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Greyen
2007-07-03, 01:32 PM
Ok, I am playing in a high level game as a wizard. I have an equal level human fighter type traveling with me. I want to use polymorph ot Polymorph any object to turn him into a half-fiend/orc for the strength bonus and the wings or even better a halfdragon/giant(of some sort).

Now, as I read it, correct me if I am wrong here. Using the polymorph subschool rules his equipment would be subsumed into his new form and become useless. This would make the bonuses from his magic weapon and armor useless.

But I was thinking, and that is what breaks D&D rules I know, if the new form can use the equipment why would it be subsumed into the new form? Does it have to be or do we need him to strip it off first, then put it back on? Can it just not be subsumed if it will still fit and till be used?

Inyssius Tor
2007-07-03, 02:12 PM
If his new form has wings, his old armor will be useless anyway. He'll need to buy specially crafted stuff (1.5x normal price).

Fixer
2007-07-03, 02:15 PM
WoTC is presently trying to put the genie back into the bottle when it comes to Polymorph.

Originally the spell did what you want, but they have since changed it to automatically absorb ALL worn equipment when something polymorphs. This is to prevent cheesy things like "polymorph-any-object"ing someone into a far more powerful creature and letting them keep their normal gear without a little preparation first.

Of course, nothing prevening them from taking it off early and getting their artificer friend to move the enchantments onto new armor.

Iku Rex
2007-07-03, 02:38 PM
The polymorph subschool has very little effect on existing PHB spells. It's primarily intended for the new polymorph spells that only let you change into a single specific monster.

You can not use PaO to give someone a template.

From the Official 3.5 FAQ:


Can you use polymorph* to turn into a creature with a
template?
No. Polymorph is based on alter self, which clearly states
that “[Y]ou cannot take the form of any creature with a
template, even if that template doesn’t change the creature type
or subtype.”
*The question and answer uses “polymorph” to refer
specifically to spells that rely on the polymorph or alter self
spell to adjudicate their effect (including alter self, polymorph,
polymorph any object, and shapechange), ...

The FAQ also covers equipment:


What happens to the equipment worn and carried by a
character polymorphed* into another creature capable of
wearing and carrying the same gear? What if the new
creature’s size is different?
Unless stated otherwise, all spells in the polymorph chain
function as described in the alter self spell description, which
states that if the new form is capable of wearing or holding the
item, it remains worn or held; otherwise it melds into the new
form and becomes nonfunctional. A human polymorphed into
another Medium humanoid-shaped form (such as an elf,
grimlock, or bearded devil) can wear or hold all his gear, so it
remains in place.
However, this is one of those times when size definitely
matters, since your gear doesn’t automatically change size as a
result of polymorph. Assuming the new form has appropriate
body locations—for instance, a human polymorphed into a troll
or a pixie—most of your magic items (rings, cloaks, boots, and
other items of magic clothing or jewelry) still fit just fine
regardless of your new size (see “Size and Magic Items” on
page 213 of the Dungeon Master’s Guide).
Nonmagical clothing and accoutrements that don’t fit the
new size meld into the character’s body when he is
polymorphed. (The Sage recommends that DMs err on the side
of leniency when determining what the new form can or can’t
wear.)
Similarly, armor (even magic armor) doesn’t resize to fit
wearers of different sizes. The human described above loses the
benefit of his +1 full plate armor as it melds into his body,
even though the new form is capable of wearing armor.
As long as your new form can hold weapons (that is, it has
hands or other similarly dexterous extremities), you hold on to
whatever weapons you had before the change. However, since
the weapons are no longer of a size appropriate to you, you take
a penalty on attack rolls with them as described on page 113 of
the Player’s Handbook. A human polymorphed into a troll can
still hold his Medium weapons (although they’re now one size
category too small for optimal use and thus he’ll suffer a –2
penalty on attack rolls). On the plus side, he can now wield that
Medium greatsword with only one hand, meaning he could
pick up a shield or a second weapon to wield simultaneously.
If your barbarian is regularly polymorphed into a troll or
stone giant, you might want to consider carrying an extra Large
weapon for use in those situations.
*The question and answer uses “polymorph” to refer
specifically to spells that rely on the polymorph or alter self
spell to adjudicate their effect (including alter self, polymorph,
polymorph any object, and shapechange), psionic powers based
on the metamorphosis power (including metamorphosis and
greater metamorphosis), and any other effect based on either of
these lists.

You'll probably also want to read this answer:


What properties of polymorph are inherited for the spell
polymorph any object (Player’s Handbook, page 263)? The
guidelines suggest that it overrides the normal rules for
creature type (an object isn’t any type of creature) and Hit
Die limits (turning a pebble into a human or a shrew into a
manticore, for example), but the spell doesn’t explicitly
describe the changes.
You correctly note that polymorph any object isn’t as clear
as it could be. The intent of the spell, however, becomes clear
by reading the accompanying charts. Polymorph any object
retains all the limitations of polymorph except as follows:
• It can affect an object, and also adds “object” to the list of
new forms allowed. It doesn’t add any more eligible creature
types for the new form (you can’t use polymorph any object to
assume the form of a construct, elemental, outsider, or undead).
• The assumed form still can’t have more Hit Dice than
your caster level (to a maximum of 15 HD at 15th level), but
the secondary limit of the subject’s original HD doesn’t apply.
A pebble (with no HD) or a lizard (with 1 HD) can be
transformed into any form whose HD don’t exceed 15 or the
caster’s level, whichever is lower. (Arguably, polymorph any
object should have a higher HD cap than polymorph, but that’s
not how the spell is written.) The new form can even have no
HD at all (as in the case of a creature polymorphed into an
object).
The "best" form depends on the fighter's Int/feats and the books available, but Stone Giants (MM), Firbolg (MM2) and War Trolls (MM3) are generally good melee polymorph forms for a fighter.

PinkysBrain
2007-07-03, 02:43 PM
The important thing about the polymorph subschool is that it doesn't override existing properties polymorph chain based spells ... it is as such largely irrelevant to those spells, which shouldn't have been made part of the school.

Greyen
2007-07-03, 11:19 PM
Thanks All.