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View Full Version : OOTS #268 - The Discussion Thread



The Giant
2006-01-16, 10:14 PM
New comic is up.

Deuce
2006-01-16, 10:15 PM
friggin paraelemental - WOOT!

Zargon
2006-01-16, 10:16 PM
The trial starts ... with the return of an old friend...
And more crypto to figure out!
Great strip Giant!

Winged One
2006-01-16, 10:18 PM
WOOTS! Yay for reccuring support characters!

maximus
2006-01-16, 10:18 PM
The Crypto is easy this time....

Mr._Blinky
2006-01-16, 10:19 PM
Wait, is that the slyph they met in the Dungeon of Dorukan? 'Cause if it is, this could either go very badly, with her being a newbie, or very well, since she knows most of what really happened. She'd also know that at heart the Order are good people, and may help them in that way.

W00t!, third post.

EDIT: Crap, two people posted in the time it took me to type.

Zargon
2006-01-16, 10:21 PM
This is her... Celia... right?
http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=70

Erathia
2006-01-16, 10:21 PM
Wait, is that the slyph they met in the Dungeon of Dorukan? 'Cause if it is, this could either go very badly, with her being a newbie, or very well, since she knows most of what really happened. She'd also know that at heart the Order are good people, and may help them in that way.


She could also testify how in their hurry to get to the basement they willingly abused a portal that was off-limits to them and abandoned a paralyzed comrade to fend for himself in a room full of monsters.

Winged One
2006-01-16, 10:22 PM
Of course it's her. What other sylph would want to bother defending them?

Istielthia
2006-01-16, 10:22 PM
For those of you who don't feel the need to decipher the cipher for yourselves, "Qddd, baxww." = "Ewww, gross."

Great comic, love the paraelemental.

Anyone else get the feeling that Mr. Rodriguez might be a cousin of Elan's?

Amalthea
2006-01-16, 10:24 PM
Huzzah! Celia's back! ;D

Mr._Blinky
2006-01-16, 10:25 PM
She could also testify how in their hurry to get to the basement they willingly abused a portal that was off-limits to them and abandoned a paralyzed comrade to fend for himself in a room full of monsters.

If they didn't notice Durkon, I doubt she did either. And besides, at that point using the portal wasn't betraying Dorukan, since the place had, quite frankly gone to Hell. If anything, I think Dorukan would have approved of the Order using the portal to bypass danger and strike directly at his murderer.

Coldin_Torrence
2006-01-16, 10:27 PM
Para-Elemental. Priceless

SteveMB
2006-01-16, 10:28 PM
She could also testify how in their hurry to get to the basement they willingly abused a portal that was off-limits to them
She was the one who let them use it. (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=72)


and abandoned a paralyzed comrade to fend for himself in a room full of monsters
My read is that didn't notice Durkon, either (if she had, she presumably would have said something to the effect of "Hey, guys, what about the dwarf?")

Drraagh
2006-01-16, 10:29 PM
I think Dorukan would have approved of the Order using the portal to bypass danger and strike directly at his murderer.


Reading that quote, I'm reminded of the Star Wars line:

"f you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine"

Maxymiuk
2006-01-16, 10:30 PM
And V demonstrates the principles of speaking without missing a beat. ;D


While Roy demonstrates a certain law (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=246) we're all to familiar with.

All in all, a great comic.

Erathia
2006-01-16, 10:31 PM
She was the one who let them use it. (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=72)

Oh I know she let them use it, but somehow I think the defense was "It's not evil because we were told it was okay at the time" isn't going to cut it for a Paladin. They were strictly informed that the portal was for employees only and disregarded this fundamental law!

Stop using common sense on Paladin law!

Count-Tyr
2006-01-16, 10:31 PM
woot first page
Great comic as always...Love Mr Rodriguez
*edit*Dang namit 2 people got in before me taking away my first page spot

Seraph
2006-01-16, 10:32 PM
this should solve things quite handily.

BeregondoftheGuard
2006-01-16, 10:33 PM
Great comic! Loved the Star Wars reference in Panel 2. I also liked the return of Mr. Rodriguez. If only Belkar were there....

Dhavaer
2006-01-16, 10:33 PM
Score for the man in a very expensive suit!

Kulatu
2006-01-16, 10:35 PM
First of all, I'm saddened to see how many people in the first two pages failed to rant and rave about how Durkon has just been declared flatulent!

Second of all, why would Celia testify against the order? She's supposed to be serving as their defense, is she not? Based on how badly the interview with the Djinn went, she's probably pretty desperate to get a few successful cases under her belt.

Winged One
2006-01-16, 10:35 PM
I just realized something. There's just one word that can describe being legally defended by somebody who's life you saved: Karmarific! ;)d

Thomar_of_Uointer
2006-01-16, 10:39 PM
They're gonna win, I just know it!

Maxymiuk
2006-01-16, 10:41 PM
On another note, there's just something very, very amusing about seeing a lawyer with fairy wings.

Tawkis
2006-01-16, 10:44 PM
Ahhh Lawyers....
Really isn't that evil? Hiring Lawyers?


If it isn't, well just like wearing black Kneehigh socks with Bermuda shorts in the summer.

It oughta be.

Brickwall
2006-01-16, 10:44 PM
Paraelemental-the pun wasn't funny to me, but I loved the rest of the comic. Rodriguez is probably related to Elan on his mother's side, somehow.

