Help and suggestions picking a cleric

[AgentofChaos]

Our group is going to be starting a raven loft campaign in the near future and I was thinking of playing a cleric for the first time, however having read some of the threads on the board I am not entirely sure which type to take. I should clarify that I am not looking to play a character that hangs back and throws buffs and heals, rather I am looking for a character that can be an active participant in the combat, whether via spells or melee, but someone who can deal a respectable amount of damage and throw the occasional heal when absolutely necessary (in a party of 7 we already have 2 Paladins, so don't want a 3rd). I had been leaning towards a war cleric but those hear seem to imply it is not as effective as one would imagine. We are all starting at lvl 1, standard stat buy from the book...so would to hear some suggestions or feedback on effective choices in the type of cleric

[Gastronomie]

Whoever said War Cleric isn't "as effective as one would imagine" probably took part in a campaign with not many short rests.

With a lot of short rests, War Clerics are pretty damn awesome (I've had a friend use it in a campaign once, and boy was he effective). So you should check your DM beforehand about how much short rests he's gonna allow the players.

Another option is the Light Cleric, the Blaster (having Fireball and such).

Tempest Clerics can control the battlefield, as well as use Call Lightning, so that's another option.

And if the DM allows it, Death Clerics. They basically get to Twin-Spell "Chill Touch" every turn, which scales considerably.

[Axorfett12]

I would also consider the Arcana cleric from the SCAG. They get to pick up some wizard cantrips, which grants the cleric some decent at will spell damage. Or rather, something that isn't sacred flame.

[BurgerBeast]

It's not optimal, but Tempest cleric is super fun. I built mine for melee (as I said, not optimal) but had a blast. The reaction ability Wrath of the Storm is a lot of fun if you start at level 1. I just found it awesome. I could sit back and cast, and pick the time to wade in, drawing OAs and launching out the Wrath. Pick up maximized Thunderwave 1/day at level 2 (via CD: Destructive Wrath) for added fun.

[NotADragonYet]

I like playing Life cleric, for the Heavy armour, but if your DM allows it, Death cleric can get really powerful at higher levels.

[Herobizkit]

I will second Tempest Cleric as far more fun than it first appears. Slap some Hill Dwarf on it for some extra Norse-themed love (and extra HP!)

If your party is lacking a Bard or any heavy-Int characters (and odds are any non-Wizard or Rogue has dumped Int), I'd strongly suggest either a Half-Elven Arcane or Knowledge priest. Medium armor and shield is certainly ample for front-liners (even if optimizers say it isn't, hue hue).

The fun fact (?) about modules is that they often have tons of useful lore and other information that can go unnoticed because of poor Int and/or no proficiency in Lore skills. Ravenloft is, in fact, a perfect opportunity to play a "detective"-themed character, should you like such things.

Aside: Bard is the class you want when you want to do all the things or can't decide what to play. ^_^

[AgentofChaos]

When I first looked over the players guide I naturally gravitated to a human variant war cleric with the GWM feat to combo big hits, however guided strike is only once per short rest so not as frequent and war priest will only happen 3-4 times per day until hittin 20 wisdom at lvl 8.... I then thought of tempest using the magic initiate feat to pick up boom blade orgreen flame to work in addition to a melee attack. I will be honest I am rather new to any casting as I have always played melee characters so not sure what other potent combos exist out there that I am not seeing. Thought I had read there was a way for a cleric to pick up shillelaghs and boom blade can trips but those are 2 different class spells

[Giant2005]

Thought I had read there was a way for a cleric to pick up shillelaghs and boom blade can trips but those are 2 different class spells

Either a Nature or Arcana Cleric can get both Shillelagh and Booming Blade. They get one via a class ability and take the other via Magic Initiate.
Although you can do the same thing on any other Cleric too, either by multiclassing in a single level of Druid/Sorcerer/Warlock/Wizard and taking the other with Magic Initiate, or by taking both the Magic Initiate and Spell Sniper feats.
If you want to deal respectable damage, then the Death Domain is the only real path for you. It dwarfs the other domains by a considerable margin. I'd recommend taking a level of Wizard and following up everything else with Death Cleric. If you are using point buy, be a Variant Human for the sake of taking Shillelagh via Magic Initiate. If you are rolling, then just cross your fingers and hope to roll two very solid stats. You really want to avoid Shillelagh if it is reasonable to do so, because relying on Shillelagh really does harm your damage quite a bit (by delaying your casting of Spiritual Weapon and Spirit Guardians one more round than normal).

