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View Full Version : Optimization First Impressions Matter! Make the strongest/optimal 1st, 3rd, or 5th level character



ES Curse
2016-07-20, 01:13 AM
I know the concept of this thread sounds odd, but bear with me. A lot of "optimal" builds don't come online until later levels, which makes them kind of hard to ever set up. Plenty of games, one shots especially, center around the lower levels where characters are simpler. Why spend so long to be powerful when you can get it out of the gate or after a few levels of play? That's what this thread is for: making characters that start strong, and figuring out what makes a strong low-level character tick. Scaling well past these levels is optional, but generally preferred. Some guidelines/justifications:
-Levels 1, 3, and 5 are chosen because many adventures start at those levels and they have universal trends. Level 1 is the lowest possible level, 3 guarantees a sub-class, and 5 gives you a feat and Extra Attack for the martials.
-There's being all-around good, and being specialized good. Both are fun to read, but notate what you're going for so people know where to look for further optimizations.
-Categories can be as broad as "best caster at 1st level" or "best build for great weapon fighting at 5th level". Really, just denote what exactly you're trying to optimize.
-There isn't a hard ban on UA, but you must put a disclaimer to it.
-If something is not RAW but uses common RAI, make a note of that.
-If something is RAW but a sane DM would say no, make a note of that too.

Most of all, have fun! This is meant to create optimal low-level characters, which implies less set-up and more time/chances to use this in real play.

Lombra
2016-07-20, 01:20 AM
1st: Vhuman fighter with PAM: Glaive wielder

3rd: Vhuman rogue1/barb2 with grappler: no enemy can avoid getting incapacitated now.

5th: so many options, but staying in the line of martials, that level 1 glaive wielder now looks even better with that extra attack and those sweet maneouvers. Ranger beastmaster is a valid choice too.

PS: martial-focus builds

the secret fire
2016-07-20, 03:06 AM
Rogue is probably the strongest class in the game at level 1. The single sneak attack die makes a big difference in combat, and the bevy of skills allow the class to often take the lead in the other two pillars of the game, as well. Also, the Rogue's equipment needs are relatively cheap (studded leather + rapier, basically), so he can actually buy the gear he needs at 1st level, as opposed to having to wait on heavy armor, etc. Unless you're focused on pure DPR (and even then a level 1 Rogue will not do badly), the "optimal" choice for a level 1 character will probably be a Rogue, likely a vuman with a feat (lucky?). Nothing too complex here: level one Rogues are always stronk.

Level 3: a lot harder to decide at this point, though the Rogue remains very potent, with both the Assassin and Arcane Trickster Archetypes at this level coming online, and both being very good at level 3. But a lot of classes are strong at level 3, so it's hard to say. I'm guessing the most pure power at this level belongs to the Moon Druid.

Level 5: this is probably the Paladin's time to shine. He's got his extra attack, an ASI, and his 2nd level spell slots. The specifics of strong Paladin builds are already pretty well known. If you're a vuman, you can already have the brutal Polearm Master + Sentinel feat combo set up at this level, which, when combined with extra attack and enough spell slots to power divine smite, makes you an engine of destruction. As always: "Oath of Vengeance is best oath!"

2D8HP
2016-07-20, 03:12 AM
I don't know yet how I'm going to change him up but because of how often "Darkvision" is used, and how often "Perception" rolls come up I've been very pleased with my 1st level Wood Elf Rogue (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheet.html#id=868397).
STRENGTH=12
DEXTERITY=16
CONSTITUTION=14
WISDOM=16

With Expertise in Perception and Stealth, but I'm starting to wonder if Athletics would have been a better choice than Stealth.
The main flaw is that he just can't deal out as much damage as a STR 16, Fighter or Barbarian who wields a Greatsword.

At 20th level the "Ancients" Paladin looks to be the most "optimal".
In between? I'm hoping to learn from you guys.