Lord Xaedien
2006-01-16, 10:45 PM
I love the recurring characters in this strip, its the big thing that makes this worth reading!

evnafets
2006-01-16, 10:49 PM
They're gonna win, I just know it!
Save it for the predictions thread otherwise the Giant might decide to make them lose just to spite you ;-)

Loved the comic as usual.
Karmarific indeed.

NEO|Phyte
2006-01-16, 10:51 PM
Am I the only one that noticed the blatent Star Wars reference in the second panel?

Winged One
2006-01-16, 10:52 PM
Of course you aren't. I also noticed it, but decided not to mention it.

nightfire8199
2006-01-16, 11:06 PM
whoah hold up i cant find it. mabye i nedd glasess

Taren
2006-01-16, 11:18 PM
Does the OoTS's current situation remind anyone ELSE of something out of Pheonix Wright: Ace Attorney?

...Celia should have been a pheonix...

Krytha
2006-01-16, 11:29 PM
hooray for OotS! I wonder if Miko will get Belkar back on time for the trial? Maybe Roy should've represented the group... I think he could be a fairly effective lawyer...

Quixote
2006-01-16, 11:33 PM
I didn't notice the Star Wars reference, but I haven't seen the movies in a while.

Three characters enter the room, but they're all recycled characters. Brilliant. It confirms once again that this is the best-written webcomic on the internet.

I like the way Celia is dressed, but that's probably just me. It's a shame she already has a boyfriend... there's something about women with fairy wings...

Skyserpent
2006-01-16, 11:35 PM
wasnt that her outfit when she was alking to the Djinni? Anyway I think Elan might prove the better Lawyer if only for the fact that he has his high Charisma as well as Diplomacy, at his level he should be able to talk his way out of ANYTHING.

aaronbourque
2006-01-16, 11:36 PM
whoah hold up i cant find it. mabye i nedd glasess
Leia to Tarkin: "Ah, Governor Tarkin! I should have recognized your foul stench when I was brought on board."

Roy to . . . the world: "Ah. Of course, the lawyers. I should have recognized their foul stench when we were brought inside."

Aaron "The Mad Whitaker" Bourque

nightfire8199
2006-01-16, 11:42 PM
thanks i almost felt left out

rosebud
2006-01-16, 11:44 PM
Questions: I noticed another place with spotlights: Durokan's relic room (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=56). Are there any others?Comments: Elan seems mean with the Durkon odor snipe.:( I love the expensive suit comment. :)Did you notice: Shojo does not have a spotlight. One latch in Mr. Jones's briefcase disappears in panel 3 (and 6). If it is Miss Celia, her attire is more conservative than earlier. The slyph's wings are slightly different (two-tone v. light blue). Lighting or art upgrade? Roy still seems really pissed. :D Durkon still hasn't said a word.Replies: Regarding the employee portal, that was not part of the charges, and the ex-employer who made the rule was rather dead at the time. And she didn't know about Durkon, so the whole comment is rather moot. And it's not like Durkon particularly minded being abandoned for a few strips. :D If a "paraelemental" is "priceless", what are the items that cost money? :) Straw Lockpicks: Free Bowl of prison gruel: 1 CP Losing your treasure in an explosion: 1 million GP Representation at a capital trial by a paraelemental: Priceless(Other variants could be amusing.)

watermammal
2006-01-16, 11:44 PM
I still can't help but wonder how Belkar's behavior will affect the outcome of the trial.

[PREDICTION]

Heck the being of pure law and good might even let them off just to watch over Belkar...assuming he doesn't blast Belkar into a thousad pieces on sight.

Tharr
2006-01-16, 11:49 PM
Well I hope they summon witness people like the bad guys maybe the hidden thing would show up. How in the world are they going to understand Haley she cannot talk right so justice has problems. You can always challenge by combat as well all codes lead there. Durkon could always claim to have Thor summoned in his behalf in the court. They could always do a quest to prove honesty. V beware the lawyers might ask your gender.

Athanatos
2006-01-16, 11:58 PM
Somehow I don't see the OotS's fate as being too grim. After all, what tend to be the most stringent embodiments of law? Inevitables. And how do they usually deal with criminals? Not with execution, but with Geas and Mark of Law. I'd expect the BoPLaG to have a bit more compassion than them.

I can just imagine it: Trial goes awfully BoPLaG deems them guilty, and then proceeds to get on with the "Cleansing flame". OotS braces for the worst, but a pleasant light-blue fire simply consumes them without a trace of pain. Durkon then reveals why he showed no concern about the increasingly awful state of their defense: Cleansing Flame is a high-level divine spell that purges targets of evil and compels them to act in a good fashion.

Flak_Razorwill
2006-01-17, 12:01 AM
Does Celia's colored text box mean that her voice sounds like it was run through a vocoder? I'm guessin' some sort of "twin voice" filter. Anyways, it's been a few months, and she seems to have spent it wisely.

I'm glad Rodriguez made it out with at least one lung intact...

MaxTer
2006-01-17, 12:06 AM
Kitty Kitty , hello ! ;D

Fale
2006-01-17, 12:20 AM
It's good to see Celia again. She didn't have much screen time before but I enjoyed her character.

Leo_Forestclaw
2006-01-17, 12:23 AM
OK, sillly comment, but exactly how many post has it been since Durkon has said a word...?

pquekadl
2006-01-17, 12:25 AM
Celia showing up out of nowhere like that was pure genius.

