Warlock Pact with The Hag Countess? What do I do?

[Zehridamus]

Hey y'all. I had a question that turned into a thought that turned into an idea.

The question: What if I wanted to make a warlock pact with The Hag Countess? She's like the queen of all hags, right? So I thought that that would fit with the Archfey pact. But then again, she grew in power and became the Lord of the Sixth Circle of Baator, Malbolge, so I thought that she would fit more with the Fiend. Right? But then, in a particular line of canon that seems to fit with 5e, the Hag Countess was killed, and the layer became her remains, now ruled by Glasya. But, at her level of power, she would have some sort of divine spirit, like a slumbering dark god. So, I thought she might fit with the Great Old One pact. Right? Wrong? Right???:smallconfused::smalleek::smallfurious::sm allannoyed::smallsigh:

Then I had a thought: What if I just combined them?

And then the idea came: I thought it might be cool to actually combine them all, in a manner of speaking. Since there are 4 abilities granted by your otherworldly patron, I thought that you would gain an ability based upon The Hag Countess' history. The 1st level ability seems pretty basic, so I figured that you could just pick your 1st level ability from among them all, or, since she started as a hag, you would gain the Archfey 1st level ability. Either way, as you advanced, you would gain the abilities as fit The Hag Countess' history: Misty Escape (Archfey) at 6th level, Fiendish Resilience (Fiend) at 10th level, and Create Thrall (GOO) at 14th level. And this would work as well for the expanded spell list: The 1st and 2nd level expanded spells would be from the Archfey's list, 3rd and 4th from the Fiend, and 5th from the GOO.

I don't know if this is at all feasible, because I literally just came up with this idea 30 minutes ago, and I'm pretty tired. so, let me know what y'all think! Is Malagard really this special? Or is she so inscrutable that she doesn't even deserve warlocks? I think we'll find out soon!

[Naanomi]

I would probably go Fiend for the Hag, but some combo of Fey/Fiend isn't out of order (I'd leave out GOO, a simple deadish planar isn't nearly weird enough to qualify in my mind)...

Though technically 'dead but not quite' is sort of the shtick of the Undying patron right?

[Gastronomie]

I love that idea and think you should go with it, but as aforementioned she's not really a Great Old One (GOOs are more simply "undescriable", "unknowable" beings of the Far Realm and beyond that are absolutely incomprehensible by mortal minds).

As a DM, I would permit it, but not all DMs will, especially the strict ones. I don't know what campaign you're using this for, but when using homebrew material, remember that it's part of manners to consult your DM beforehand.

[Coidzor]

My recollection is that most hags thought of her as a sellout, not as a leader or exemplar of their race.

I definitely wouldn't have her be a GOO patron.

[zeek0]

As an alternative, in the Homebrew forums I posted a "Hag Coven Pact" which may work well for you. Peruse it as you will:

Hag Coven Patron

Your patron is a hag coven, a group of three powerful hags. Hags are creatures that are selfish, cruel, and deceptive – and rarely work together. They only form a coven as a way to channel powerful magics and accomplish some shared goal. Perhaps the hags are ancient enough that your power comes directly from the hags themselves, or perhaps the hags are a merely a conduit for greater powers. Examples of hag covens include Macbeth’s witches, the Lilim, the Furies, and the daughters of Sora Kell.

Hag Coven Expanded Spells
Spell Level /// Spells
1st bane, command
2nd alter self, blindness/deafness
3rd bestow curse, clairvoyance
4th greater invisibility, locate creature
5th contagion, dominate person

Create Likeness
You may create a likeness of a creature, granting you a portion of its power and control over it.

To create a likeness, you must have seen the creature alive within 30 feet, and have a fragment from them that allows you to channel their power. This object may be a claw, dried organ, hair, drop of blood, or object treasured by the creature. This object is then incorporated into a work which visually or symbolically resembles the creature, such as a carving, painting, or puppet. The creation of the likeness takes 1 hour.

In addition, while you are attuned to its power, the subject of your likeness has disadvantage on saving throws against your spells.