Gastronomie
2016-07-20, 04:58 AM
For Level 3, Totem Warriors, Moon Druids, Lore Bards, Swashbuckler, Battle Master, and depending on the nature of the campaign, Tomelocks. I think.

The thing is that this list probably doesn't change much at level 5...

(Obviously, Warlocks really do depend on the DM. I've played a Warlock in a game where we got short rests in-between virtually every single battle once, and boy was he broken.)

Tarvil
2016-07-20, 05:32 AM
I'll assume Standard array for ability scores. I'll try to make melee combatant with independence from healer, as much survivability as possible and good damage output:

1st level:
Human Fighter with Heavy Armor Master feat, Dueling fightning style
Equipment: chainmail, warhammer and shield
STR 16 DEX 12 CON 16 INT 10 WIS 13 CHA 8

This character is designed to carry his party through first level. 18 AC, 13 HP, ability to cut 3 dmg from almost every enemy you'll encounter at this lvl, hefty heal as bonus action, and one-shooting common enemies like Goblins or Skeletons (if you roll more than one on d8) or Kobolds (always).

3rd level:
Hill Dwarf Moon Druid 2/Barbarian 1
Equipment - whatever
16 WIS and 13 STR, rest is up to you

This guy just kill stuff as 13 AC ball of hatred and fury with 68 effective HP (74, if you count Dwarven Toughness). Oh yeah, he can heal himself.

5th level:
Human Battlemaster Fighter with Polearm Master and Heavy Armor Master feat, Dueling fightning style
Equipment: plate, quarterstaff and shield
STR 18 DEX 12 CON 16 INT 10 WIS 13 CHA 8

20 AC, reduction from Heavy Armor Master is still good, Second Wind still let us roll without healer help. On offensive side, we have three attacks and good reaction attack with bonus damage from Dueling, Action Surge, and sweet, sweet maneuvers.

the secret fire
2016-07-20, 07:01 AM
The quarterstaff + shield + PAM combination is very corny, and will get shut down by many DMs (including me, fwiw). You might want to mention that bit.

Arial Black
2016-07-20, 07:33 AM
The quarterstaff + shield + PAM combination is very corny, and will get shut down by many DMs (including me, fwiw). You might want to mention that bit.

Agreed.

I even go back to the original wording of Dueling style, where you can't use it if you have a weapon or shield in your other hand.

It used to be that there were four modes for weapon use: single weapon, two weapon, two-hander, and sword & board. When the 2E Complete Handbooks came out, the Fighter one let you spend weapon proficiencies on styles, and every style specialisation had its own advantages.

When I first read the 5E styles I thought the same thing, until I was told that shield users could use the Protection style and Dueling. Some have even made threads with the erroneous assumption that non-weapons are weapons (because they have the word 'weapon') so can simultaneously use shield in TWF (on the grounds that shields are weapons) AND Dueling (because shields are not weapons)!

Then they made a thread saying that shields are armour so they can use the Armoured fighting style....unarmoured!

dejarnjc
2016-07-20, 07:36 AM
Rogue is probably the strongest class in the game at level 1. The single sneak attack die makes a big difference in combat, and the bevy of skills allow the class to often take the lead in the other two pillars of the game, as well. Also, the Rogue's equipment needs are relatively cheap (studded leather + rapier, basically), so he can actually buy the gear he needs at 1st level, as opposed to having to wait on heavy armor, etc. Unless you're focused on pure DPR (and even then a level 1 Rogue will not do badly), the "optimal" choice for a level 1 character will probably be a Rogue, likely a vuman with a feat (lucky?). Nothing too complex here: level one Rogues are always stronk.

Level 3: a lot harder to decide at this point, though the Rogue remains very potent, with both the Assassin and Arcane Trickster Archetypes at this level coming online, and both being very good at level 3. But a lot of classes are strong at level 3, so it's hard to say. I'm guessing the most pure power at this level belongs to the Moon Druid.