LurkerInPlayground
2006-01-17, 12:27 AM
Oh I know she let them use it, but somehow I think the defense was "It's not evil because we were told it was okay at the time" isn't going to cut it for a Paladin. They were strictly informed that the portal was for employees only and disregarded this fundamental law!

Stop using common sense on Paladin law!


Actually, what is more pertinent: Celia is supposed to allow the pure hearted to have access to the rune. Which attests to the decency of the Order and corroborates the story that Roy gave Miko ("Our evil twins did it.") She herself can testify to their decency in saving her as well, although I don't think lawyers are supposed to be biased towards their client. Still, the Sapphire Guard has to give the Order some council and it's unreasonable to say that her testimony is invalid.

Aside from which, using the employee exits isn't exactly what they're being put on trial for. They're being charged with weakening the natural order of the universe. Besides, who can argue that using the employee exits is evil or unlawful, especially when given permission? Paladins don't have to be that anally inflexible...

Hopefully, Celia will win the case for the Order and finally have a worthy profession, as I sympathize with her.

Hawkeye
2006-01-17, 12:55 AM
yay for Celia! Jones and Rodriguez is a running joke for anything legal, but I never thought I'd see her again, especially not in a role this crucial.

Y'know, she makes a suit and fairy wings actually work.

humanpylon
2006-01-17, 12:56 AM
I like the way Celia is dressed, but that's probably just me. It's a shame she already has a boyfriend... there's something about women with fairy wings...

Actually I like the way she dressed when the order rescued her better. But that's just me. :P

Either way she's cute....for a stick figure anyways.

Oddly enough when she left the order last time she said she'd focussed too much on career and was going to spend time with family and boyfriend. Now here she is in a new career. Wonder what happened?

TarSheva
2006-01-17, 01:04 AM
OK, sillly comment, but exactly how many post has it been since Durkon has said a word...?

He's said nothing since #264. In fact, he's hasn't moved at all since they were led into the throne room.

(Well, unless you count a slight facial movement after Elan's comment.)

Paper_Golem
2006-01-17, 01:20 AM
Paladins don't have to be that anally inflexible...

Except the idea is that most of THESE paladins are. On one side you've got your Mikos, on the other you've got your Hinjos. The Sapphire guard so far seems to be decidedly "Mikofied", though the odd Hinjo-type guy crops up every now and then.

By the way, why hasn't anyone thought of the flumphs as witnesses?

humanpylon
2006-01-17, 01:27 AM
So they could testify about how the Order couldn't distinguish good outdated monsters from evil ones, and then repeatedly stomp on their heads and appendages? I'm sure the Order would love to hear from them. ;)

Eriol
2006-01-17, 01:27 AM
Actually, what is more pertinent: Celia is supposed to allow the pure hearted to have access to the rune. Which attests to the decency of the Order and corroborates the story that Roy gave Miko ("Our evil twins did it.") She herself can testify to their decency in saving her as well, although I don't think lawyers are supposed to be biased towards their client. Still, the Sapphire Guard has to give the Order some council and it's unreasonable to say that her testimony is invalid.

Aside from which, using the employee exits isn't exactly what they're being put on trial for. They're being charged with weakening the natural order of the universe. Besides, who can argue that using the employee exits is evil or unlawful, especially when given permission? Paladins don't have to be that anally inflexible...

Hopefully, Celia will win the case for the Order and finally have a worthy profession, as I sympathize with her.
That's all fine, but will the lawyer herself be able to testify on their behalf? Depends on how the court is run...

humanpylon
2006-01-17, 01:34 AM
Depends on whether the court is more concerned with law or with good

Duraska
2006-01-17, 01:46 AM
Regarding the Flumphs:

So they could testify about how the Order couldn't distinguish good outdated monsters from evil ones, and then repeatedly stomp on their heads and appendages? I'm sure the Order would love to hear from them. ;)

It was sort of implied that those Flumphs were eaten by the displacer beasts anyway...

http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=210

Theodoxus
2006-01-17, 01:49 AM
Are the lawyers Rich's good-natured poke at Hitchhiker's Guide? Where the lawyers for the philosophers tried to shut down the supercomputer? They act kinda like that... course, I think they were taken from Rosencrantz and Guildenstern... geez, everything always goes back to the Bard. Elan's in the right profession.

Rambling onward...

Theo.

PS: Great comic :)

Oznstuff
2006-01-17, 02:00 AM
Roy seems to be missing the point that Mr. Jones and Mr. Rodriguez, in addition to being the best lawyers around, are also by definition the worst lawyers around as well, so perhaps the Oots'ers don't have quiet as much to worry about as he believes they do...

wampus
2006-01-17, 02:07 AM
I donno, though I seem to see that they get the job done and done quickly, wouldn't that make them to be good lawyers?

Either way, with the return of Celia, I imagine personalities will mash and things will go boom..;.

*boom*

(first post)

idksocrates
2006-01-17, 02:11 AM
I think the fact that they have lawyers in the court is a good sign for the order. Celia I think will be a good Lawyer, and I can't wait for the courtroom battle!

maybe if the order is lucky, Rodriguez will keep messing stuff up for the prosecution.

humanpylon
2006-01-17, 02:11 AM
Roy seems to be missing the point that Mr. Jones and Mr. Rodriguez, in addition to being the best lawyers around, are also by definition the worst lawyers around as well, so perhaps the Oots'ers don't have quiet as much to worry about as he believes they do...
Hmmm...best and worst lawyers preparing a line of attack....It was the best of lines, it was the worst of lines.

rosebud
2006-01-17, 02:43 AM
She herself can testify to their decency in saving her as well, although I don't think lawyers are supposed to be biased towards their client.That's exactly what they are supposed to be. In an adversarial system of law, they represent the interests of their client. As to involvement, I don't see a sworn statement to be an issue on the defense side; in contrast, involvement on the prosecution side could be grounds for recusal.