In some circumstances determined by your DM, a creature different but similar to the subject can also suffer from disadvantage on saving throws against your spells. For example, a likeness of Grish, Goblin foot soldier may be sufficiently similar to Fob, Goblin foot soldier.

You may only attune yourself to one likeness at a time. After you finish a short or long rest you may choose to attune yourself to one different likeness in your possession. You may not possess a number of likenesses greater than half your warlock level rounded up.

Examples of likenesses are listed below. The power granted by other created likenesses is determined by yourself and the DM.

Distant Affectation
At 6th level, your power over the subject of your likeness increases. You may choose to expend a warlock spell slot and cast a spell of 1st level or higher you know as a ritual which targets the likeness you are attuned to. If you cast a spell in this way, spells which have a target or have a range of touch can target the likeness, and the subject is affected by the spell instead if they are within 240 feet. If the spell had a range of touch, the subject can resist the spell by succeeding on a Wisdom save against your spell save DC. The spell doesn’t affect the creature if running water at least 10 feet wide blocks a direct path between you and the creature.

This distance increases to 1000 feet at 10th level, and 1 mile at 14th level.
After you complete a ritual in this way you may not do so again until you complete a long rest.

Impersonate
At 10th level, when you use the alter self spell, you may transform into a perfect physical copy of your attuned subject, including mannerisms and automatic reactions. You gain no other qualities aside from the physical appearance of your transformation. Creatures that know the subject well have disadvantage on checks made to recognize the disguise.

Multiple Attunements
At 14th level, you may attune yourself to two likenesses, gaining benefits from each.

Example Likenesses
The power you gain from the likeness is often a special ability, attack, or quality exemplified by the subject.

Grizzly Bear
This claw has been carved into a piece of wood, which now resembles the beast to which the claw once belonged.
Power: You may gain proficiency in Strength checks and saving throws, and have advantage on Wisdom ability checks.

Horb, Village Blacksmith
A coarse hair is twined about the hammer that a cloth puppet is striking downward.
Power: You gain proficiency with blacksmith’s tools.

Displacer Beast
The hide of a displacer beast has been grafted onto a metal wire frame. Shimmering black stones are used as claws on the six-legged likeness.
Power: An illusion is created of you, which makes it appear that you are standing near your actual location. Attack rolls against you to have disadvantage. If you are hit by an attack, this power is disrupted for one minute. This power is also disrupted while you are incapacitated or your speed is 0.

King Lionel IV
A small portrait is expertly painted of a chiseled and glorious figure, which is gilded with the melted-down gold of the ancestral royal signet. The brave smile is disrupted only a fraction by the empty darkness in the subject’s eyes.
Power: You may add your Wisdom modifier to any Charisma (Persuasion) checks you make. In addition, when you hit with a melee attack you may use a warlock spell slot to deal an additional amount of radiant or necrotic damage equal to 1d6 for each level of the slot level expended.

Troll
A drop of troll blood stands suspended in a wax poppet, seeming to shiver and grow inside of the wax body.
Power: You are constantly transmuting into yourself, and are immune to any spell or effect that would alter your form. In addition, at the start of each of your turns when you have less than half of your hit points you regain half of the damage dealt to you in the last turn. This regeneration does not function if you took acid or fire damage in the last turn.

Merfolk
Two webbed fingers are preserved in a small glass orb of seawater, which also contains sand from the bottom of the deep ocean.
Power: You can breathe water, gain a swim speed equal to your movement speed, and can speak Aquan.

Nightmare
The hoof of a Nightmare was used to create this charcoal sketch of the fires of hell and a broken wing in flames.
Power: You gain resistance to fire damage. In addition, you may use a bonus action to summon two fragments of hellfire, which cast dim light in a 20 foot radius and follow behind you. The fragments may be dismissed as a bonus action. You may extinguish a summoned hellfire fragment to cast hellish rebuke without expending a spell slot. After you use this feature twice you cannot use it again until you finish a long rest.

Dreadcaster Vathras
Vathras, who removed his own eye to replace it with the ill-fated Eye of Vecna, kept his eye dried and preserved in the vain hope that it could one day be restored after his use of the Eye was complete.
Power: You have advantage on saving throws against spells and other magical effects. In addition, your number of warlock spell slots increases by 50%, rounded down.