Level 5: this is probably the Paladin's time to shine. He's got his extra attack, an ASI, and his 2nd level spell slots. The specifics of strong Paladin builds are already pretty well known. If you're a vuman, you can already have the brutal Polearm Master + Sentinel feat combo set up at this level, which, when combined with extra attack and enough spell slots to power divine smite, makes you an engine of destruction. As always: "Oath of Vengeance is best oath!"



Yeah pretty much this IMO.

borg286
2016-07-20, 03:24 PM
I created the DPR king candidates thread back in 4th. Here are some point you may want if you want to make this compete with handbooks.
Make a thread and allocate the first 7 posts to yourself.
I recommend using levels 1,5, 14, and 20. 14 is the level where many stock classes get their power boost. Moving this out N levels encourages dipping those N levels. You'll probably want a sample between 5 and 14/15. It's up to you how much you want to prioritize level 6 bonuses + N dipping levels.
The way I handled questionable material was to make a glossary of tags that represent various types of cheese people use. There doesn't seem to be much abuse so far, so your list will include spell-less ranger and anything else that designer makes.
Due to the loss of rolls in 5e you can't make a Leader section, and Defender section. Strikers have a nice easy way to rank them, which encourages people to apply their creative genius and submit builds. strikers can use DPR. The challange I faced was reducing the to-hit bonus and damage average into an expected damage. This requires having a model of monster AC and possibly saves. While we have stats it is really up to you to make up a formula to spit out AC given a build's level. I encourage something linear for simplicity. If you can get a formula for monster HP then you can calculate the KPR (monster HP / DPR) ie. how many rounds it takes to kill a monster. This normalizes level out of the equation. Thus a kpr of .25 at level 1 means it'll take that character 4 rounds to kill an average equal level monster regardless of what level they are. This makes comparing killers much easier.
Doing this sort of comparison/competition for other jobs like battlefield control, tanking, healing, buffing, pulling an ally out of harm's way much more difficult. The most successful attempts listed a series of problems worth various points. The more problems typical for that job that a build could do the more points he got. Though it seems in 5e much of the survivability is placed in each players hands.
Next I've found that I couldn't expect people to conform to any format. Letting them submit in just some text best. I had to read each post pulling out the cheese they empoloyed and enter their data into a google spreadsheet.
Use a google spreadsheet and make it publically editable. This makes it more futureproof so that when you get board or busy (as I did) that others can feasably take over. Have this spreadsheet be the authority because invariably this forum will go away. Use links in the spreadsheet to the post of the person's build so you can get to it easily.
I also found that w/o such a resource that all the low-level optimizers stay quiet, but are in the vast majority. It is just that they don't have an arena to display their creation w/o getting overshadowed by level 20 'break-the-world' builds.
Level 1,3,5 is too fine grained for my tastes, but then again my aspirations were grander than yours. I don't find that level 3 will be very informative. Just stat out each class's optimal build at level 3 and call it a day. Level 5 allows for a level 2 dip and a 3 level dip elsewhere. You're going to find that there is more utility to be had than DPR builds. By focusing on these low levels the vhuman will dominate.
Thankfully you don't need to worry about magic items, though the +1,2,3 weapon will come in very handy in competing with monster AC. I still wouldn't give one to any candidates.
You need to do a better job on giving scope. Currently you just say "submit builds that optimize whatever thing you want" which is too broad. Give some direction. It may be biased but with so vague limitations people won't feel the drive to give you builds. I'd recommend using the term jobs instead of roles. Roles stirs up contention, while taking care of battlefield control everyone seems fine with assumming the caster is going to do something about it. Everyone assumes the guy with the big sword is going to try and draw the attention of the BBEG, preferably trying to kill him quickly. WHile not all jobs need to be filled in, I'd still group the optimization goals, probably using the term that treantmonk does (see The Party Roles in his doc (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1IeOXWvbkmQ3nEyM2P3lS8TU4rsK6QJP0oH7HE_v67QY/edit#) on wizards).
While it is a bit snarky I'm sure you can put a positive spin on it to encourage people to make better builds that do that thing.
It'd be cool to allow a way to show how good your build'd be on different party roles, the wizard of course taking the god role.
There is going to be lots of bickering on your thread as people argue rules. You will often be viewed as an authority. Use it wisely.

