VoP feats?

[enderrocksonall]

Okay...I'm sure someone has asked this question already, but I can't find it.

What is the deal with the bonus feats from VoP? Are they really supposed to all be exalted feats? Is there any character that could possibly qualify for that many exalted feats?

If the entry were just a typo and they are simply bonus(as long as you qualify for the feat you can take it) feats, then that would make a bit more sense to me.

Can anyone help me with this plz????

[Pestlepup]

I'm afraid that you're not mistaken, and I understand your incredulity. They are supposed to be all Exalted Feats and yes, for some characters it could really be a problem to qualify for 11 different ones. Though there is one point that needs noting: only humans taking both Sacred Vow and Vow of Poverty at 1st level are even capable of taking advantage of all 11 Feats. The rest will have to settle for what they get at later levels. (The Exalted Feats are not gained retroactively if taking Vow of Poverty at a later level.)

Oh, that is unless you're using Flaws from Unearthed Arcana, which would be the other way for 1st level characters to qualify for Vow of Poverty.

But as a way of example, I have a character of whom I'm very fond of, and she has had Vow of Poverty from level 1. She's a... variant paladin, perhaps, since I've taken some liberties in interpreting the class. For one, she obviously wears no armor (VoP), only robes, that have suffered quite a bit by now. She also carries no weapons, unless her walking staff happens to be handy. Second, violence is not her first option. All power-gaming inclined may avert their eyes, since she is so suboptimal that it would physically hurt most people. She's basically a pacifistic, caster-healer paladin, with charisma and wisdom in the high teens and strength penalties galore. Will some day likely go the way of Apostle of Peace. Why paladin? She tries to emulate a woman chosen by her god (Ilmater) to be a holy woman. She lacks the training, knowledge and spell-power of a proper cleric, but holy mojo and divine gifts abound. Exalted Feats, that is.

Anyhoo, the point was, that she, as I recall calculating, is capable of taking advantage of each and every bonus Exalted Feat, mostly because quite a few are geared towards paladins. There are around 25 Feats for which she can qualify, and most are even useful. However, there are some that become redundant or unavailable once certain choices are made, but still leaves enough venue for hearty Feat-grabbing. So yeah, it's possible to go ascetic on level 1 and get the most out of your Exalted Feats, though it might require some planning. Clerics, monks and paladins get by the easiest, with some very obvious choices to make, but the rest should also manage.

[enderrocksonall]

Is there any mechanic for what happens if you don't qualify or don't want to take another of those feats?

If not, what would seem to be a fair trade? Could we make it one every four levels and its just a ruo-o-the-mill bonus feat?

You see, I'm going to make a ninja with vow of poverty for my next campaign that I get to play in, so I won't qualify for any other exalted feats except the other vows, which I don't want.

And yes we are using flaws and point-buy bonus feats.( I was toying with the idea of playing a min/maxed fighter with 18 str, 18 dex, 14 con, all other stats are 6's and begin play with 7 feats :smalltongue: )

[Captain van der Decken]

You could always homebrew some more Exalted feats, I suppose.

[Indon]

What if you were to multiclass (polyclass?) into a VoP Monk/Sorceror/Ranger/Whatever in order to gain access to more feats?

That would be an... interesting... character, I imagine.

[Corolinth]

Book of Exalted Deeds is not designed for nonlawful characters (look through the spells, count up how many have Guardinal or Eldarin components, or just raw Celestial components, and compare to the number with Archon components). The book is very well designed from a flavor standpoint, in how it depicts the exalted character's behavior, but unfortunately the writers were not innovative enough to think up ways in which a chaotic character might walk the moral high road.

Yes, the eleven bonus feats must be exalted feats. This is, actually, not very difficult to manage. However, you're going to have to start taking sacred vows in most cases.

[Quietus]

It's not like there's a lack of feats with no requirements (or at least, with requirements that are moot)...

Nimbus of Light
Holy Radiance
Stigmata

One of the three "+1 luck" feats

Intuitive Attack

Nymph's Kiss

Piles of vows

Nimbus/Radiance/Stigmata and the +1 luck ones can be fair game for EVERYONE, without worrying about flavor or suitability. Intuitive attack is a bit iffy, of course, and Nymph's Kiss and the Vows can be problematic from a roleplay perspective. But even with that, if you aren't a human (or taking flaws), you only get 9 bonus feats anyway. Those already provide four, and there's something else in there for everyone.

[Pestlepup]

Well, if you're thinking of a ninja, let's see what you can get...

1. Nimbus of Light - no reqs, though a glowing ninja isn't always a good idea. :smallsmile: Still, it can be shut off.
2. Stigmata - Consider this one. I've found it both fun and surprisingly useful. Though you'll likely need a few days downtime if no lesser restoration is available. Nevertheless, use with caution.
3. Sacred Strike - If you recall from CAdv and CSc, sudden strike counts as sneak attack for the purpose of qualifying for feats. Love those d8s!
4. Holy Subdual - Sure, it needs Subduing Strike, but it's still one more Exalted Feat to bag.
5. Intuitive Attack - Instead of Weapon Finesse, I'd recommend this. Wisdom is better than dexterity for AC bonuses, since they don't get swiped when flat-footed.
6. Touch of Golden Ice - For a meager con 13 you qualify for this baby. Always good.
7. Gift of Faith - If a ninja can't cough up 13 wisdom, something's amiss. Besides, save bonuses are always save bonuses.
8. Sanctify Natural Attack - Yes, it might just be your 1d3 fist getting blessed, but in a pinch everything counts.

Now it starts to get tricky. If you can meet the rather harsh cha 15, here's a few.

9. Sanctify Martial Strike
10. Holy Radiance
11. For an int 15, Words of Creation. Won't do diddly squat for you, but, you know, yay - a feat.

For some RP challenge - Nymph's Kiss. A great feat, but with insidious fluffy prerequisites.

And of course, Servant of the Heavens/Favored of the Companions/Knight of Stars. If it feels wrong for your campaign, ask your DM to tailor these to fit the setting. No problem then.

You might have to dip into Vow of Chastity or Vow of Obedience, but then again, you'll also have the option of turning down the bonus feats if none strike your fancy. At least I'm not forcing my players to get more stuff if they don't want it. :smallsmile:

[SpiderBrigade]

I have to say, the idea of a super-exalted ninja is pretty awesome.