Will This Party Get Clobbered?

[Palanan]

I'm about to start up my first campaign using Pathfinder, and the players have settled on their characters:


Human Rogue 1 - emphasizing stealth and social skills
Dwarf Ranger 1 - two-handed fighting with axe and flail
Tiefling Magus 1 - reflavored Aldori dueling sword with kensai archetype
Catfolk Inquisitor 1 - four feet tall and focused on Intimidate

There are a couple ranged weapons floating around, but almost everyone in the party is focused on melee, and I'm especially concerned about the lack of a healer. I'm aware of the Playground's general views on in-combat healing, but I'm also aware of how fragile first-level characters can be.

The party will be traveling into a wilderness setting, with no convenient magic-marts or friendly village healers. None of us have gamed together before, so I don't have a sense of the group dynamics yet, especially how they'll approach combat. Given this, should I play it safe and give them a traveling companion to cover healing, or should I let them scrape by with their wits and meager resources?

.

[Honest Tiefling]

You appear to have TWO characters (The Dwarven Rogue and the Catfolk) interested in some social skills. Worried about killing your characters? Pepper the combat with some social or skill based challenges if you can manage it.

As for the companion...Give them a choice. They find someone who could be a potential ally, but needs some convincing. Maybe play up racial solidarity with whoever needs the spotlight. If they ignore it, well, that's their choice. If they accept, that's their choice and a result of their success. Through given player characters, they might just kill and rob the guy, so maybe give the NPC some healing items just in case they go that route.

[legomaster00156]

Well, they need to be resourceful. Give them a couple item drops/"supplies for the trip" (a.k.a. healing potions). See how they get along in the first two combats. If they're really struggling, maybe be a bit more overt about their need to handle their situation intelligently, or let them find a friendly NPC shaman or something who will help them out in exchange for some minor quest.

[Geddy2112]

If they are stupid or the dice really go against them...maybe.

In combat healing is only good to get somebody back to positive or prevent them from actually becoming dead. Their actions should be focused on ending the threats otherwise. The ranger and inquisitor are both wis based classes with heal as a class skill. A rank in it should give them enough to reliably administer first aid even if they can't take 10 I.E. combat.

In addition to the rogue and inquisitor focusing on social skills, you have an inquisitor and a magus in the party. Both have some good first level spells that will make the combat easier, if not outright end it(color spray) so I would not worry too much. If the inquisitor took cure light wounds as a spell known then you won't have too much of an issue. CLW is on the inquisitor and ranger list, so if you are really worried drop a mostly used wand of CLW. A wand with 3-5 charges should cover pinch healing at level 1, although you could also just give a few potions.

[Diarmuid]

Even if they had a healer, they would still be first level and could die to a random arrow.

Best bet is maybe a couple gifts from whoever is sending them into the wilderness or to arrange for them to meet someone who they can help who would then perhaps be willing to return the favor every now and then. Hermit who lives in a cave or something so you're not giving them a base of operations or anything but also avoiding "we rest for 6 days to heal up" after every fight.

Not saying go crazy and give them a ton of CLW potions, but a couple potions and then a suped up healers kit that can double resting healing for a night (no skill use) or heal 1d4+(1 per 5) over DC with a DC X (probably start it at 10 so they can take 10 if they want to) check (1 min activation to avoid in combat abuse) that has the normal 10 charges but maybe it weighs twice as much as a normal one.

[Eldariel]

1st level parties always suck. A couple of bad rolls/good enemy rolls and suddenly they may all be dead. There's a reason I basically never play or run for level 1 characters in anything but one-shots where everyone dying is kinda expected. Level 2, they could pool their resources and purchase a Wand of Cure Light Wounds or Wand of Infernal Healing and be fine; the Inquisitor/Magus can just use it and the Rogue can UMD it. This covers for all their downtime healing. Level 1 though, this kind of a party needs to be healing with Potions of Cure Light Wounds (or Scrolls for the Inquisitor) and their only Alpha Strike is the Magus who probably doesn't have that high an Int to maximize the chance of Color Spraying successfully.