MaxWilson
2016-07-20, 04:28 PM
There's a lot to be said for a Rogue 2/Shadow Monk 3. Pass Without Trace + Stealth Expertise + Cunning Action will let you murderize anything you can hide from. (+19 to Stealth = Average 29-30 on Stealth checks.) If you take a variant human with the Skulker feat, you can even hide from monsters with Darkvision, in the dark.

On the down side, you don't have an ASI at that point--but for asymmetrical combat, Rogue 2/Shadow Monk 3 is about as optimal as I can imagine. It will solo things that even a Moon Druid would blanch at, e.g. Fire Giants and Behirs (both Perception 16). Your damage isn't much, about ten HP per hit, but it still takes you only two minutes to kill a CR 11 Behir (8.18 DPR vs AC 17). That's less time than it takes to run a single round of combat in real life, so the Behir probably isn't going to invent any genius countermeasures during that time.

Repeatedly soloing a wide variety of creatures up through CR 11 is more than I can see most 5th level PCs doing. Even a Moon Druid is going to run out of steam after the first or second encounter.

eldamir
2016-07-20, 08:50 PM
There's a lot to be said for a Rogue 2/Shadow Monk 3. Pass Without Trace + Stealth Expertise + Cunning Action will let you murderize anything you can hide from. (+19 to Stealth = Average 29-30 on Stealth checks.) If you take a variant human with the Skulker feat, you can even hide from monsters with Darkvision, in the dark.

On the down side, you don't have an ASI at that point--but for asymmetrical combat, Rogue 2/Shadow Monk 3 is about as optimal as I can imagine. It will solo things that even a Moon Druid would blanch at, e.g. Fire Giants and Behirs (both Perception 16). Your damage isn't much, about ten HP per hit, but it still takes you only two minutes to kill a CR 11 Behir (8.18 DPR vs AC 17). That's less time than it takes to run a single round of combat in real life, so the Behir probably isn't going to invent any genius countermeasures during that time.

Repeatedly soloing a wide variety of creatures up through CR 11 is more than I can see most 5th level PCs doing. Even a Moon Druid is going to run out of steam after the first or second encounter.
Taking Alert at creation and going swashbuckler at lvl6 would be even more brutal (+8 minimum initiative bonus) and getting your 2d6 sneak attack when soloing the above critters (Rakish Audacity). 2/3 Ki is used for the Pass without Trace, so you're also better off with a rapier - 1d8+2d6+3 unanswered damage per round.

Malifice
2016-07-20, 09:21 PM
Its a solid endorsement of 5E that the strongest 'builds' at 3rd and 5th level are single class characters.

At 5th level:


Fighters/ Barbs/ Monks/ Rangers/ Paladins get extra atack
Monks get Stunning fist (and extra attack)
Casters get 3rd level spellls known (Fireball, Fly, Haste, Counterspell)
Bards get Bardic inspiration/ short rest (and 3rd level spells known)
Rogues get uncanny dodge and sneak attack +3d6


Thats a tough list to top. The power jump at 5th for a single classed character is almost exponential from 4th.

Hudsonian
2016-07-21, 01:41 PM
I'm a pretty big fan of vhuman Champion 3/ Rogue 2 with mobile for a kite build. Expertise in Stealth and sleight of hand for crippling mages and archers. (Steal ammo/component pouches) Rely on champion for half prof in more skills.

Easy_Lee
2016-07-21, 03:37 PM
Level 5

Vhuman Hunter Ranger
TWF Style, Dual Wielder, half plate, collosus slayer, 14+ Dexterity, and two rapiers (or other D8 if strength).