Given competent defense, I don't see how Mr. Jones (and possibly Mr. Rodriguez) could remain on the prosecution. Mr. Jones represented Belkar in #228 for the restraining order and class action lawsuit. That provided an attorney-client relationship that should make it impossible to remain on the prosecution. Mr. Jones served a restraining order in #230 to Belkar; I don't know if that would disqualify him, but it might allow grounds to challenge his involvement.

Of course, given Belkar, Nale, and Xykon, it's entirely possible the trial could be interrupted before it completes.


Well, unless you count a slight facial movement after Elan's comment.Neat. I didn't notice that in Durkon until you mentioned it. :)


Except the idea is that most of THESE paladins are. On one side you've got your Mikos, on the other you've got your Hinjos. The Sapphire guard so far seems to be decidedly "Mikofied", though the odd Hinjo-type guy crops up every now and then.Um, we've met two paladins (Miko and Hinjo), the Commander of the Saphire Guard (Shojo), one cat (Mr. Scruffy), one (deceased) guard, and saw two clerics. That's it. Shojo's kitty interaction seems rather jocular. And Hinjo implied in #265 that she is more exception than rule.


It was sort of implied that those Flumphs were eaten by the displacer beastsI took their discussion with the displaced image as opposed to the animal indicated the opposite. (Surely a blink dog pack came to the rescue in the next off-screen panel. :))

Vargtass
2006-01-17, 02:45 AM
Oddly enough when she left the order last time she said she'd focussed too much on career and was going to spend time with family and boyfriend. Now here she is in a new career. Wonder what happened?

On her very first appearance, she was on the phone with her mother, testifying she would not go back to school, because she had a "decent" job. When that didn't work out she planned on spending more time with (among other things) her boyfriend. Perhaps things didn't work out for them, and she was pushed back to school, which so happens to have been law school...

Sylphs to the rescue ... in ways we never thought possible. Actually, this was probably the most surprising turn of events (Celia reappearing in this role) in a very long time (perhaps since the reappearance of the girdle).

By the way, speaking on what Humanpylon wrote, Mr. Jones would be the best lawyer, and Mr. Rodriguez the worst.

Bezaleel
2006-01-17, 02:58 AM
Very slick indeed, Mister Giant.

Balthor
2006-01-17, 02:59 AM
Or even better the being from another plane just happens to be a follower of BANJO!!

Raeden
2006-01-17, 03:18 AM
somehow I doubt that Banjo is lawful

humanpylon
2006-01-17, 03:18 AM
;D As funny as that would be I think Banjo would be too chaotic for the other planar being.

On a side note: Yay! I'm a dwarf!

Quixote
2006-01-17, 03:44 AM
If it is Miss Celia, her attire is more conservative than earlier. The slyph's wings are slightly different (two-tone v. light blue).

The wings are the same as the pair she has in the interview in comic #71. Her clothes are the same, too.

Tharr
2006-01-17, 03:59 AM
Hey techinally is that a double post in a row Vargtass. Sorry but people yelled at me for doing that once just wondering if the board lawyers are here.

Speaking of lawyers poor Haley cannot talk seems unfair she be charged. Yeah it also states a speedy trial which this will not be. No jury except well the big angel guy hovering.

I hate the fact Roys sister plot will be delayed before we get back to finding out what happened. Plus Belkar and Miko need to have a duel to death very quick trial solution. If Xylon the evil lich was real I sue for equal comic time and remove the lawyers.

So many plots too bad we can have multiple comics like the Amazing OOTS, Spectular OOTS, and Web of OOTS. Stan Lee Homage post.

Mjoellnir
2006-01-17, 04:30 AM
That's no fair trial, and now I doubt that Shojo is lawful good. Who manipulates a trial in this way, is crazier than Minsk and dumber as Elan has to be chaotic neutral. And the Rest of the sapphire guard seems to consist of Paladins of Tyranny from the Unearthed Arcana. But how can they smite evil? ;D

Vampire_Boy
2006-01-17, 05:22 AM
Well, well... I couldn't think this court case could lose any more credibility, but it somehow just went from being preposterous to being completely ridicuolous. How can this house cat led charade can be seen as a serious court? Not to mention that the whole idea of 'some obviously unstable follower of unknown and suspect deity kidnapping people in foreign lands to drag them all the way to face something akin to Spanish Inquisition'.

Tharr
2006-01-17, 05:53 AM
Just be glad it was Mr. Jones if Mr. Smith was there we have some real bad problems. "Mister Anderson I now free thanks."

AtomicKitKat
2006-01-17, 05:59 AM
Yay, the return of the air sprite/pixie woman/girl/thing! ;D

rwald
2006-01-17, 06:05 AM
The wings are the same as the pair she has in the interview in comic #71. Her clothes are the same, too.
Actually, now that I look at it, her wings did the two-tone thing in comics #71 and #72 (panels 6 and 3, respectively). So it's definitely just a perspective thing: if she's more-or-less facing the viewer, two wings are on the left and two on the right; if she's mostly facing left/right, all four wings are on the right/left, and the wings in the back are darker.

