Madokar
2016-07-15, 10:14 PM
So my Pathfinder group is in an interesting position. Or maybe it would better to say, it is possible for the group to arrive at an interesting position. Spoiler ahead if you just want to get straight to my question, but I want to provide an example of the situation as it's playing out for me.
We're in the middle of a homebrew campaign that's been going on for about a year. The GM stuck us on the continent of Arcadia on the west side of Golarion. The one continent that has had no material written about it. No cultures, faiths and politics. Nothing. And so far, he's done well. No complaints. In fact, something he's done has prompted an interesting situation that I'd like to talk about and get some opinions on.
The party was on a quest to escort some religious artifacts to a temple on the southern tip of Arcadia. Due to the paladin (i.e. me) underestimating a bunch of urchins and their sticky fingers, the religious artifacts were pick-pocketed and sold on the black market of a city-state called Halftown (there is a halfling name for the city, but I have no clue how to spell it). Thing is, said artifacts turned out to 24 "Memories" that were actually a set of demiplanes contained within marbles that record how to combat and seal the Material Plane against incursion from Hell. The icing on the cake is that outside of their satchel, they serve as beacons to Devils to try and reclaim the Memories to undo the seal that prevents them from flooding through.
The GM was actually thankful for this, as before, he had no idea where the campaign was going to go. Now we have to reclaim all 24 Memories from random areas in the city (and sometime other PLANES). Now, the party has to be quick and discreet about this, since this can cause a panic. So the party has been trying to work with the Church of Abadar, the Lawful Neutral God of Law and Wealth, since that church is the largest of the various faiths in the city with the largest contingent of paladins.
Thing is, it wasn't long before we realized that these paladins, and the general attitude of the Abadarans in the city, was pretty Lawful Stupid. Case in point, we tracked some dragon cultists in possession of one of the Memories. Long story short, they were kidnapping poor people off the street and turning them into bombs. And in the process, their headquarters in the Noble Quarter of the city caught on fire.
Naturally, it didn't take long for the Abadarans to come see what all the ruckus was about. And it's here that the problems first started becoming obvious. First off, they executed one of the dragon cultists we managed to take alive while said cultist was unconscious, bound and helpless. Thankfully, my paladin had enough ranks in Heal to make a successful check to stabilize the cultist before he died. Then, they refused to enter the burning building without a permit. When the party entered the building once we realized that the cultists had an escape tunnel in the basement, the Abadarans went after US for B&E.
But all of that wound up being a minor HEADACHE compared to what happened later. We tracked down the dragon cult to a crypt and were able to round up a lot of them. When the Abadarans showed up to take the cultists into custody, we noticed something big. Some of the cultists were from the nobility of the city. Which in hindsight, made a lot of sense since the last base was IN the Noble Quarter. But when the Abadarans thought nobody was looking, we noticed that some of the PALADINS were taking bribes from the arrested nobles so said nobles could walk off scot free.
At this point, my half-orc paladin of Iomedae swore to start his own temple and order of paladins in the city to fight this massive corruption. And even though my temple isn't even finished yet, there are talks of some Abadarans defecting to Iomedae.
Now, here comes the issue. I believe that some of the more... zealous members of the Abadaran faith have been seduced by some Asmodean cultists. While we have no concrete proof of an Asmodean cult operating in the city yet, the fact that the Abadarans are more focused on rule of law, nobility, and the fact that the said nobility has been in possession of a Memory containing knowledge on how to seal and open gates to Hell, my paladin is fearful for the fate of Halftown. Not to mention the Abadarans are willing to execute someone without fair trial. That, and taking bribes are BIG no-nos for the Abadaran faith.
Ultimate Intrigue has also introduced a can of worms with it's Tyrant Archetype for Antipaladins, which allows for LE Antipaladins. So now it's possible for there to be Antipaladins of Asmodeus, and the paladins of Abadar can fall and convert to that class if this all happens as I suspect it will.
So this campaign has the potential to take the LN Abadarans, and divide them between the LG Iomedaen faith and the LE Asmodean faith. In essence, a big examination on when the drive for order hits the point of tyranny, and what it means to be Lawful Good when the Law is abused and twisted from it's purpose.
