Scroll-munitions (spell based trick arrows)

[Joe the Rat]

We've had a few discussions on different ways to combine magic and shooting people with pointy sticks, mostly in the "Cast and shoot" or "Cast by shooting" varieties. I am looking at taking the latter version, and combining it with scroll-making.

The basic though is you have an expendable magic item that you can use to cast a spell, by shooting the arrow/bolt/bullet (or maybe dart). The effect functions like casting from a scroll, except that the spell effect is then targeted (for single target) or centered (for area effect) on whatever you hit.

I do have some concerns and questions on making this work:


The biggest breaker from normal scroll use is the extended range on spells. How bad is this break?
Assuming "scroll-like" construction, what should cost & labor be based on? How should it be adjusted?
Does the user need to be proficient with the weapon, or just use it with the usual non-proficiency penalties?
If we were to make this more potion-like (anyone can use one, no over-level arcana checks needed), how should that affect C&L?
Does missile damage happen, or is it "consumed" by the spell?
What spells do/don't work - Most self-spells are inappropriate. Are there other obvious exclusions, or is this a case by case issue?
Changing effects - some spells may be more limited in options, or function differently. Would a Lightning Bolt start from point of impact, or would this one just be "arrow turns into lightning bolt as it launches from your bow?"
Formula or technique - Is making spell arrows a single skill, or is each spell a different formula, requiring its own reasearch?


My initial brush at this is having a single creation method, running double scroll costs. The rest is up in the air, but favoring "be a caster, have weapon proficiency" as requirements.

So help me out here. What's a fair take to make my player's dreams of Cure Wounds Darts and Bigby's Boxing Glove Arrow a reality?

[CursedRhubarb]

This sounds like it could be a lot of fun but definitely will need some balancing and perhaps tweaking as it goes. Sorry this is a long reply but I've not figured how to add the condensed boxes yet.

Proficiency with the weapon of choice and spellcasting sounds good. After all, you'll be reading the scroll command as well as trying to fire a projectile a bit more complex than normal.

Using this type of ammunition would be like using a scroll so no extra attacks but since you will still have to target and fire to get the spell to activate I could see the arrow damage being applied if hitting a target. One arrow won't be too bad as you level and if you miss I'd add a percentile to see what happens. Low it falls short, hitting up to 15' short depending on how far away and how low, high it goes too far same distance, 1 it activates as you prepare to fire, 100 the scroll was a dud.

For effects I would go with it depending on the spell and perhaps offering slight variants. Target spells would use the weapon attack roll to see if they hit, AoE spells could be fun as they woul detonate impact so even if you miss it may still go off. Fireball, fogs/clouds and similar would use the ammo as point of origin, line/cone spells perhaps offer two types that can be made, one activates when fired, shattering the ammo and basically just a cast of the spell, or a more expensive version that detonates on impact, giving range to cone effects and line spells become vertical with 10' radius (3x3 square on grid) this gives them longer range but compensates by making them more precise and not a 120' shot them 60' line effect.

Making them or buying them I'd go with scroll cost + individual silver ammo cost. Variant line/cone cost being +25%-50%

[R.Shackleford]

We've had a few discussions on different ways to combine magic and shooting people with pointy sticks, mostly in the "Cast and shoot" or "Cast by shooting" varieties. I am looking at taking the latter version, and combining it with scroll-making.

The basic though is you have an expendable magic item that you can use to cast a spell, by shooting the arrow/bolt/bullet (or maybe dart). The effect functions like casting from a scroll, except that the spell effect is then targeted (for single target) or centered (for area effect) on whatever you hit.

I do have some concerns and questions on making this work:


The biggest breaker from normal scroll use is the extended range on spells. How bad is this break?
Assuming "scroll-like" construction, what should cost & labor be based on? How should it be adjusted?
Does the user need to be proficient with the weapon, or just use it with the usual non-proficiency penalties?
If we were to make this more potion-like (anyone can use one, no over-level arcana checks needed), how should that affect C&L?
Does missile damage happen, or is it "consumed" by the spell?
What spells do/don't work - Most self-spells are inappropriate. Are there other obvious exclusions, or is this a case by case issue?
Changing effects - some spells may be more limited in options, or function differently. Would a Lightning Bolt start from point of impact, or would this one just be "arrow turns into lightning bolt as it launches from your bow?"
Formula or technique - Is making spell arrows a single skill, or is each spell a different formula, requiring its own reasearch?


My initial brush at this is having a single creation method, running double scroll costs. The rest is up in the air, but favoring "be a caster, have weapon proficiency" as requirements.

So help me out here. What's a fair take to make my player's dreams of Cure Wounds Darts and Bigby's Boxing Glove Arrow a reality?



Set it up where everyone is a martial class and they can buy magic items?

https://docs.google.com/document/d/10m67vZb7EP3ehYQqokrgefMmC5nS0ds8msMxkVY-0nA/edit?usp=drive_web

Editchange gems to arrows (or another tech)