AC: 18
Spells known: 4
Spell slots: 6
Damage Per Turn, assuming hits: 3 * [1D8 + 4 (attribute)] + 1D8 (collosus slayer) = 30

Half-Orc Frenzy Barbarian
Point buy, Great Axe, Half-orc, plate, 18 Strength, 16 CON, Sentinel at 4.

Foes cannot run away or safely attack others, 40' movespeed, 12+4D12+5*CON HP, survives one killing blow per day, adds additional 1D12 damage to crits, can use reckless attack to gain advantage.


AC: 17
In a frenzied rage, makes an extra attack as a bonus action.
Damage Per Turn, assuming hits: 3 * [1D12 + 4 (attribute) + 2 (Rage bonus)] = 37.5.

Hard to beat these at low levels.

MrStabby
2016-07-21, 06:30 PM
If EE is allowed then Aarackokra with a ranged attack are going to win a load of fights automatically. Ranged attacks are not unheard of at low levels though, which is the one reason I would question barbearians.

At level 1 I think Warlock is pretty sound. More spell slots per day than any similar levelled caster at this stage, ranged attacks so no worries about being stuck waist deep in a bog trying to catch a bunch of archers shooting at you. At 6 to 8 encounters per day and two short rests you should at least be able to use hex + eldritch blast nearly every combat and have options on other spells. Fey pact adds spell like abilities to screw around with those with poor mental stats.

At level 3 I think I might be tempted to still stick with warlock for the full 3 levels. Ok attack, helped by invocations. For those same encounters a flying creature trivialises the warlock can cast levitate or spider climb. Alternatively warlock 2, wizard 1 would be expected to provide in the order of 9 sleep spells per day, which at level 3 can be pretty dominating.

At level 5 it gets trickier. I would go for a pure sharpshooting hunter ranger for that balance of utility, ranged combat power and toughness - a solid all round character able to supplement very good damage with spell effects as needed. Still in the part of the game where heavy armour may be scarce so this is decent enough. Also worth noting this is the level where you can have a (yawn) sorlock with metamagic active.

MaxWilson
2016-07-21, 06:35 PM
If EE is allowed then Aarackokra with a ranged attack are going to win a load of fights automatically. Ranged attacks are not unheard of at low levels though, which is the one reason I would question barbearians.

What about... an Aarakocra barbearian 5 with Sharpshooter?! :-D

Flashy
2016-07-21, 07:42 PM
Thats a tough list to top. The power jump at 5th for a single classed character is almost exponential from 4th.

Yeah, it's reflected in the encounter building experience budgets too since I belive (Afb) the recommended values double from 4th to 5th level.

8wGremlin
2016-07-23, 03:01 PM
VHuman - Cleric, Arcane Domain. pump Wis > Con, Dex =14
Take cantrips: - 'Booming blade', and 'Firebolt'.
Wear medium armour with Dex 14, use a shield and a club, Your AC = 18.

Feat: Magic Initiate: Druid, take 'Shillelagh', one other cantrip, plus 'Goodberry', or 'Longstrider' for your 1st level spell.

Attack that key off Wis:
Melee: due to 'Shillelagh', and use 'Booming blade'.
Ranged: 'Firebolt' (arcane domain)

@1st you can cast 'Guidance' and have curing spells, plus 'Detect magic', 'Magic missile' as domain spells

@4th level: take 'War Caster' - any opportunity attack, is now 'Booming Blade'

@5th level you get Spirit Guardians plus 'Magic weapon', 'Nystul's magic aura' as domain spells

(a very effective and versatile character)

krunchyfrogg
2016-08-24, 03:20 PM
Agreed.

I even go back to the original wording of Dueling style, where you can't use it if you have a weapon or shield in your other hand.

It used to be that there were four modes for weapon use: single weapon, two weapon, two-hander, and sword & board. When the 2E Complete Handbooks came out, the Fighter one let you spend weapon proficiencies on styles, and every style specialisation had its own advantages.