[AgentofChaos]

To be honest I am not committed to shillelaghs or any specific setup... I am looking for a means of providing respectable damage during combat.. Based on the previous post you had indicator death cleric might provide the best damage... At first level I assume this is with chill touch twined... If I go variant human (again not committed to this)... What feats would help to augment the effectiveness.... Originally I had thought magic initiate to get access to boom blade and/or green blade to allow additional damage, however that only works when used in combination with a melee attack and I assume the death cleric uses chill touch as its primary attack?

[Rysto]

Although you can do the same thing on any other Cleric too, either by multiclassing in a single level of Druid/Sorcerer/Warlock/Wizard and taking the other with Magic Initiate, or by taking both the Magic Initiate and Spell Sniper feats.

Another option is to go with a High Elf and take BB as your cantrip, and then either go with a Nature Cleric or Magic Initiate. I believe that the Half-Elf variant from SCAG can also get the free cantrip?

[Specter]

Melee cleric? War for bonus attacks and Arcana for Booming Blade/Green-Flame Blade both work. Up to flavor, I guess. If going War I recommend at least 1 Fighter level for Fighting Style.

[Tarvil]

I played CoS with Nature Cleric and he was great with Shillelagh and Booming blade from Magic Initiate feat. Also, his channel divinity helped a lot with some deadly encounters.

[bid]

With 2 pally, you prolly don't want melee.

Death has the best ranged option, with twin chill touch.
Nature for thorn whip also works, and dampen elements is nice.

Both of those use attack rolls, which hits way better than sacred flame. It's a shame both have divine strike instead of potent spellcasting.


War, I don't like war. 3 bonus attack per day is weak. Maybe with bow and SS you can get something out of guided strike.

[Slipperychicken]

For the "occasional heal when absolutely necessary", I think the life cleric's channel divinity is hard to beat. You can get someone from 0hp and dying to half health (or multiple people from 0hp to low health) in just one action and it doesn't cost you any spells. If you choose to follow it up with a healing word or mass healing word, you can end up healing quite a lot of hit points in a single turn. Don't be deceived by the paladins' lay on hands power -it gets depleted far quicker than you might think.

To deal respectable damage, I think you need look no further than spiritual weapon (no concentration, bonus action each turn) and spirit guardians (just concentration). If you intend to use spirit guardians while getting close to melee, then I have to recommend taking war caster and/or resilient(constitution), because the spell absolutely makes you a target. However, try not to have an obsession with doing that every fight or keeping up with the paladins and other damage-dealers, because that will quickly drain your spell slots on fights that are not worth it.

In the first few levels, you may be interested in getting the shillelagh or magic stone cantrips. The latter is from the Elemental Evil book and is basically a ranged version of Shillelagh. Both are on the druid list (meaning they may be accessible via nature cleric, magic initiate feat, or spell sniper feat), and enable you to make an attack using wisdom for tohit and damage. Using wisdom is the important part, so you can focus your stat allocation on just the casting stat. If your DM lets you TWF with thrown magic stones and get the full damage with the off-hand stone, then that makes for a good autoattack option. Either way, it's magical bludgeoning damage, so it should get past most immunities and hurt skeletons quite a bit.

I think that generally speaking, the best use of your concentration will be the bless spell, assuming the damage-dealer PCs are reasonably competent.

[Giant2005]

Based on the previous post you had indicator death cleric might provide the best damage... At first level I assume this is with chill touch twined... If I go variant human (again not committed to this)... What feats would help to augment the effectiveness.... Originally I had thought magic initiate to get access to boom blade and/or green blade to allow additional damage, however that only works when used in combination with a melee attack and I assume the death cleric uses chill touch as its primary attack?

Booming Blade is still the way to go. The reason Death Cleric is the best damage dealer isn't due to twinning Chill Touch, it is because of their Channel Divinity. You want to fight in melee if you are a Death Cleric.

