Rogue/Cleric Gestalt Build Help

[elementalpupil]

Hello all,

I've been around the forums a bit and you seem like a knowledgeable bunch. I mostly play 3.5, but one of my DMs has started a Pathfinder game and I figured I'd try my hand. He requires that we do Gestalt for this game, and I've chosen to do a rogue/cleric build because he's placed us in a world where we are ruled by vampire overlords and I figured it'd be fun to roleplay out someone who found the holy book of a good-aligned god but has to hide his faith because the vampires will kill him. . . So the cleric is for the healing, and the rogue is for the lying about it.

Since it's a weird combination, though, I really want to make it work and I figured I'd turn to you guys for tips. He's limited races to things under 15 race points in the PFSRD. What should I look for? What should I be taking to maximize my healing and my bluff skills? What feats look great but should really be avoided? Also, are there better classes for this kind of thing?

Thanks ahead of time for your help, and I hope to become a more frequent member here. :)

-Elementalpupil

[Waker]

The big question that you have to answer is how do you want to play your character? One of the biggest difficulties with playing gestalt is making sure you don't spread yourself too thin, because even if you have the combined features of two classes, you still have the same number of feats, WBL and other stuff as a single classed character.
Since wearing heavier armor might interfere with some of your Roguish aspects, you might consider looking at the Evangelist archetype for the Cleric. If you want to be a convincing talker to guide people away from the fact that you are a Cleric, the Rogue tricks Charmer and Honeyed Words might help.

[avr]

Rogues often like to use two-weapon fighting to maximise sneak attack. This isn't compatible with casting spells unless you use a double weapon like a quarterstaff, which doesn't use weapon finesse if you're going that way. So: TWF with finesse weapons but without combat spells, or TWF with a staff, or just use one finesse weapon.

Note the unchained variant of the rogue BTW. There are many classes which can replace a rogue but in gestalt it's a perfectly good option. A cleric could well be replaced by an oracle if you want to focus on charisma rather than wisdom; life mystery oracles are very good at healing.

It helps to have darkvision if you're sneaking and it also helps to be small. On the other hand the extra human feat is nice.

Bluff doesn't come with amazing options to boost it, but few people really boost sense motive so just maxing the skill and a decent charisma should be enough.

[Krazzman]

Half-Elves really shine in Gestalt due to having 2 Favoured classes each level. As well as some other great racial features or alternatives for them.
If you want to stay a cleric but are going to be "opressed" along the lines of Clerics are forbidden: Hidden Priest. It's an Archetype that let's you fool your enemies into thinking you are using Wizard, Alchemist or some such spells instead of divine spells.

Alternatives to rogue (if you really only want it for bluffing) would be Bard, Slayer or Investigator. Inquisitor(Heretic Archetype) could work too. All 4 classes give 6+int-mod skillpoints. Slayer get studied target (it's just a +1-+5 bonus whereas a Ranger would get more out of favoured enemy but works against everyone you look at a bit).
Bard has Glibness on his spelllist (only one) and Investigator can get alchemist discoveries as well as rogue talents.
The Inquisitor is just another thematic fit.

[elementalpupil]

Wow, thanks for the help, folks!

I've decided to go Half-Elf Bard/Hidden Priest after reviewing my options a bit and taking your advice into account. I figure the Bard will assist in giving the Hidden Priest a way to disguise his spells, and also, that Glibness spell looks nice. My character will definitely be oppressed. . . Vampires don't care for priests of the god of healing, so I'm going to be hiding that from them as much as possible.

Are there any feats I should be taking? I want to maximize my healing power, mostly. . . I think just putting points into Bluff will be enough to keep me hidden and alive, especially if I use the Half-Elf's Skill Focus on Bluff.

Also, what stats do you guys recommend pouring points into? I'm definitely going to want Charisma and Wisdom, but I'm not certain which will be more important. My character will be old and not combat-heavy so Strength is negligable. Other than that, I'm not certain what I should be focusing on.

Thanks for all your help, it's really appreciated!

[Arc_knight25]

For an idea for hiding your casting ability. I'm reminded about a show called Carnivale (It ended sooner then is should have). It's set in the 1930's during the depression. So everyone is poor and just trying to get by.

Pretty much the main character Ben Hawkins(Nick Stahl) is looking for his father and some mystical stuff goes down. He has the ability to heal by taking the life of his surroundings to heal injury. He of course wants to hide this. He becomes an act for the carnivale close to the end of the series, healing blindness, polio and other assortment of ailments. They dress him up like some miracle healer (which he is) but turn it into an act. I suggest watching that to get some ideas on how to hide your healing ability.

[GreyBlack]

Rogues often like to use two-weapon fighting to maximise sneak attack. This isn't compatible with casting spells unless you use a double weapon like a quarterstaff, which doesn't use weapon finesse if you're going that way. So: TWF with finesse weapons but without combat spells, or TWF with a staff, or just use one finesse weapon.

Note the unchained variant of the rogue BTW. There are many classes which can replace a rogue but in gestalt it's a perfectly good option. A cleric could well be replaced by an oracle if you want to focus on charisma rather than wisdom; life mystery oracles are very good at healing.

It helps to have darkvision if you're sneaking and it also helps to be small. On the other hand the extra human feat is nice.

Bluff doesn't come with amazing options to boost it, but few people really boost sense motive so just maxing the skill and a decent charisma should be enough.

Jumping off this point, you become EXTREMELY MAD doing the TWF with a staff. Your strength becomes extremely important doing this for your attack bonus, so TWF with Finesse might be a better option.

I know you're going bard now, but had to interject.