[RedMage125]

Also, as hags go, she was a Night Hag, and aren't they just fiends?

When Glaysa took over, the Hag Countess had died, her body swelled up to enormous proportions, and her ribs and viscera now make up part of the 6th layer's landscape. So if she's the lord of the 6th, the HC is dead. Maybe a vestige of some kind would be appropriate, but I don't think the GOO crunch goes with Vestige fluff. Maybe the other warlock pact from SCAG? Since she's dead and all?

[Zehridamus]

I would probably go Fiend for the Hag, but some combo of Fey/Fiend isn't out of order (I'd leave out GOO, a simple deadish planar isn't nearly weird enough to qualify in my mind)...

Though technically 'dead but not quite' is sort of the shtick of the Undying patron right?

I kinda sorta totally forgot about the Undying pact. Would fit much better with her canon, so scrap the GOO.


As an alternative, in the Homebrew forums I posted a "Hag Coven Pact" which may work well for you. Peruse it as you will:

Hag Coven Patron

Your patron is a hag coven, a group of three powerful hags. Hags are creatures that are selfish, cruel, and deceptive – and rarely work together. They only form a coven as a way to channel powerful magics and accomplish some shared goal. Perhaps the hags are ancient enough that your power comes directly from the hags themselves, or perhaps the hags are a merely a conduit for greater powers. Examples of hag covens include Macbeth’s witches, the Lilim, the Furies, and the daughters of Sora Kell.

Hag Coven Expanded Spells
Spell Level /// Spells
1st bane, command
2nd alter self, blindness/deafness
3rd bestow curse, clairvoyance
4th greater invisibility, locate creature
5th contagion, dominate person

Create Likeness
You may create a likeness of a creature, granting you a portion of its power and control over it.

To create a likeness, you must have seen the creature alive within 30 feet, and have a fragment from them that allows you to channel their power. This object may be a claw, dried organ, hair, drop of blood, or object treasured by the creature. This object is then incorporated into a work which visually or symbolically resembles the creature, such as a carving, painting, or puppet. The creation of the likeness takes 1 hour.

In addition, while you are attuned to its power, the subject of your likeness has disadvantage on saving throws against your spells.

In some circumstances determined by your DM, a creature different but similar to the subject can also suffer from disadvantage on saving throws against your spells. For example, a likeness of Grish, Goblin foot soldier may be sufficiently similar to Fob, Goblin foot soldier.

You may only attune yourself to one likeness at a time. After you finish a short or long rest you may choose to attune yourself to one different likeness in your possession. You may not possess a number of likenesses greater than half your warlock level rounded up.

Examples of likenesses are listed below. The power granted by other created likenesses is determined by yourself and the DM.

Distant Affectation
At 6th level, your power over the subject of your likeness increases. You may choose to expend a warlock spell slot and cast a spell of 1st level or higher you know as a ritual which targets the likeness you are attuned to. If you cast a spell in this way, spells which have a target or have a range of touch can target the likeness, and the subject is affected by the spell instead if they are within 240 feet. If the spell had a range of touch, the subject can resist the spell by succeeding on a Wisdom save against your spell save DC. The spell doesn’t affect the creature if running water at least 10 feet wide blocks a direct path between you and the creature.

This distance increases to 1000 feet at 10th level, and 1 mile at 14th level.
After you complete a ritual in this way you may not do so again until you complete a long rest.

Impersonate
At 10th level, when you use the alter self spell, you may transform into a perfect physical copy of your attuned subject, including mannerisms and automatic reactions. You gain no other qualities aside from the physical appearance of your transformation. Creatures that know the subject well have disadvantage on checks made to recognize the disguise.

Multiple Attunements
At 14th level, you may attune yourself to two likenesses, gaining benefits from each.

Example Likenesses
The power you gain from the likeness is often a special ability, attack, or quality exemplified by the subject.

Grizzly Bear
This claw has been carved into a piece of wood, which now resembles the beast to which the claw once belonged.
Power: You may gain proficiency in Strength checks and saving throws, and have advantage on Wisdom ability checks.