I know I gave a lot of backstory for the campaign I'm in, but I wanted to share how complex the issue is being presented in my case. Has anybody had issues like this in their campaign, when being Lawful was not as clear and cut as those of the alignment would like you to believe?
We're in the middle of a homebrew campaign that's been going on for about a year. The GM stuck us on the continent of Arcadia on the west side of Golarion. The one continent that has had no material written about it. No cultures, faiths and politics. Nothing. And so far, he's done well. No complaints. In fact, something he's done has prompted an interesting situation that I'd like to talk about and get some opinions on.
The party was on a quest to escort some religious artifacts to a temple on the southern tip of Arcadia. Due to the paladin (i.e. me) underestimating a bunch of urchins and their sticky fingers, the religious artifacts were pick-pocketed and sold on the black market of a city-state called Halftown (there is a halfling name for the city, but I have no clue how to spell it). Thing is, said artifacts turned out to 24 "Memories" that were actually a set of demiplanes contained within marbles that record how to combat and seal the Material Plane against incursion from Hell. The icing on the cake is that outside of their satchel, they serve as beacons to Devils to try and reclaim the Memories to undo the seal that prevents them from flooding through.
The GM was actually thankful for this, as before, he had no idea where the campaign was going to go. Now we have to reclaim all 24 Memories from random areas in the city (and sometime other PLANES). Now, the party has to be quick and discreet about this, since this can cause a panic. So the party has been trying to work with the Church of Abadar, the Lawful Neutral God of Law and Wealth, since that church is the largest of the various faiths in the city with the largest contingent of paladins.
Thing is, it wasn't long before we realized that these paladins, and the general attitude of the Abadarans in the city, was pretty Lawful Stupid. Case in point, we tracked some dragon cultists in possession of one of the Memories. Long story short, they were kidnapping poor people off the street and turning them into bombs. And in the process, their headquarters in the Noble Quarter of the city caught on fire.
Naturally, it didn't take long for the Abadarans to come see what all the ruckus was about. And it's here that the problems first started becoming obvious. First off, they executed one of the dragon cultists we managed to take alive while said cultist was unconscious, bound and helpless. Thankfully, my paladin had enough ranks in Heal to make a successful check to stabilize the cultist before he died. Then, they refused to enter the burning building without a permit. When the party entered the building once we realized that the cultists had an escape tunnel in the basement, the Abadarans went after US for B&E.
But all of that wound up being a minor HEADACHE compared to what happened later. We tracked down the dragon cult to a crypt and were able to round up a lot of them. When the Abadarans showed up to take the cultists into custody, we noticed something big. Some of the cultists were from the nobility of the city. Which in hindsight, made a lot of sense since the last base was IN the Noble Quarter. But when the Abadarans thought nobody was looking, we noticed that some of the PALADINS were taking bribes from the arrested nobles so said nobles could walk off scot free.
At this point, my half-orc paladin of Iomedae swore to start his own temple and order of paladins in the city to fight this massive corruption. And even though my temple isn't even finished yet, there are talks of some Abadarans defecting to Iomedae.
Now, here comes the issue. I believe that some of the more... zealous members of the Abadaran faith have been seduced by some Asmodean cultists. While we have no concrete proof of an Asmodean cult operating in the city yet, the fact that the Abadarans are more focused on rule of law, nobility, and the fact that the said nobility has been in possession of a Memory containing knowledge on how to seal and open gates to Hell, my paladin is fearful for the fate of Halftown. Not to mention the Abadarans are willing to execute someone without fair trial. That, and taking bribes are BIG no-nos for the Abadaran faith.
Ultimate Intrigue has also introduced a can of worms with it's Tyrant Archetype for Antipaladins, which allows for LE Antipaladins. So now it's possible for there to be Antipaladins of Asmodeus, and the paladins of Abadar can fall and convert to that class if this all happens as I suspect it will.
So this campaign has the potential to take the LN Abadarans, and divide them between the LG Iomedaen faith and the LE Asmodean faith. In essence, a big examination on when the drive for order hits the point of tyranny, and what it means to be Lawful Good when the Law is abused and twisted from it's purpose.
I know I gave a lot of backstory for the campaign I'm in, but I wanted to share how complex the issue is being presented in my case. Has anybody had issues like this in their campaign, when being Lawful was not as clear and cut as those of the alignment would like you to believe?