Help/advice for dealing with a first time/Railroading DM

[ProfHammer]

I just started playing in a homebrew campaign setting made by a new DM. The premise is pretty simple; ancient evil is back, players need to find keys to seal it away. During character building I wrote a lot of backstory with the DM. Dead parents, from a holy order that foresaw my involvement in the saving of the world, very motivated to fulfill this prophecy. First session the DM introduced me to my mother (who I thought was dead) and I find out that she is a god. I also find out that my lineage is one of the keys to seal the evil away and my mother is intent on raping me so that I impregnate her. So the GM made it clear. I can either have sex with my mother or use my heart as a key (as in have the heart removed from my chest). Am I wrong for this to bother me? I am kind of annoyed that he took my backstory away from me in such a big way and is forcing me to roleplay a really awkward scenario. Also now my character doesnt really have motivation, and the god can do pretty much anything she wants to me (as she is a god). Ideas?

[Gallowglass]

I just started playing in a homebrew campaign setting made by a new DM. ... my mother is intent on raping me so that I impregnate her. ...

Run. Just Run.

There are other better games out there. With less creepy DMs.

There is no salvaging this. I promise you.

[dascarletm]

How well do you know this DM or group? If the DM is a close friend tell them that you're not okay with this sort of... weirdness. If these are people you don't really know... See the post above.

[ProfHammer]

I am very good friends with the DM, but when I brought it up he made the excuse that he wanted my character to deal with a moral dilemma.

[ComaVision]

I am very good friends with the DM, but when I brought it up he made the excuse that he wanted my character to deal with a moral dilemma.

It's a poor author/DM that can't create a moral dilemma without using incestual rape. I've played with some BAD first-time DMs but there's no way I'd play in the game you're describing.

[Morcleon]

I am very good friends with the DM, but when I brought it up he made the excuse that he wanted my character to deal with a moral dilemma.

There are many, many other moral dilemmas that do not deal with rape, and are often more complex than just a binary choice and much less creepy.

If you aren't comfortable with playing out this event, tell your DM that. If they still force the issue after you've said that, my advice is just to drop the game. A friend who knowingly and willingly does things that makes their other friends annoyed and uncomfortable isn't much of a friend.

[Red Fel]

There are many, many other moral dilemmas that do not deal with rape, and are often more complex than just a binary choice and much less creepy.

If you aren't comfortable with playing out this event, tell your DM that. If they still force the issue after you've said that, my advice is just to drop the game. A friend who knowingly and willingly does things that makes their other friends annoyed and uncomfortable isn't much of a friend.

So much this, and what everyone else said.

First: "Rape or rip your heart out" isn't a moral dilemma, it's a DM trying to mess you over. It's just messed up.

Second: You're clearly uncomfortable with this. You should never have to ask, "Am I wrong for this to bother me?" If it bothers you, say so. And if anything, this should bother you - a lot of games are particularly careful to steer clear of this thorny issue, and your DM dove headfirst into it. Say that you're uncomfortable.

Third: As others have said, if the DM pushes the issue after you've said it's not your thing, you walk. You absolutely should not remain in a game where a DM is forcing rape on the characters. (Unless that's actually the game you chose. Not judging. But this doesn't sound like that.)

You say this is a new game and a new DM, and that the DM is a friend. That's fine. New DMs need guidance, and friends will (hopefully) listen to it. Tell him this isn't the kind of "moral dilemma" that goes over well. Tell him to avoid rape - or, ideally, any sexual content, given how he has handled it thus far - in the future. Tell him it bothers you that he rewrote your backstory. Tell him whatever is bothering you about this - lay it all out. If he's cool and agrees to go back and work it out, great. If he isn't, or tells you to lighten up, walk.

[Gildedragon]

Just go necropolitan and pull the useless thing out of your chest. Being dead never stopped no adventurer worth their salt

But running from the DM is probably good too.
Easier.
But undeath also works.
Even if it kills you, take a level in ghost

[dascarletm]

Is walking an option, or would leaving the game upset your relationship with your friend?

I'll step in your shoes and assume I feel the same way about this situation as you do:
I'd tell the DM, "Look. I'm not okay with mom-rape. It's kinda creepy and also you totally bogarted my backstory. I like your game otherwise, but I'm just letting you know because this ruins an otherwise awesome game."

If the DM understands, all is well. If he insists on this being some great moral dilemma tell him, "It may be a weird moral dilemma for the character, but I'm not playing this game to roleplay someone who got raped by their mom under threat of death. It's not interesting to me, and as a player I'd rather see my character die."

