = grey ooze attack, 2 = psychic gray ooze attack, 3 = ochre jelly attack, 4 = gel. cube engulf, 5 = black pudding attack, 6 = roll again twice ignore 6's), requiring them to do X amount of damage/Y skills checks to cut through the oozes (aim for 10 rounds) while they are all swarmed (all ooze attacks had advantage too as they were working together).
The homebrew companion system was mentioned; I let players choose one ally each round (gnome archers = +3 dmg/hit, Glabbagool = one PC can use the friendly cube to remove the Ooze's advantages on their attacks) and wererats (limited supply, can use to take hits). You can run a potential earth elemental either as a companion or an extra attacker to whittle down oozes.
After defeating the Pudding King, the PCs exit to find many dead wererats... with silvered arrows in their backs. Silvered arrows they didn't realize they brought back to Dorbo.
Needless to say, one of my PCs decided to help Chiprin the wererat leader kill Dorbo (for the complete injustice of killing an ally who helped save your city). Had a nice trial (w/ angry mobs) to determine whether he would be lynched (or just imprisoned for life)! Despite legitimate ability to do so, sadly PCs didn't try and get the fighter off with an insanity defense (technically legitimate as the fighter did have one or two perm madness effects), nor tried to prove that Dorbo was under the influence of a demon lord (which would have been an interesting argument to make!)
Went well, especially when then the drow invaded the city. If all goes to plan, the PCs will be returning to the surface minus the fighter, who will then turn out to be the key to getting them into Mantol-Derith...These ideas seem neat as well, especially the change to the incredibly lame chain of ooze encounters, and the conflict between the Deep Gnomes and wererats. It is unrealistic that absolutely every Deep Gnome will accept their lycantrophic cousins.

[Gastronomie]

Another random idea, concerning Graz'zt's lair.

Okay, so in the original book it's stated that near Graz'zt's lair, the animals are going horny. But I feel that's not enough. Maybe present some examples.

For instance, there might be some vicious monsters fighting over a female (Basilisks, Behirs, I dunno).

There might be slugs. A lot of slugs. So many slugs they've completely covered up the ceiling of a massive cavern, twisting together with each other, mating in their thousands, lining the walls, sprawled up everywhere. Disgusting.

Or, the players might come across two treasure boxes that are put straight next to each other, completely adhered together. These are actually Mimics, mating.

And this one is actually more beautiful, but: A lot of Cloakers.

I imagine that, since it's hard to come across mates in the Underdark, certain species of animals will have particular large mating grounds that they assemble to, once in a while, in a particular season. And what if a lot of Cloakers assemble at the same time?

You know, I once watched on National Geographic that manta rays sometimes do this sort of thing, creating a massive herd. http://i.imgur.com/095gchP.jpg
Now, imagine - what if these were all Cloakers instead? Like, there's this really gigantic space (perhaps a huge fissure, miles deep and hundreds of feet wide) where the Cloakers assemble, acrobatically dancing and twisting mid-air, trying to find a mate. It'll be a dazzling sight, and one of the "beauties of the Underdark" that emphasize its bizzare yet somewhat mystical and fascinating ecosystem.

The one the PCs come across will be one caused by Graz'zt's appearance near said fissure, but anyways.

[Gastronomie]

Created some (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?498254-Rare-Drow-Items-The-Anesthetizer-Blade-amp-Spidersilk-Whip-Created-for-OotA-PEACH) stuff (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?498258-CR-5-Solo-Boss-Monster-Variant-Elite-Drow-Warrior-Created-for-OotA-PEACH) for my version of Out of the Abyss, Chapter 1.

Also, creating campaign logs for my campaign. Will post soon.