Staffing A Dungeon

[Ravian]

So I had an idea for a Reverse Dungeon Campaign:

Basic idea was that monsters were all driven underground by Adventurers. The monsters built Dungeons around the Underworld entrances as fortresses, but over time the Adventurers stopped messing with these highly defended locations and instead started using their considerable abilities to fight with each other and devastate the country-side like Chaotic Stupid Murder-hobos. As such, an organization of non-adventurers such as lords and merchants formed and ally themselves with the monsters, essentially offering to provide them with food (a rarity in the Underworld that is beginning to strain under its own population) in exchange for them staffing the dungeons with more manageable threats and treasure to distract the Adventurers with.

The PC's would play as members of the Dungeonguard, mostly made up of monster criminals and cast-offs that are sent to staff the Dungeons and generally expected to give the Adventurers a bit of a challenge so they continue dungeon crawling rather than ravaging the surface world or underworld.

Essentially what I'm looking at is to have the PC's be able to level up the Dungeon over time as well as themselves, by gaining access to more monsters and traps to even the odds against Adventurer parties of increasing difficulty. (as the infamy of their Deadly Dungeon attracts the attention of more powerful groups.)

I'm essentially thinking of reverse engineering the Combat Rating and Experience rules and treat the dungeon as its own character that the other party members can level up collectively. So for instance if the PC's gain 2000 experience, the Dungeon also gains 2000 renown that they can spend to add some more defenders, such as a pair of Worgs and a spiked pit trap.

Does this sound like a viable idea?

[NRSASD]

Seems workable to me! Don't really have anything to contribute though.

[Fable Wright]

Personally, I'd just give all the PCs a free Leadership feat, and tell them that followers include anything that has a CR appropriate for the minion type. For example, a level 1 follower could be anything from a Wall Blade Trap to a group of four Kobolds. Alternatively, if it looks like that would overstock their dungeon, just treat it as though they all shared one leadership feat, being the highest level party member + the sum of all group members' Charisma modifiers. Or just let them use the Minion rules from Exemplars of Evil.

One thing to consider may be using some Gestalt rules. For example, levels in Dungeon Lord and Beast Heart Adept provide some powerful and thematic abilities, but have a limited shelf life for advancement. Letting players gestalt with similar classes like that encourages them to integrate better with the dungeon and put a unique fingerprint on it. Might work out, might not. Who knows?

[ClintACK]

How do you see this playing out in a gaming session, once they've done the design and building?

Would *you* play the NPC adventurers while the party got to roll for the monsters and traps and things? Would the party characters show up for the final showdown, assuming any NPC party made it that far?

Or would they flip around and try to raid their own dungeon?

[Ravian]

How do you see this playing out in a gaming session, once they've done the design and building?

Would *you* play the NPC adventurers while the party got to roll for the monsters and traps and things? Would the party characters show up for the final showdown, assuming any NPC party made it that far?

Or would they flip around and try to raid their own dungeon?

I would say that after they designed their dungeon, I would be playing the NPC's adventurers, and the players would have their characters which could help direct the defenses against the adventurers, setting up ambushes and trying to minimize casualties on their side.

However, the adventurers will be a higher level than the players, if only to even the odds of the fact that they would be outnumbered by the party and their Dungeon.

[Malfarian]

I would say that after they designed their dungeon, I would be playing the NPC's adventurers, and the players would have their characters which could help direct the defenses against the adventurers, setting up ambushes and trying to minimize casualties on their side.

However, the adventurers will be a higher level than the players, if only to even the odds of the fact that they would be outnumbered by the party and their Dungeon.

That's an interesting notion, a "reverse" dungeon where multiple people are working against one. I've seen people "dual-GM", though they were alternating who ran which sessions rather than work together in real-time.

... interesting for sure.

[TheYell]

Separate of and alongside to the "tactical" game you should have an economic game going. Your dungeon has a colony of kobolds going that produce increasing wealth as they level. The wealth can be saved or spent on equipment or plowed back into developing the colony. I suggest this because it would seem your situation would reward an item creating mage and the question of what number of golems etc could be created or how to pay for summoning planar allies. And if a party of adventurers won the tactical game the would knock the colony back a few levels and raid 25% of the hoard, so the eventual breach of your defenses wouldnt totally end the game.

[TheYell]

gah i have no points in Posting Tables

Keeping it simple: a Size 1 colony produces 100 gp a week profit. Taking it to Size 2 costs 500 gp and takes four weeks build time.

Size 2 colony produces 1000 gp a week profit. Taking it to Size 3 costs 5000 gp and takes eight weeks build time.

Size 3 colony produces 10,000 gp a week profit. Taking it to Size 4 costs 50,000 gp and takes sixteen weeks build time.

Size 4 colony produces 100,000 gp a week profit. Taking it to Size 5 costs 500,000 gp a week and takes thirty two weeks build time.

Size 5 colony produces 1,000,000 gp a week profit. There is no size 6.

Now say they got it to Size 4 and raiders successfully defeat the PCs. They burn the colony down to Size 2 and loot 25% of the treasury. The game goes on despite the tactical defeat.