Edit: A more interesting thing to note is that her briefcase in #71 is a different color than the one she has now. Of course, she's certainly allowed to buy a new briefcase in the intervening time; it's just interesting because OotS characters usually don't change their clothing or personal items except for plotful (or art-upgrade) reasons.

Max_Sinister
2006-01-17, 06:08 AM
"They are the ONLY lawyers around!" Roy is so right.

"One highly skilled legal professional and one man in a very expensive suit". That was so great!

And Celia is back again!

Zantetsuken_Kokoro
2006-01-17, 06:19 AM
Woohoo, Celia ftw! You rock Giant!

Single Shot Zombie
2006-01-17, 06:46 AM
That was just CLASSIC! This strip is in top form, one of Rich's best!

Can't wait to see how the trial will turn out. ;D

Slibs
2006-01-17, 08:19 AM
Elan has the right idea: Lawyer parts!

SITB
2006-01-17, 08:23 AM
Now the only thing misssing in here is that music from "Chrono Trigger" trails...

SteveMB
2006-01-17, 08:45 AM
Actually, what is more pertinent: Celia is supposed to allow the pure hearted to have access to the rune. Which attests to the decency of the Order and corroborates the story that Roy gave Miko ("Our evil twins did it.") She herself can testify to their decency in saving her as well, although I don't think lawyers are supposed to be biased towards their client.
In an adversarial system (which is clearly how this court works), it's a lawyer's job to be biased in favor of their client (within the rules of the legal system).

It's probably a bit irregular for a lawyer to testify on behalf of the client, but the court is stuck with that unless they want to try to find another defense counsel.

Darius Midnite
2006-01-17, 09:06 AM
Wow... :o
I never saw that one coming...He

One excellent (But quite confusing) strip
;D

TomBoniface
2006-01-17, 10:15 AM
I wonder if the entire strip was a poke at a particular (unamed as per the rules of the forum) legal system wherein the genreal case for poor defendants is
1) A hostile judge who treats the defendants as guilty from the start.
2) A jury predisposed to accept the statement of the prosecution as true and those of the defendants as false
3) A weak defense cousel (here an undertrained paraelemental, generally an overburdened public defender with a small fractin of the funds the prosecution is given)

Perhaps Rich would care to comment.

BiggusGeekus
2006-01-17, 10:20 AM
Regarding the last panel....


Long.
Slow.
Applause.

aaronbourque
2006-01-17, 10:20 AM
Um, we've met two paladins (Miko and Hinjo), the Commander of the Saphire Guard (Shojo), one cat (Mr. Scruffy), one (deceased) guard, and saw two clerics. That's it. Shojo's kitty interaction seems rather jocular. And Hinjo implied in #265 that she is more exception than rule.
But you're forgetting that Miko is a placeholder for "everything the poster hates about Paladins" and that a lot of people hate Paladins.

Aaron "The Mad Whitaker" Bourque

nuwandabob
2006-01-17, 10:45 AM
I love recurring characters! Another great strip!

The_Wonder_Chef
2006-01-17, 11:17 AM
HOLD IT!

I was also reminded of Phoenix Wright when I read the strip. I find court situations much more exciting after playing that game.

Alfryd
2006-01-17, 11:21 AM
I see the proceedings are going to be somewhat more elaborate than I at first anticipated. Also, the Class&Level Geekery thread will need to start detailing Jones and Rodriguez.

Rosebud is very organised. You will never confound people that way. What are you doing?

Cleansing Flame is a high-level divine spell that purges targets of evil and compels them to act in a good fashion.
Gosh. That must be convenient.

Bear in mind Belkar is no longer with the OotS, so there would no longer be a direct conflict of interest with Mr. Jones. Since I would suspect him to be Lawful Evil, he would see no reason to raise the issue in any case.

Next please...

Wrecan
2006-01-17, 12:17 PM
I see the proceedings are going to be somewhat more elaborate than I at first anticipated. Also, the Class&Level Geekery thread will need to start detailing Jones and Rodriguez.

I assume they are Expert-classed NPCs with class skills of Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate, Knowledge (Local), Knowledge (Nobility), Listen, Profession (Lawyer), Spot, Search, and Sense Motive.

Doug_Lampert
2006-01-17, 12:39 PM
I assume they are Expert-classed NPCs with class skills of Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate, Knowledge (Local), Knowledge (Nobility), Listen, Profession (Lawyer), Spot, Search, and Sense Motive.
Rogues. A good stereotypical lawyer should be a rogue. It gives all the skills except Knowledge (Nobility) and gives more skill points than expert. Plus you get stuff like sneak attack (aka backstab) and a reputation for extreme greed.

Scorpi
2006-01-17, 01:08 PM
I think Mr. Scruffy is in truth a miniature Giant Space Cat.

OzymandiasVolt
2006-01-17, 01:13 PM
Just pray he doesn't go for the eyes.

Chunkaliscious
2006-01-17, 01:13 PM
I may be losing my mind ordid anyone else notice that after a brief cypher in panel 1, Haley's speech starts to return to normal between panels 4 & 5?

evileeyore
2006-01-17, 01:18 PM
I may be losing my mind ordid anyone else notice that after a brief cypher in panel 1, Haley's speech starts to return to normal between panels 4 & 5?
That was Rodriguez talking to the kitty, noy Haley getting over her asphasia and developing senility...

kerberos
2006-01-17, 01:22 PM
Just pray he doesn't go for the eyes.

Go for the eyes mr. Scruffy! Go for the EYES!!