When I first read the 5E styles I thought the same thing, until I was told that shield users could use the Protection style and Dueling. Some have even made threads with the erroneous assumption that non-weapons are weapons (because they have the word 'weapon') so can simultaneously use shield in TWF (on the grounds that shields are weapons) AND Dueling (because shields are not weapons)!

Then they made a thread saying that shields are armour so they can use the Armoured fighting style....unarmoured!

most of the people i play with now never even played 2e. what the rules were then dont affect us now. and trust me, i'm a borderline grognard

krunchyfrogg
2016-08-24, 03:21 PM
VHuman - Cleric, Arcane Domain. pump Wis > Con, Dex =14
Take cantrips: - 'Booming blade', and 'Firebolt'.
Wear medium armour with Dex 14, use a shield and a club, Your AC = 18.

Feat: Magic Initiate: Druid, take 'Shillelagh', one other cantrip, plus 'Goodberry', or 'Longstrider' for your 1st level spell.

Attack that key off Wis:
Melee: due to 'Shillelagh', and use 'Booming blade'.
Ranged: 'Firebolt' (arcane domain)

@1st you can cast 'Guidance' and have curing spells, plus 'Detect magic', 'Magic missile' as domain spells

@4th level: take 'War Caster' - any opportunity attack, is now 'Booming Blade'

@5th level you get Spirit Guardians plus 'Magic weapon', 'Nystul's magic aura' as domain spells

(a very effective and versatile character)
whoa, this is pretty wicked awesome

JTalbain
2016-09-24, 01:29 AM
Here's a somewhat versatile character that's got a bit of punch to them. They're completely playable and very useful right at level 5.

Half-Elf Rogue 1/Warlock 4, Assuming standard stat array

Str 8
Dex 15 +1
Con 12
Int 10
Wis 13 +1
Cha 14 +2

Half-Elf: +2 Cha, +1 Dex, +1 Wis, Bonus skills (Arcana, Survival)
Background: Urchin (Proficiencies: Stealth, Sleight of Hand, Disguise Kit, Thieves' Tools)

Level 1: Rogue 1 (duplicate tool prof, get Herbalism Kit), Sneak Attack, 4 skills (Acrobatics, Perception, Insight, Investigation), Expertise (Recommended Stealth + Perception), Thieves' Cant
Level 2: Warlock 1, Fiend Patron (Dark One's Blessing), Cantrips: Eldritch Blast, Mage Hand, Spells: Expeditious Retreat, Command
Level 3: Warlock 2, Spell: Burning Hands, Invocations: Beguiling Influence (Prof Deception and Persuasion), Eldritch Spear
Level 4: Warlock 3, Spell: Invisibility, Pact of the Tome: 3 Cantrips (Vicious Mockery, Shocking Grasp, Sacred Flame)
Level 5: Warlock 4, Cantrip: Poison Spray, Spell: Spider Climb, Feat: Spell Sniper (Cantrip: Thorn Whip)

This character has options for days. He has 10 skill proficiencies in total, and has loads of options both in and out of combat.

Diplomat: Good charisma and wisdom coupled with proficiencies in Deception, Persuasion, Insight, and Perception make you an ideal party face, even without magical assistance.
Rogue: Good Dex and Wisdom, coupled with Thieves' Tools, Perception, Sleight of Hand, Stealth, and the occasional spell make you very passable for traditional Rogue duties.
City: Between their skills, Thieves' Cant, and the Urchin background, this character is able to traverse any urban area with ease.
Wilderness: The character has a good wisdom and Survival proficiency, allowing them to more than pull their own weight outside of a city.
Downtime: Though not a huge consideration, the character can even do something here, using their Herbalism Kit proficiency to make Potions of Healing.

