War Weaver Help

[Skysaber]

I was just statting out a war weaver, and I figured that some CO work had probably been done on that class before, so I did a google search and found the War Weaver's Handbook, Black Tactica Edition.

The problem is, that guide keeps referring to an older version, outright saying that "Oh, the previous guide covered that well, so I won't touch it" when, of course, that previous guide has long since been lost as it was on gleemax forums.

So I am looking first for The War Weaver Guidebook by Valdrax, did anybody save a copy, or know of a link to an archived version? All of the links I know are to the old, dead content.

Also, the guide I can find, the Black Tactica Edition, focuses on counterspelling and blasting, which was not to role I had envisioned. I was looking for more suggestions for proper loadouts of spells to put in your tapestry, hoping to gain inspiration from those who have gone before (and, typically of CO work, be blown away at least a few times by those who've thought about this a great deal more than I have).

But I really have little experience using this class, so any suggestions, tips or tricks would be welcome.

[Troacctid]

Here (http://web.archive.org/web/20090717044624/http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=769208) is the old guide, as archived by the Wayback Machine.

[Khedrac]

I was looking for more suggestions for proper loadouts of spells to put in your tapestry, hoping to gain inspiration from those who have gone before (and, typically of CO work, be blown away at least a few times by those who've thought about this a great deal more than I have).
My War Weaver's standard load was:
Haste, Fly, Greater Invisibility and Protection from Evil.

Comments:
I know the Haste can be cast at the party without the weave, but it is faster to include it in the weave.
Even normal Invis works well in the weave once I have run out of greaters memorised.
Prov v Evil (or magic circle) is for mind control blocking (why wait for the rogue to fail his save).
Fly - amazing what one avoids not being on the floor.

[Skysaber]

My War Weaver's standard load was:
Haste, Fly, Greater Invisibility and Protection from Evil.

Comments:
I know the Haste can be cast at the party without the weave, but it is faster to include it in the weave.
Even normal Invis works well in the weave once I have run out of greaters memorised.
Prov v Evil (or magic circle) is for mind control blocking (why wait for the rogue to fail his save).
Fly - amazing what one avoids not being on the floor.

Yay! An actual loadout! I was worried I might not get one.

By now I've read both guides (and was happy to do so, lots of good material) and a third thread about one optimized build, and they're all happy to tell you all possible spell options. But sometimes knowing all possible ingredients does not help you bake a cake.

In playing my War Weaver, when the party suddenly finds they need this or that buff cast on them, I find myself getting trumped by another caster in the party who has optimized for Chain Spell metamagic (and has enough initiative boosts that he practically always goes first). So I actually find myself in a competition for party buffer - and losing! So I was hoping to get my quiescent weaves loaded up and win by volume, getting 4 or 5 buff spells off when my rival gets one.

Still, that depends on getting loaded up on spells that are generally useful, and sometimes ideas on that don't pan out. So I was truly hoping to hear the voice of experience on that matter. And yes, the combo of Haste, Fly, Greater Invisibility and Protection from Evil sounds very practical, as there aren't a lot of situations that wouldn't help out in.

Any other ideas out there?

[Fouredged Sword]

Yay! An actual loadout! I was worried I might not get one.

By now I've read both guides (and was happy to do so, lots of good material) and a third thread about one optimized build, and they're all happy to tell you all possible spell options. But sometimes knowing all possible ingredients does not help you bake a cake.

In playing my War Weaver, when the party suddenly finds they need this or that buff cast on them, I find myself getting trumped by another caster in the party who has optimized for Chain Spell metamagic (and has enough initiative boosts that he practically always goes first). So I actually find myself in a competition for party buffer - and losing! So I was hoping to get my quiescent weaves loaded up and win by volume, getting 4 or 5 buff spells off when my rival gets one.

Still, that depends on getting loaded up on spells that are generally useful, and sometimes ideas on that don't pan out. So I was truly hoping to hear the voice of experience on that matter. And yes, the combo of Haste, Fly, Greater Invisibility and Protection from Evil sounds very practical, as there aren't a lot of situations that wouldn't help out in.

Any other ideas out there?

Ok, so you are finding yourself stepping on another party member's toes...