Doesn't have quite the same ring to it, does it?

rosebud
2006-01-17, 02:01 PM
Rosebud is very organised. You will never confound people that way. What are you doing? ::)


I assume they are Expert-classed NPCsI like BardicLasher's epic-class suggestion (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?action=display;board=comics;num=1123097648 ;start=360#370), at least for Mr. Jones. Mr. Rodriquez at least runs well, at least, and has a few ranks in comedy.


Speaking of lawyers poor Haley cannot talk seems unfair she be charged.Charge and conviction are distinct phases. And Haley can talk and has exhibited other forms of communication, so the above claim is making needless assumptions.


I hate the fact [spoiler]. Plus [spoiler]. [spoiler].It's hopeless to assume that any of us know what will happen. It's fine to say that the tension is killing you, but to say that you know such-and-such an order will happen generally means it won't. :) There's numerous possibilities out there; question your assumptions.


But you're forgetting that Miko is a placeholder for "everything the poster hates about Paladins" and that a lot of people hate Paladins.You ran out of <sarcasm> tags? :) I'm somewhat curious what percentage of the Guard are paladins.


not Haley getting over her asphasia and developing senility...So much for the insanity defense...

(Of course, that wouldn't be helpful in societies where they burn witches. It's funny how a valid defense in one society is proof of guilt in another.)

The_Kobold_Hero
2006-01-17, 03:33 PM
I though that fairy would turn up again. . . 8)

He he. Now the OoTS has a chance!

Wrecan
2006-01-17, 03:42 PM
you get stuff like sneak attack (aka backstab) and a reputation for extreme greed.

A good lawyer doesn't need the former and the latter is already covered by "Profession (Lawyer)".

Lawyers aren't rogues. Lawyers call those guys "clients." :)

humanpylon
2006-01-17, 04:08 PM
I though that fairy would turn up again. . . 8)


I have to say I did not see this coming. I would love to know how long the Giant had this planned. Whether he thought it up recently or had this rattling around his head for a few months.

Kulatu
2006-01-17, 04:20 PM
Actually, what is more pertinent: Celia is supposed to allow the pure hearted to have access to the rune. Which attests to the decency of the Order and corroborates the story that Roy gave Miko ("Our evil twins did it.") She herself can testify to their decency in saving her as well, although I don't think lawyers are supposed to be biased towards their client. Still, the Sapphire Guard has to give the Order some council and it's unreasonable to say that her testimony is invalid.

Aside from which, using the employee exits isn't exactly what they're being put on trial for. They're being charged with weakening the natural order of the universe. Besides, who can argue that using the employee exits is evil or unlawful, especially when given permission? Paladins don't have to be that anally inflexible...

Hopefully, Celia will win the case for the Order and finally have a worthy profession, as I sympathize with her.


Four words: Miko and Mattress Tags.

aaronbourque
2006-01-17, 04:28 PM
Four words: Miko and Mattress Tags.
See?

Aaron "The Mad Whitaker" Bourque

Kulatu
2006-01-17, 04:35 PM
See?

Aaron "The Mad Whitaker" Bourque



Not really. o_O

Maryring
2006-01-17, 04:46 PM
Horray for wind spirits. I'm so glad to see her again. She is my favourite character who isn't a part of OotS.

rosebud
2006-01-17, 04:49 PM
Four words: Miko and Mattress Tags.I'll see your four, and raise you five: Miko is not the judge.

Tariskat
2006-01-17, 05:13 PM
And has anyone noticed that Roy was entirely right in "they're the ONLY lawyers around"? Mr. Jones, or a clone, is the divorce lawyer in Strip #50 for Elan and Nale's parents. Perhaps he lives forever. Ah, lawyers... I always thought they were vampires.

Devoured_Dude
2006-01-17, 05:53 PM
Roy's awfully whiny in this strip. I know he's facing utter destruction for a crime he didn't personally commit, but all this complaining doesn't ingratiate him with anyone.

Torger
2006-01-17, 06:16 PM
Forgive me in all my nooby ignorance, put I'm pretty sure that the portal/door/gate/whatever they're being charged for messing with wasn't labeled "Employees Only." I would think it's the one that was in the Lich's Lair when they blew it up.

At least, that's what I think.

Elurindel
2006-01-17, 06:19 PM
I'm glad to see the return of the paraelemental girl. It's great when minor characters turn up again, and you think "oh yeah!" and you go back through the strips just to check that it's who you think it is. And of course, the lawyers return. Still with someone who was actually at the gate as a guardian, she might just be their ticket to freedom. :)

Seros
2006-01-17, 06:22 PM
Roy's awfully whiny in this strip. I know he's facing utter destruction for a crime he didn't personally commit, but all this complaining doesn't ingratiate him with anyone.

Its what the average player sounds like when they get DM railroaded :)

I've been there, I understand where the man is coming from... even if its just a comic!

5tephen
2006-01-17, 06:22 PM
YAY Celia!!!

I gotta say- Rich is the KING of the shelved joke.

mossfoot
2006-01-17, 06:51 PM
I'm really glad to see the paraelemental babe back again ;D

Randomnesh
2006-01-17, 07:00 PM
One of my favorite strips ever, hands down. I laughed for a few minutes straight at the "expensive suit" comment. Then I got to the last frame, jumped into the air, and ran around the house screaming "They're gonna be OK! Celia can help them!" At the top of my lungs. Seriously. I had been losing sleep over nothing. (Great. I'm losing sleep over stick figures)

Anywhosits:


Roy's awfully whiny in this strip. I know he's facing utter destruction for a crime he didn't personally commit, but all this complaining doesn't ingratiate him with anyone.