If he still does not concede, just let the character die. Re-roll the same character, and pretend the whole thing didn't happen. Is this a little passive aggressive?
Maybe, but I'm the advice the DM deserves, but not the one it needs right now. So I'll be ignored. Because I can take it. Because I'm not your hero. I'm a silent poster. A watchful rambler. A Dark Knight A Ogre in the Playground A scarlet M.

[Segev]

Yeah, talk to your DM (again) and make sure he understands that this just isn't cool for you. Moral dilemmas are situations where there is no right answer, not where you have to choose between sacrificing your life, utter squick, or the fate of the world.

One way to salvage this, if your DM can be shown why this is a bad idea, would be for a twist to be that it's a succubus LYING to you about it, not really your divine mother. Maybe the succubus wants to bring the key into her lineage, or inject her demonic essence into the key. Maybe she's trying to corrupt you by getting you to make a selfish, immoral choice cloaked as a terrible "necessity." Even if there's no real incest, choosing to willingly engage in it could mar the bloodline.

But first and foremost, make sure your friend (the DM) understands this is not cool as-is, and why. If needs be, let him read this thread; we'll be happy to explain where he's going wrong and how to do it better in the future. (I know that it might hit a brick wall of "but my friend the player is just trying to get out of a challenge" in the DM's mind if he hears it only from you. It's entirely the wrong way for him to look at it, but it's very human to ignore the gaping problem for the minor concern.)

Generally speaking, injecting rape/incest into a player's story without their explicit and eager consent is not cool. It's just...too personal and uncomfortable. (And "eager consent" doesn't have to mean the player approves of such things happening. It's totally cool to have flawed characters, or characters victimized by things you consider abominable. But it's not cool to spring nor force it upon a player nor his character if the player isn't willing to explore what he considers abominable.)

[AnimeTheCat]

You smite her.

She is clearly evil.

No one proposes rape as an appropriate action unless they are evil.

She's the bad guy, not your real mother, and she's trying to keep a key from being used against her.

Smite the ever living poop-in-a-bucket out of her.

Then find yourself a nice young priestess who falls madly in love with you, court her, make a son, and then sacrifice yourself at the end of the game and go out like a gods blessed martyr, because you can. If you do well enough, you my even get a blessing and come back as a Risen Martyr class, which could be cool (If your DM will do the fiat thing).

[prufock]

Tell your DM to frig off with the stupid garbage he has imposed on your character. That ought to do it.

If not, have your PC kill himself off in a way that destroys his heart, such as falling in lava or getting disintegrated. Congrats, you have just derailed the DM's plot.

If not, walk.

[BowStreetRunner]

You absolutely need to deal with this Out of Game. Do not just try to work around it through role-playing. The problem won't go away and will likely only get worse. Talk to the DM and let them know how uncomfortable you are with this situation. If they aren't willing to respect your feelings on this then respectfully withdraw from the campaign.

[Gallowglass]

Ask the DM "So how long have you wanted to sex up your Mom? Maybe you should talk it over with her instead of imposing your fantasy on me by proxy through the game."

But do it non-judgmentally. You know, just sort of as an aside in normal conversation.

[Eisfalken]

Here's what you do.

You go to the next game session, and make sure you have a ride ready to take you out of there.

When the game starts, you look the DM square in the eye and tell him your PC has a response to the ultimatum. And your PC basically says, "I have a third option." Then you drop yourself chest-first onto a sword aimed directly at your heart.

Rip your character sheet clean in half, thank him for a compelling game, and leave. Don't let him try to use platitudes or bargaining. Your character is either dead, or out of your control because Mommy-God raises him from the dead and does whatever she's gonna do anyway, either way it's on him now, not you.

Let him know when he's ready not to run a f***ed up game that involves incestuous rape, then he has your number/email/whatever.

[dascarletm]

Here's what you do.

You go to the next game session, and make sure you have a ride ready to take you out of there.

When the game starts, you look the DM square in the eye and tell him your PC has a response to the ultimatum. And your PC basically says, "I have a third option." Then you drop yourself chest-first onto a sword aimed directly at your heart.

Rip your character sheet clean in half, thank him for a compelling game, and leave. Don't let him try to use platitudes or bargaining. Your character is either dead, or out of your control because Mommy-God raises him from the dead and does whatever she's gonna do anyway, either way it's on him now, not you.

Let him know when he's ready not to run a f***ed up game that involves incestuous rape, then he has your number/email/whatever.

That is a great way to make the situation between your friend worse.

[Manyasone]

That is a great way to make the situation between your friend worse.