How much of your build is locked and what does the locked part look like now? What level are you playing at>

I ask because War Weaver is a very flexible class that can do some very interesting things if you come at it from an unexpected angle.

Bard 5 / Warweaver 5 / to sublime chord (power) or chameleon (flexibility)

You need early entry to pull of a bard 5 entry. Earth spell is the easiest, but others can function. Healing Hymn turns your cure light wounds into a powerhouse of 100's of HP worth of healing dropped as a move action.

Wizard 3 / Ruthar 3 / Abjurant Champion 5 / War weaver 5 / X is a fun build that will drive your DM up the wall.

War Weaver into Legacy champion is a way to weave higher level spells.

EDIT - General advice

Stored spells - You have basically two options for storing spells in your weave. You can ether do a super buff or panic button. The difference between these two is when you activate it. A super buff means storing good buffs and unleashing them at the first round of combat. A panic button means you store things to release once combat turns for the worst and you want to mix in some restoration on top of your buffs.

A super buff is great for action eccon, but with another buffer in the party it may be less potent. A panic button that can heal the party to full and boost as a move action is really potent, but is harder to fold into arcane casting (why I love bard weavers).

[thorr-kan]

Bard/War Weaver/Combat Medic. Brainstorming; no build advice yet. Opens some buffing options.

[sleepyphoenixx]

There isn't really such a thing as "too much buffs".
Even if the other caster is also a wizard there's still more than enough buffs for two. You just have to agree on who buffs what.

Otherwise there's always the option to add spells that the other caster can't use on others.
You've read the handbooks, so you should be aware of the tricks with Spellguard of Silverymoon/Magic of the Land and Master Abjurer, the various ways to shoehorn your way into divine list access and so on.

Still, as a War Weaver you generally want to go first if only to make your allies actions more effective. So get more initiative i guess. I'd suggest Primal Instinct (DrM) first for an easy +5.
One nice War Weaver spell is to start combat off with Nerveskitter (SpC) for your whole party. You can cast that even when flat-footed.
Other immediate action spells are also nice, if rare. Energy Aegis (PHB2) and Sudden Aegis (FoW) are the other two on the wizard list that qualify, granting energy resistance 20 and DR 10/adamantine respectively.

For your Quiescent Weaving i'd suggest Mystic Surge (PHB2) if your party has many casters. The ability to give everyone +2 DC and +1 CL on their first spell in combat as a move action is quite good.
Snake's Swiftness (SpC) is also good, giving everyone a free melee or ranged attack. To make that count combine it with Dimension Step (PHB2) so your allies can actually get into a good position first.
Combine these 3 spells into your Quiescent Weaving and it doesn't matter what buffs the other caster uses, they'll always be useful.

For defense i prefer Shadow Phase (SpC) to the more common Blur or Displacement because it's not defeated by blindsight or True Seeing.
Sakkratar's Triple Strike (LEoF) is also disgustingly effective in a melee-heavy party.

[Skysaber]

How much of your build is locked and what does the locked part look like now? What level are you playing at>

I ask because War Weaver is a very flexible class that can do some very interesting things if you come at it from an unexpected angle.

Well, it's set in Undermountain, and after the first TPK I switched from the Factotum I had been using (trying to explore the class) to my current war weaver.

It's set in Netheril, so everyone is playing a wizard+ something else gestalt. We just hit 9th level at the end of our last session, and I haven't chosen my newest class levels yet.

I've got 3 levels of wizard, plus 5 levels of war weaver down one track (plus the one I've yet to choose), and down the other, just straight Cleric because we've only allowed to take one prestige class at a time, and the d8 HD, med BAB, and base saves are good for making me less squishy.

Aside from everyone being a wizard, I am the cleric, we've got a druid, a paladin/techsmith (whose player is off in la-la land most of the time) and a fighter (played by the DMs nephew, who is as far from a good player as it is possible to be, yet still strangely effective at everything he does).

No templates, animal companions, or other minions allowed. For us, that is. DM uses monsteradvancer.com for most of our encounters, so we've seen and fought every crazy template under the sun (often with class levels thrown on).