I think I'd whine if I was about to be tried for something like that. It's human nature, and Roy is, in fact, a human. Besides, if it is a fair and neutral court, this shouldn't affect anything.

Although I highly doubt it is a fair and neutral court.

Tetralemma
2006-01-17, 07:42 PM
Although I highly doubt it is a fair and neutral court.
Of course it's not neutral. It's purely lawful and good. ;D (Up a level, down a level, anyone?)

That just reminds me of "Fair and Balanced". Two lies in one.

Leveller
2006-01-17, 07:48 PM
The fairy girl can just confirm that they DID stop Xykon, so if they didnt blow it up he would'd've just gotten back there with his army and used some poor peasant to get it to open.

Hell it was a good thing they destroyed it ;D

Lightman
2006-01-17, 08:03 PM
"I could have smelled your foul stench!" I love Star Wars quotes!

Randomnesh
2006-01-17, 08:19 PM
Of course it's not neutral. It's purely lawful and good. ;D (Up a level, down a level, anyone?)

That just reminds me of "Fair and Balanced". Two lies in one.

Let me quote Belkar: Ugh. Let's not start this again.

;)

Skyserpent
2006-01-17, 09:02 PM
Hell it was a good thing they destroyed it ;D

Aside from the weakening of the fabric of reality part...

Leveller
2006-01-17, 09:25 PM
Aside from the weakening of the fabric of reality part...


So what? THe universe is allright it seems. At least it aint collapsed yet. However if Xykon would've been able to get his grubby mittens on the gate he'd conquer the world or something.

Lyc
2006-01-17, 09:43 PM
Ah, lawyers... I always thought they were vampires.

Nah, zombies fit the profile better. Slow shuffling movements, stiff and jerky expressions, incomprehensible speech, travel in packs and usually a grey colour and smell funny.

[spoiler]Besides, the OotS already been given an out. Shojo has stated that gods have no boundries of juridistiction. So therefore the Northern gods have juridistiction over the sounthern areas as well.

Roy: The god Banjo just told me that we were acting under divine influence, and therefore can claim "Divine Immunity" as Banjo's influence, by your own words, is recognised here and must be followed. He also states you will provide 500,000 gold pieces as compensation for stress and mental anguish

xaourcav
2006-01-17, 09:59 PM
Celias eyes are a different color

Also Rich Is The God Almighty Of the shelved joke

rosebud
2006-01-17, 10:16 PM
Celias eyes are a different colorHuh? They're black in both places (when she's not trying to electrocute someone, at which point they're blue).

Ravenlord
2006-01-17, 10:27 PM
So what? THe universe is allright it seems. At least it aint collapsed yet.



Hey, let's set this nuclear warhead for countdown. And we didn't do anything wrong either, as there was no flash yet! ;D

Sanctu
2006-01-17, 10:34 PM
Well I hope they summon witness people like the bad guys...

Of the Flumphs?

Muzzleflash
2006-01-17, 10:50 PM
I hope Rich reads this, it's ok if he doesn't.

See, big guy? Stuff like the elemental as a paralegal is a twist no one is going to expect. Enough people will be guessing away at the overall plot that some of 'em are gonna nail it. Blind pigs and Acorns, you know? Just do like Abrams did. Make a seperate subforum for "speculation" and keep "reactions" in another. Then don't visit "speculation". Or you could keep the current system that does the similar thing.

The point is, when people guess that hard, it's because you've won serious hardcore fans. It's a fact of making it and also presenting your work in an ongoing serial nature.

You're the best. I just hope you remind yourself of that enough. :)

Marlene
2006-01-18, 03:14 AM
http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=65

Guess who!

rwald
2006-01-18, 03:55 AM
http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=65

Guess who!
Um, who? Yea, Jones and Rodriguez are the lawyers, but they're the only lawyers around (as Roy states). Was that the point?

rosebud
2006-01-18, 04:51 AM
Was that the point?Awww, be nice to the newbie. :)

Methinks it was that the lawyers in #32 (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=32), #50 (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=50), #65 (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=65), #228 (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=228), #230 (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=230), and #241 (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=241) are the same attorneys in #268 (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=268). If you don't catch the names in #32, it's not as clear that all the references in this thread to Mr. Jones and Mr. Rodriguez are references to the same two lawyers. (Their names are only mentioned four times in #268 and Roy's kinda whiney in this strip when he states that they are the only lawyers around.)

Perfectly understanable exhuberance. Welcome to the boards and be sure to read every comic oh, five or ten times just to be sure you catch all the lovely names and nuances, such as Belkar harvesting kidneys (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=104), the eight ball (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=127) on Elan's wizardly staff, or the name (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=132) of a favorite barbarian guild leader.

rwald
2006-01-18, 05:28 AM
Speaking of names, did we ever get Mr. Jones's first name? We do have Phil Rodriguez.

The Glyphstone
2006-01-18, 07:03 AM
He has no first name - he's too professional for that. He's just "Mr. Jones".

NullAshton
2006-01-18, 08:20 AM
About your spoiler colors... They don't work. They only work when you have a proper color profile for your monitor. With my old color profile, I could read them just fine, because of the LCD monitors contrast.