Horb, Village Blacksmith
A coarse hair is twined about the hammer that a cloth puppet is striking downward.
Power: You gain proficiency with blacksmith’s tools.

Displacer Beast
The hide of a displacer beast has been grafted onto a metal wire frame. Shimmering black stones are used as claws on the six-legged likeness.
Power: An illusion is created of you, which makes it appear that you are standing near your actual location. Attack rolls against you to have disadvantage. If you are hit by an attack, this power is disrupted for one minute. This power is also disrupted while you are incapacitated or your speed is 0.

King Lionel IV
A small portrait is expertly painted of a chiseled and glorious figure, which is gilded with the melted-down gold of the ancestral royal signet. The brave smile is disrupted only a fraction by the empty darkness in the subject’s eyes.
Power: You may add your Wisdom modifier to any Charisma (Persuasion) checks you make. In addition, when you hit with a melee attack you may use a warlock spell slot to deal an additional amount of radiant or necrotic damage equal to 1d6 for each level of the slot level expended.

Troll
A drop of troll blood stands suspended in a wax poppet, seeming to shiver and grow inside of the wax body.
Power: You are constantly transmuting into yourself, and are immune to any spell or effect that would alter your form. In addition, at the start of each of your turns when you have less than half of your hit points you regain half of the damage dealt to you in the last turn. This regeneration does not function if you took acid or fire damage in the last turn.

Merfolk
Two webbed fingers are preserved in a small glass orb of seawater, which also contains sand from the bottom of the deep ocean.
Power: You can breathe water, gain a swim speed equal to your movement speed, and can speak Aquan.

Nightmare
The hoof of a Nightmare was used to create this charcoal sketch of the fires of hell and a broken wing in flames.
Power: You gain resistance to fire damage. In addition, you may use a bonus action to summon two fragments of hellfire, which cast dim light in a 20 foot radius and follow behind you. The fragments may be dismissed as a bonus action. You may extinguish a summoned hellfire fragment to cast hellish rebuke without expending a spell slot. After you use this feature twice you cannot use it again until you finish a long rest.

Dreadcaster Vathras
Vathras, who removed his own eye to replace it with the ill-fated Eye of Vecna, kept his eye dried and preserved in the vain hope that it could one day be restored after his use of the Eye was complete.
Power: You have advantage on saving throws against spells and other magical effects. In addition, your number of warlock spell slots increases by 50%, rounded down.

By the way, LOVE this pact. I don't think my DM would allow it, but still, the idea is solid, and the mechanics make the idea balanced, unlike some homebrew I've seen (or, more accurately, made or sanctioned :smallannoyed: ) Really good work.


My recollection is that most hags thought of her as a sellout, not as a leader or exemplar of their race.

Oh yeah, you're right. I guess there isn't much love for an extraplanar magical creature who manipulates souls for fun and then rose to the heights of diabolic power. I did forget that little tidbit of her story, so maybe if I did make a Hag Countess pact, there wouldn't be much respect between my PC and other hags. Maybe even less so. I can see the RP already.

And thanks, everyone, for the ideas. I definitely see Undying working better than GOO. Or, if I could covince my DM, I could see the Hag Coven pact working really well. Maybe Malagard deserves some Warlocks after all.

[Warpiglet]

This is the weirdest coincidence! I have a blade pact warlock who was instructed by a hag! I decided I could go with fiend patron if it was a night hag and straight Archfey for a green hag...I specifically got on this site thinking about fiend vs fey pact for a hag patron! Great minds...

My arcane focus is one of the hag's finger on a chain around the neck...

But in answer to your question, go with cool so long as the DM does not seem it too powerful. Fluff is yours to...fluff.

Tangent:

I did not even go with a big time patron that grants power. I liked the idea of a hag teaching manipulating and betraying a youngster before he got wise to her motives (he saw her undisguised by chance and realized she was a monstrosity). She had been convincing him his evil step father should be killed (he agreed) but then lied to him to get him to kill his loving family members as well. Our story picks up when he is deciding to carry through on some none or all of it...as he seeks the power to do so.

Needless to say the hag met an untimely end but her finger is his focus and the night hag whispers from Hades still trying to guide him.