Like I said, we've had more than one TPK with this group. One of our DMs is even infamous for them.

[Khedrac]

In playing my War Weaver, when the party suddenly finds they need this or that buff cast on them, I find myself getting trumped by another caster in the party who has optimized for Chain Spell metamagic (and has enough initiative boosts that he practically always goes first). So I actually find myself in a competition for party buffer - and losing! So I was hoping to get my quiescent weaves loaded up and win by volume, getting 4 or 5 buff spells off when my rival gets one.
If the other buffing caster remembering that he cannot chain touch spells? Look up which buffs are range: touch and load up with them.

Any spell that specifies a single target and has a range greater than touch can be chained

[Aharon]

I looked in my library, and the skeleton of a build I used had


Investiture of the Steel Devil
Polymorph
Girallon's Blessing
Fuse Arms

I have no idea what the party composition was, the spells are obviously most helpful for a bunch of melee guys, though. In general, the party composition also should influence what spells you put in your Quiescent Weave. The same load wouldn't do anything for a bunch of stealthy guys or other casters.

[Fouredged Sword]

Ok, good starting place.

Now, Warweaver only works for arcane spells so Cleric does not play well with it. Let's talk side class

Wizard 3 / warweaver 5 is a great base. You have an extra level to throw on the end and it may as well be something useful. Try Abjurant Champion as it will take your defensive buffs and turn them into something silly.

I like the idea of an action econ build. Wizard 3 / Warweaver 5 / Abjurant Champion 5 / ISFV 7 // Duskblade 20.

Warblade is there for sudden leap. A swift action move that you can power with boots of leaping and striding is powerful. Turn one involves a move action to unleash your weave buffs followed by a sudden leap and channeled strike. After a few levels you start getting free quicken on abjuration spells.

This also pairs well with Bard 20 (super buffs!) with healing hymn or Factotum for Mr One More Standard Action.

Dropping your PRC's on the wizard side opens up the possibility of going x 8 / Chameleon 10 on the other, meaning you get every 6th level and lower spell in the game. This requires a bit of book diving though.

[Khedrac]

I like the idea of an action econ build. Wizard 3 / Warweaver 5 / Abjurant Champion 5 / ISFV 7 // Duskblade 20.

Warblade is there for sudden leapSorry - warblade is where? - It is not in your build at all.

Re: War Weavers and clerics - whilst the class requires and progresses arcane casting, nowhere does it say that only arcane spells can be cast into the weave. In a gestalt game a cleric//wizard build with war-weaver in the wizard build half would be able to use the weave for both spell lists.

[Fouredged Sword]

Sorry - warblade is where? - It is not in your build at all.

Re: War Weavers and clerics - whilst the class requires and progresses arcane casting, nowhere does it say that only arcane spells can be cast into the weave. In a gestalt game a cleric//wizard build with war-weaver in the wizard build half would be able to use the weave for both spell lists.

Argh, I removed the single level to simplify the build and forgot to remove the explanation. My bad.

Also I must be misremebering the warweaver requirements. Well then Divine Metamagic Fell Drain halo of knives for EVERYONE!

Also get your hands on a Vaporal sword and weave Surge of Fortune and True Strike into your weave for a one hit KO on anything not immune to losing their head.

[Khedrac]

Argh, I removed the single level to simplify the build and forgot to remove the explanation. My bad.
It happens to us all.

Also I must be misremebering the warweaver requirements. Well then Divine Metamagic Fell Drain halo of knives for EVERYONE!
If your weave can take spells of that level then yes!

Also get your hands on a Vaporal sword and weave Surge of Fortune and True Strike into your weave for a one hit KO on anything not immune to losing their head.
You mean Vorpal. And no, you cannot cast True Strike into the weave as it is a personal spell and the weave needs ranges of at least touch - Sorry.

In general though you can have a lot of fun with a weave. The big problem is when you first enter the class and cannot affect all fo the party - whom do you choose?

[Fouredged Sword]

Both are still personal range... How to cheese this properly...

No ideas off the top of my head. :(

[Cosi]

Both are still personal range... How to cheese this properly...

polymorph your friends into symbionts, wear them, then use Share Spells to give them Personal buffs.