Marller
2006-01-18, 09:30 AM
(Of course, that wouldn't be helpful in societies where they burn witches. It's funny how a valid defense in one society is proof of guilt in another.)

Freely quoted after Lessing's Faust:
Nothing is faster than the borderline of good and evil. ;D

bexie
2006-01-18, 12:59 PM
I like the blue girl. She's wicked. I bet Roy feels bad that he said something mean about her when it was her that took Nale and all of them up to jail. But i guess they did break out...meh. The trial has got to be soo funny! ;D The cat is so great! I love the cat! yay!!!! :D

...lol.

theangelJean
2006-01-18, 03:39 PM
I wonder if Roy gets roleplaying XP for his plot summary?

Fantastic comic, keep them coming :)

Devoured_Dude
2006-01-18, 03:57 PM
Its what the average player sounds like when they get DM railroaded :)

I've been there, I understand where the man is coming from... even if its just a comic!

My usual reaction to DM railroading is rolling up a new character during the game, because I usually need it by the next game. :(

Healing_Hand
2006-01-18, 04:06 PM
Methinks it was that the lawyers in #32 (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=32), #50 (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=50), #65 (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=65), #228 (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=228), #230 (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=230), and #241 (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=241) are the same attorneys in #268 (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=268).

I think they were in this one one (#159) (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=159), too.

Zeekar
2006-01-18, 04:10 PM
I think they were in this one (#159) (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=159), too.


Interesting. Note how much younger the bandit king is in the flashback, but Jones and Rodríguez look the same. Their fathers, perhaps - are they the latest in two long lines of perpetual law partners? (Always two there are...) Or are they even less human than the typical attorney?

nightfire8199
2006-01-18, 04:13 PM
after looking carfully i found that there actually is a lawyer named phillup rodriguez. i doubt it was meant to be that way though. coincedence, certainly.

Coffee_Dragon
2006-01-18, 04:14 PM
Maybe the Comedic Device template includes Timeless Body (Ex).

humanpylon
2006-01-18, 04:37 PM
Interesting. Note how much younger the bandit king is in the flashback, but Jones and Rodríguez look the same. *Their fathers, perhaps - are they the latest in two long lines of perpetual law partners? *(Always two there are...) *Or are they even less human than the typical attorney?



Maybe getting his ass kicked by his daughter made bandit king go prematurely grey?

GeekDaddy
2006-01-18, 04:57 PM
No, I'm thinking they are of the same make as Alien Bounty Hunter and Cancerman from X-Files. Ageless, timeless and perpetual pains in the patootie.

The Giant
2006-01-18, 05:14 PM
The new comic will be up in the early evening today, like 6:00-7:00ish.

GeekDaddy
2006-01-18, 05:24 PM
Holy Hot Potato, I just figured it out! Thanks to Rich posting immediately after me and a strange twist of the space time continuum caused by static on my dial-up connection, I have tapped into Rich's brain a la "Being John Malkovich" and know how they will win the case.

The Fairy Modmother: Prediction removed


Hey, the predictions thread was locked, so I had to post it here.

rwald
2006-01-18, 05:29 PM
That wasn't Lord Xykon's Holy Blight, it was some unnamed (and now dead) goblin cleric (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=11). Plus, if they wanted to discern alignment, they could always use their free Detect Evil class abilities (only Miko is affected by the restraining order).

Lilly
2006-01-18, 05:42 PM
Umm... no the predictions thread isn't locked. The first one was a couple of months ago, but the second one is still open.

Tanikova
2006-01-18, 06:52 PM
I predict that Rich drank Nyquil again...... ::) ::) ;D ;D

just kidding

Zargon
2006-01-18, 06:54 PM
The new comic will be up in the early evening today, like 6:00-7:00ish.

Thank you! Saved quite a few refreshes :)

ByzCath
2006-01-18, 07:28 PM
No, I'm thinking they are of the same make as Alien Bounty Hunter and Cancerman from X-Files. Ageless, timeless and perpetual pains in the patootie.


That is not cancerman, it is Cigarette Smoking Man


The tobacco companies threatened Fox with a law suit if they did not change the name of Cancerman.

I post this correction in the hopes of avoiding an appearance of Mr Jones and Mr Rodriguez. :-X

zibeck
2006-01-18, 08:04 PM
The new comic will be up in the early evening today, like 6:00-7:00ish.

Rich, you are such a tease.

humanpylon
2006-01-18, 08:34 PM
I just hope that's eastern time! :D

Leveller
2006-01-18, 08:36 PM
you guys with the right time and all, in how many hours is that?

Ilaun_Undil
2006-01-18, 08:42 PM
I believe that it is 7:41 where I am, which I believe is the same time Zone as Rich? oh well I'm just feeling impatient :(

theKOT
2006-01-18, 08:44 PM
you guys with the right time and all, in how many hours is that?

About 45 min ago. But I kinda like this later stuff, makes it seem like it's not as long till the next one, even though it is.

Sylvius
2006-01-18, 08:54 PM
So Rich is on Central Time? Good to know.

I'll just mentally place him in Winnipeg so I remember.

Eriol
2006-01-18, 09:23 PM
So Rich is on Central Time? Good to know.

I'll just mentally place him in Winnipeg so I remember.
If you click on his name, it says The Giant is in Queens, NY.

Tanikova
2006-01-18, 09:56 PM
Actually he moved to the philly area during the time of the wretched dresser incident... so he is eastern standard time

Tmabbbb
2006-10-15, 01:12 AM
Yay! Celia! This trial might actually work out.