Combat: There are options all over the place here. With magic alone, the character can choose what defense they want to target (AC, Dex, Con, or Wis). They also have access to 7 damage types (force, fire, electric, psychic, poison, radiant, and piercing). Ideally, they'll be attacking at range, and they'll be incredibly difficult to deal with when they do. Eldritch Spear + Spell Sniper gives a ridiculous 600 ft range to Eldritch Blast, and taking less than total cover isn't even an option to defend against you. Expeditious Retreat, Spider Climb, Command, and Invisibility all give you different options to escape or maintain distance. If cornered in melee, Shocking Grasp is a good melee cantrip that gives you advantage to hit on many opponents and also lets you escape without provoking an Attack of Opportunity.

You can do more than simply damage enemies as well. With creative use, Thorn Whip + Spell Sniper is amazing. 60 ft range, and you can pluck enemies out of cover or windows, into pits, or (if spider climbing) just 10 feet into the air so they take additional falling damage and fall prone. Your mobility enhancing spells should be used to set up these opportunities, or merely keep range, whenever appropriate. If a bit more defense is called for, you can opt to use Vicious Mockery to give foes disadvantage to their attack rolls. Sacred Flame can also be used to trigger the weaknesses of certain undead. Be a team player, and do whatever the group needs at the time.

Try to snipe damaged foes; any time you manage to drop an enemy, you get temporary hp from Dark One's Blessing, aiding your lackluster durability. If you do have sufficient range, there are few options to attack you, and Invisibility defeats all of them. If they throw out an AoE spell and hope to get lucky, that sucks, but at least it will likely allow a Dex saving throw (your best save). You don't have many spells slots, but you get them back with every short rest. Played smart, and combat situation willing, this character can be virtually untouchable.

Vorpalchicken
2016-09-24, 02:06 AM
Clerics are really potent at 5th level. I think I would go with a Hill Dwarf Nature Cleric, focused on Wisdom and stomping around in heavy armor without the need for a stellar strength score. Great HP, great Con, poison resistance, Shillelagh, Spiritual Weapon, Spirit Guardians..

Specter
2016-09-24, 09:11 AM
Optimizing for healing: V. Human Life Cleric 4/Druid 1 (pick up Goodberry, along with Shillelagh and Magic Stone for better attack options)

ST8, DX14, CO14, IN12, WI18, CH10
Feat: Healer

You can spend all your slots on Goodberry (level 1 spell), each of them healing 40HP spread as you like. When you're out of spells, abuse Healer's Kit even further.

Black Socks
2016-09-24, 09:22 AM
Concept: "The Face"- focuses on social interaction and negotiation

((Note: I do not include backgrounds because in my opinion that should be related to RP, not optimization))

Race: Half-Elf
Class: Bard
CHA 17, WIS 15, DEX 13, INT 12, CON 10, STR 8
Skill proficiencies: Persuasion, Deception, Intimidation, Performance, Insight, 2 from background
Cantrips: Friends, Presdigitation*
1st level spells: Charm Person, Disguise Self
*For cleaning your clothes in an emergency.

Race: Half-Elf
Class: Bard
Archetype: College of Lore
CHA 17, WIS 15, DEX 13, INT 12, CON 10, STR 8
Skill proficiencies: Persuasion, Deception, Intimidation, Performance, Insight, Perception, Investigation, Sleight of Hand, 2 from background
Expertise: Persuasion, Deception
Cantrips: Friends, Presdigitation
1st level spells: Charm Person, Disguise Self, Comprehend Languages
2nd level spells: Suggestion

Race: Half-Elf
Class: Bard 4/Rogue 1
Bard Archetype: College of Lore
CHA 18, WIS 15, DEX 13, INT 12, CON 10, STR 8
Feat: Actor
Skill proficiencies: Persuasion, Deception, Intimidation, Performance, Insight, Perception, Investigation, Sleight of Hand, History, 2 from background
Expertise: Persuasion, Deception, Intimidation, Insight
Cantrips: Friends, Presdigitation, Minor Illusion
1st level spells: Charm Person, Disguise Self, Comprehend Languages
2nd level spells: Suggestion, Detect Thoughts