Overall though, thanks to the Inquisitor and the Magus begin decent on level 1, they have a decent shot. An Inquisitor can do a respectable Cleric-impression with most likely two Cure Light Wounds per day, and the Magus can pretend to be a Wizard. This gives the party a decent, free way to replenish their health in a way that they don't just fall to attrition before hitting level 2. And level 2 they can buy the Wand and begin adventuring for real. Though you could also just toss them the Wand as a pre-payment for some task or whatever and go from there; that way downtime healing has a cost but they won't just be bogged down for days every time somebody takes damage.


If they're smart, they can always hire some help or buy some animals for when they expect to do fighting and use those as the first line of engagement.

[khadgar567]

I'm about to start up my first campaign using Pathfinder, and the players have settled on their characters:


Human Rogue 1 - emphasizing stealth and social skills
Dwarf Ranger 1 - two-handed fighting with axe and flail
Tiefling Magus 1 - reflavored Aldori dueling sword with kensai archetype
Catfolk Inquisitor 1 - four feet tall and focused on Intimidate

There are a couple ranged weapons floating around, but almost everyone in the party is focused on melee, and I'm especially concerned about the lack of a healer. I'm aware of the Playground's general views on in-combat healing, but I'm also aware of how fragile first-level characters can be.

The party will be traveling into a wilderness setting, with no convenient magic-marts or friendly village healers. None of us have gamed together before, so I don't have a sense of the group dynamics yet, especially how they'll approach combat. Given this, should I play it safe and give them a traveling companion to cover healing, or should I let them scrape by with their wits and meager resources?

.
human rouge if he is smart he will bolt in first opportunity so survives
magus and inquisitor team up may survive but became old couple
ranger I dont know

[icefractal]

The Ranger and Inquisitor can both use wands of Cure Light Wounds. It's above their normal WBL, but don't be afraid to just give them one, it's not going to break anything.

As far as lacking ranged attacks, that's not necessarily a problem - just keep in mind that creatures significantly faster than them will be extra tough, and creatures that can attack from the sky will be 'run away / get under cover' situations. At 1st level, things are swingy enough you can't trust CRs alone anyway.

It will become a problem if they keep not having ranged attacks and you want to use published adventures though. At that point, encourage them to get some backup ranged weapons; there's really no excuse not to. If their Dex is terrible, get touch-attack weapons like alchemical stuff or firearms. A stealth-focused Rogue probably means a decent Dex, so that's one person who'd be good at ranged at least. Also, the Magus will eventually be able to fly, but that'll be a while.

[Palanan]

Originally Posted by Geddy2112
If the inquisitor took cure light wounds as a spell known then you won't have too much of an issue.

Sadly, the inquisitor chose spells other than CLW.


Originally Posted by icefractal
At 1st level, things are swingy enough you can't trust CRs alone anyway.

So that's something else I've been wondering: what range of CRs would be appropriate for this party? And given that CR is a little dodgy at this level, what else should I keep in mind when designing encounters and threats?

[Fouredged Sword]

Crits are really, really nasty at level 1. Two bad rolls will kill just about any character.

For this party I wouldn't worry too much about the CR of the encounters they face as much as how many encounters they face each day. Without healing they can fight their own CR easily once, maybe better than a group with more support characters. The second fight is likely to go OKish so long as nobody rolled badly. Fight three means someone has likely rolled badly and is in terrible shape. Fight 4 is likely pushing the party up to the edge of their HP even if they roll well.

[Albions_Angel]

Weird. I have NEVER seen a level 1 party lose anyone. And all our games start at level 1.

Sure, when I joined another group and played 5th ed, people died, but in 3.5, a party of level 1s tend to fight CR 1/2 and 1/4 monsters. Even when I threw a party of CR1s at them as a boss (It was over their CR, but they had the surprise) they dominated. A threat or 2 happened but it didnt confirm. Its hard enough to hit at first level.

Maybe its also to do with the way we play death. We dont roll for death. Dead is -CON, while unconscious is -CON Bonus, with the player bleeding once per round once knocked out. Non weapons dont cause bleed out, so stray spells dont tend to kill things. Party focuses on keeping people standing. But I have no problems with level 1.