[Imdeadagain]

My suggestion is...
Variant human, start with 1 level of fighter for duelling fighting style, second wind, all weapons and armour and CON SAVE PROFICIENCY.
Then add magic initiate as feat with shilalegh, good berry and one other Druid spell, go into arcana cleric for green flame blade and another offensive cantrip. At lvl 8 you will be doing 1d8 shillelagh plus 1d8 green flame plus 5 wisdom for shillelagh plus 5 wisdom for green flame blade cantrip from potent cantrip plus 2 from duelling on first victim for 2d8 + 12 and 1d8 plus 5 wisdom plus 5 potent cantrip on 2nd victim in 5 feet for 1d8+10 (both add an extra d8 at 11th and 17th level). If you pick up warcaster as a feat you can even cast green flame blade as a reaction for an AoO.

Add to this the cool domain spells and the ability to pick up high level wizard spells later on, it's a pretty cool class

[MrFahrenheit]

Going to echo the opinion that with two paladins, you're ok not going for a melee oriented cleric. Though if you did, don't neglect the nature cleric: shillelagh + changeable divine strike = you could be one of the least MAD clerics out there. But that's my secondary recommendation.

My primary recommendation would be a knowledge cleric. By second level, you're the party's main wis-skill guy, and backup guy for every other skill. Plus, a few levels later, you add your wis mod to cantrip damage. Also one of the least MAD cleric builds.

[Renvir]

I'm currently running a Tempest Cleric (Only level 5 right now) that MC'd in order to pick up BB and Shield among other things. He's a mid-liner due to less than stunning HP but I love being able to run in, hit with BB, and move away in the same turn. If they use their OA they either miss due to high AC/Shield or hit me and take more damage from Wrath of the Storm. Wrath can become even better in this situation when you get Thunderbolt Strike as they get pushed back 10 feet for hitting you. Either way they now have to a make a choice to move and take extra BB damage or sit their like a goober for a turn. While it should be obvious, I will point out that this isn't as useful against enemies with a good ranged attack, so plan accordingly. My single target damage probably won't ever beat our paladin's super nova smite ability but BB and Divine Strike only get better with age so make sure you stock up on d8's.

On top of all this you still have your ranged spells when you decide it is too risky to get in melee.

[AgentofChaos]

Well it appears we have now added a barbarian to the mix... So the party now stands at 2 Paladins, barbarian, thief, wizard, sorcerer... I know the logical choice would be a life cleric to buff the party and throw heals as required, but I know personally I would be bored out of my mind and I don't want to spend 2 years (the duration of our last campaign) playing something I have no interest in...so I think I have narrowed in down to arcane, death, or tempest... I think the party now has enough melee that I should focus more on ranged dips

[Southpaw]

The most fun I have had on a Cleric in 5th was on a Tempest Cleric that is similar to one listed above. Booming blade, Shocking grasp, and find familiar through Magical Initiate and Mobile let me roam around the field and use my familiar to land my touch attacks/heals. He was also a pirate, so that upped the fun value :smallsmile:

[DragonSorcererX]

I would also consider the Arcana cleric from the SCAG. They get to pick up some wizard cantrips, which grants the cleric some decent at will spell damage. Or rather, something that isn't sacred flame.

Yes! And if you are playing on the Realms, go cleric of Mystra to get some Mary Sueness...

[uraniumrooster]

I'll throw in my support for the Death or Arcana domains, because both get Chill Touch (and Death gets to twin it). Chill Touch is a must-have spell in Ravenloft to be able to stop Vamps from regenerating. Necrotic damage will only deal half-damage to them, but by preventing their Regen, you're effectively getting +10 extra damage.

Light is another good option, for Radiance of the Dawn and blasty spells.

With two Paladins, I think Life would be redundant. They should be able to face tank pretty well and keep themselves going with Lay on Hands, so you shouldn't need to do a whole lot of healing.

[Giant2005]

Well it appears we have now added a barbarian to the mix... So the party now stands at 2 Paladins, barbarian, thief, wizard, sorcerer... I know the logical choice would be a life cleric to buff the party and throw heals as required, but I know personally I would be bored out of my mind and I don't want to spend 2 years (the duration of our last campaign) playing something I have no interest in...so I think I have narrowed in down to arcane, death, or tempest... I think the party now has enough melee that I should focus more on ranged dips

I think having a Barb in the mix is more encouragement to go melee. Just convince that guy to grab the wolf power at level 3 and watch everyone kick ass.