A true friend doesn't f**k you over like this....My regular DM and me go back 18 years, and he would never do something like this, because he knows I wouldn't stand for it

[Toilet Cobra]

...he made the excuse that he wanted my character to deal with a moral dilemma.

My main objection to this person's DMing is that they had a scenario they wanted you to encounter (this bizarre "dilemma") and they sprung it on you right away. A good DM knows to build up to their desired set pieces later in the campaign. Where was the ground work? Where was the character arc? Where was the emotional payoff?

Sure, a DNPC offered you a choice between sexual assault or death, that's also a bit of a non-starter. But bad pacing is truly unconscionable!

[Segev]

My main objection to this person's DMing is that they had a scenario they wanted you to encounter (this bizarre "dilemma") and they sprung it on you right away. A good DM knows to build up to their desired set pieces later in the campaign. Where was the ground work? Where was the character arc? Where was the emotional payoff?

Sure, a DNPC offered you a choice between sexual assault or death, that's also a bit of a non-starter. But bad pacing is truly unconscionable!

Well, he IS a newbie DM.

[dascarletm]

A true friend doesn't f**k you over like this....My regular DM and me go back 18 years, and he would never do something like this, because he knows I wouldn't stand for it

I don't know what their situation is, but by the OPs admission the DM is his/her friend. It could be that the DM does not understand that this sort of thing can carry weight. I confess when I was in my early teens I didn't understand that things happening in a TTRPG could affect someone to the degree that they can.

I think having the DM understand that these things can carry weight would be best.

[Theobod]

Being a newbie DM I can echo the sentiment that he may not be aware of the effects a bad taste scene like this can have on the character, personally I would gen up a second character and next session choose to give up your heart, either you get the 'right answer' response and the game progresses or you die and proclaim 'aha expected as much, this is what I am coming in as now' and show him your sheets, game gets going within a few minutes.

Now IF this is only the tip of the iceberg and seeing that you chose as such he continues in this theme it is time for 'The Talk', be sincere and forgiving but also don't skimp the details of WHY you find this pattern distasteful and offer some advice if receptive. If nothing changes, leave.

Never been a fan of the 'just walk' advice, the 'bad DM' just feels vindicated or considers the walker weak or a wet blanket etc more often than not and continues with either those that remain or their next group. Better to give the opportunity to learn, ofc if that opportunity is squandered, fair enough. Run for the hills.

[Yael]

Ok, let me give you some backstory on a PTU adventure I ran once.

One of the players grew as a Hex Maniac (kind of cleric) because of his father's teachings, the scenario was a post-apocalyptic one where the world populace had to hide underground in bunkers to prevent themselves from death. From his backstory, he gave no context on his mother, except that she was dead or left the island, he portrayed his father as a loving-caregiver dad who regardless of other's comments about ghost-types, he would not stop teaching his son about the wonders of the spirit world.

Anyway, in the end, his father dissapeared (thought dead), and the son was sent outside to explore the world. Later in the campaign, he was being given hints about his mother's whereabouts, and so his father's. They all got into a deep plot of a world-twisting scenario, where his confrontation with his mother was inminent. He was happy and sad, because of his good roleplaying skills, but the plot was revealed as follows.

His father was a lunatic, he attempted to gain immortality by taking over his son's body to renew his life, but his mother didn't allow him to, so in the critical moment, she sacrificed her body before he got the ritual ended. In the end, his father's soul was in his mother's body, forcing the PC to realize that, in the end, his loving father figure was a lie all along. His father's plans were still ongoing, trying to seize on the boy's body, doing rituals to Giratina to attain immortality.

What did the PC do? Well, first of all, he congratulated me for such a climatic moment, but he also told me that his character lost motivation, because his whole life, aside from his journey, was a lie. He fought his father, and left the party afterwards.

He wasn't agreeing as the PC, but had fun as the player, so you could try that, maybe? If you actually enjoy the character you built, talk to him Out of Character of how can you try to move your story in kind of the same direction you intended.

If you are very certain that you don't want to run that kind of game, though, just don't play at all. If you don't like where a game is going, because of how it is built, just leave and find another group or swap the DM for next game.

[fishyfishyfishy]

I am very good friends with the DM, but when I brought it up he made the excuse that he wanted my character to deal with a moral dilemma.

If he's truly your friend you can explain to him that this makes you uncomfortable and that this is a boundary you do not want to cross, and he'll take that information and come up with a different moral dilemma for you to deal with.

[Yael]

If he's truly your friend you can explain to him that this makes you uncomfortable and that this is a boundary you do not want to cross, and he'll take that information and come up with a different moral dilemma for you to deal with.

This. Just this.