[AgentofChaos]

So if I were to chose death, for the first few levels I am obviously going to use chill touch twined as my primary damage dealing method... But as you CROSS 3rd and 4th what does death use as its primary damage as it progresses up to lvl 10? On the flip side if I were to chose arcana what would I look to as my primary damage for the first few levels vs what would I use for the levels 4-10? I am sorry if these seem somewhat base attacks, but my entire D&D carrier has encompasses melee classes and I am attempting to branch out for the first time so don't recognize a lot of the combos I should be looking to for being effective.

[WickerNipple]

So if I were to chose death, for the first few levels I am obviously going to use chill touch twined as my primary damage dealing method... But as you CROSS 3rd and 4th what does death use as its primary damage as it progresses up to lvl 10? On the flip side if I were to chose arcana what would I look to as my primary damage for the first few levels vs what would I use for the levels 4-10? I am sorry if these seem somewhat base attacks, but my entire D&D carrier has encompasses melee classes and I am attempting to branch out for the first time so don't recognize a lot of the combos I should be looking to for being effective.

Basic cleric early-mid level spell behavior is to keep Spiritual Weapon up as much as possible to give you a bonus action attack every turn. Use your concentration on Bless (lvl 1) or Spirit Guardians (lvl 3). Use your action to either hit someone in melee or cast a cantrip.

-- And since it's Ravenloft, I'd personally be looking into one of the domains that hands out free radiant damage.

[ruy343]

I am about to finish CoS as a DM, and it's been the most fun campaign that I've ever DM'd, so you're in for a treat.

Now, for a spoiler-free look at your party composition and what you'll face: please note that your party is made up of a lot of melee-ers. Your two paladins are going to be great for dealing with enemies who actually close in to melee range. However, since the name of the adventure is "Curse of Strahd", you know you're probably going up against a nasty villainous opponent, likely named Strahd. It's likely that he, and many other enemies you encounter in a Gothic horror setting such as this, are rather intelligent. Do you think that an intelligent guy like him would want to get up close to two holy smiters? Of course not.

I invite you to consider other possibilities, but I say that with the understanding that you can never have enough tankiness in a party, by any stretch.

[GorogIrongut]

I'll throw in my support for the Death or Arcana domains, because both get Chill Touch (and Death gets to twin it). Chill Touch is a must-have spell in Ravenloft to be able to stop Vamps from regenerating. Necrotic damage will only deal half-damage to them, but by preventing their Regen, you're effectively getting +10 extra damage.

INESCAPABLE DESTRUCTION
Starting at 6th level, the cleric's ability to channel
negative energy becomes more potent. Necrotic damage
dealt by the character's cleric spells and Channel
Divinity options ignores resistance to necrotic damage.

I'm gonna be honest in saying that I'm not familiar with the vampires of Ravenloft... but half damage usually means resistance... in this case to necrotic damage. If that's the case, then they don't get their resistance.

*loves my EK/Cleric of Death character*
So many options... so much awesomeness.

If you're going Arcana, then you won't want to multiclass.

[energyscholar]

Whatever class and approach you take, consider having ways to reliably inflict Radiant damage at range. Radiant damage good. Normally the Sacred Flame cantrip is mediocre at best, but consider that it does Radiant damage at range, which might be important in Curse of Strahd.

The OP's party clearly has LOTS of melee power, with 2 paladins and a Barbarian. Also has good Battlefield Control and Blasting.

What that party lacks is Support. Support is NOT the same as healing. Properly applied support can largely remove the need for healing. Support PCs can be quite good at other stuff. For example, a Life Cleric-1/Lore Bard-X will be a darn good spell caster, can shut down foes with Cutting Words, can boost the entire party with Bless (the Paladins can do this, too), and is an ace healer.

There are lots of ways to support your party effectively. Healbot is one of the less effective ways, and you find it boring, so do something that strikes your fancy. A well-played Death or Light cleric can fill the role very well.

Even a single-classed Rogue can make a terrific support PC: take CHA 14 & the feats Inspiring Leader and Healer. A 3rd level rogue can use Healer as a Bonus Action. Such a Rogue can Sneak Attack as an Action then heal an ally as a Bonus Action. Healer Feat combined with the Temp HP from Inspiring Leader provides about as much healing-style 'support' as a dedicated Life Cleric lacking those feats.