[Tanuki Tales]

Ask the DM "So how long have you wanted to sex up your Mom? Maybe you should talk it over with her instead of imposing your fantasy on me by proxy through the game."

But do it non-judgmentally. You know, just sort of as an aside in normal conversation.

Without blue text, I can't tell if you're being sarcastic. :smallconfused:

[Honest Tiefling]

Run. Just Run.

There are other better games out there. With less creepy DMs.

There is no salvaging this. I promise you.

Truer words have never been spoken.


It's a poor author/DM that can't create a moral dilemma without using incestual rape. I've played with some BAD first-time DMs but there's no way I'd play in the game you're describing.

Okay, close second.

What you do is tell your friend that you are uncomfortable. He either scraps the whole crazy subplot worthy of a dollar bin hentai, or you leave. A good friend doesn't do this **** to you. If he objects, reconsider your friendship because a real friend doesn't force someone to enact creepy-*** incest stories when they don't want to.

[JNAProductions]

If he's truly your friend you can explain to him that this makes you uncomfortable and that this is a boundary you do not want to cross, and he'll take that information and come up with a different moral dilemma for you to deal with.

Seconding this, entirely. Talk to your buddy, OOC, and explain that this is just not cool.

[PaucaTerrorem]

While I will say this is a pretty f***ed scenario I have to suggest this. Granted I'm okay with the dark, twisted, weird side of things.

Make it a dilemma for your character. Doesn't want to die but doesn't want to bang his mom. Ride it out till that's the final key. Then do the ultimate sacrifice shindig. Make it emotional as all hell. Take acting lessons if need be. Then at the end of it all, explain to the DM that that was messed up. Make them realize that you don't pull that s**t without explaining to people beforehand that things are going to get darker than you can ever imagine.

[Dezea]

Another option you didn't consider :

You go on with the whole incestual rape, at the condition that he go in great length about describing it. He wanted it to happend ? Let him have it. Make it long. Make it last. Make him speak every word, make him describe every scene of it. If possible, go on with some question about how, in character, one should have sex with his mom, or try to get some sex-talk in.

Watch as everyone around the table start going nervous then shocked. Wait for the first reaction of disgust : Trust me, it will happend.

Then, stop it, apologize to everyone for going this far, explaining that you also tought it was wierd, but wanted to play along.

This should be a lifelong lessons about what to NOT do as a DM.
(Also, if he seems to actually enjoy roleplaying it, just run away screaming, and pray for your life)

[bahamut920]

I'm going to disagree with everyone clamoring for you to try and derail the plot or try to prove to the DM how weird and creepy he's being with the plotline. He's your friend, a newbie DM, and being actively disruptive just gets you written off as the "problem player".

I'm going to agree with the suggestions that involve sitting down and having a long, polite talk with your DM about how you feel about the plot and how moral dilemmas for the character don't necessarily need to leave the player's comfort zone. Reiterate that this is a game, and everyone playing is here to have fun. If the activity ceases to be fun, it is no longer a game, and becomes a pointless chore. Consider showing him this thread and the consensus you have here as evidence.

If he still refuses to budge on the issue, then you need to make the choice; either you walk, or you choose to sacrifice the character (hoping desperately that the choice ends up being Abrahamic or that the "goddess" is an impostor) - otherwise, having another ready for play at the time is optional, and entirely dependent upon how much you trust him not to pull an underhanded stunt like this again. Maybe having to wait a real-world hour while you re-roll will teach your newbie DM not to present "kill your character" as the only way out, and immediately going with the option to avoid the weird and creepy plot element he's laying out will teach him something about player comfort zones.

[Peat]

First off, I wish someone had taken a photo of my face when I first read this thread. My expression must have been priceless.

Second, he's your friend. Maybe he won't be after this - we all have moments that make us go "Wait, why did I ever like you", but I think you should proceed on the basis he's your friend now and you'd like him to be your friend after. Someone can be a true friend and still make some crazy big mistakes that affect you negatively. Friendship is not about never making those mistakes; its about putting right what went bad.

Third, the described scenario is fairly categorically bad. There's a reason Exalted has its red rule giving players a complete veto over all sexual things happening to their character no matter what.

Fourth, the bit where he changes your agreed character history is pretty bad too. And the poor storytelling. He clearly has a lot to learn as a DM other than appropriate boundaries.

Fifth - talk to him. Help him. Tell him what he did was not cool in a non-confrontational way and offer him help towards being a better DM. Maybe don't pile all of it on him at once but as others have said, this is a problem to be solved away from the gaming table. Being an arse at the gaming table will teach him nothing, probably lose you a friend, and might lose you something with the other people there too.

p.s. Wow.