BBEG gestalt campaign build suggestions

[Duelpersonality]

I'll be starting a new campaign soon, with a smaller group than I'm used to. Just three players, so I'm running my first gestalt game.

My idea for the plot is that the PCs are uniquely powerful, and no one knows why. Unbeknownst to them, an ancient lich (perhaps the first gestalt character the world had seen, certainly one of only three or four that have ever existed before the PCs) is manipulating fundamental forces to change the nature of sapient life, and they are its newest test subjects. The lich sees itself as a benevolent god, improving the races of the world and granting more innate potential to each individual as an end goal. It has experimented with this in the past, always with disappointing or disastrous results. It knows that the process will be difficult and result in chaos and strife, but it believes that raising the world to a higher potential will eventually result in a utopia. The fact that it sees itself as the rightful ruler of this paradise for all eternity has obviously warped its perspective (the reason it initially sought lichdom was to ensure it could exist long enough to see this happen).

I only have the character concept from one of my playes so far (bard//barbarian, focusing on pre- and post-combat spells and rage-pounce-inspire during combat), so I don't have a good basis for character power yet. I've been thinking about a build for the lich anyway, and I have a few ideas.

Archivist//warlock. Seeking any source of power or knowledge, making deals with and ripping power from extraplanar beings, and generally given to long periods of research.

Favored soul//warlock. Divine power was forced upon it, and so it sought ways to twist it and break it's hold.

Archivist//wizard. Lots of options, lots of power, lots of potential fir that power to be corrupting. I know from an optimization standpoint this may be the strongest choice, but I'm not overly concerned with that.

Sorcerer//dread necromancer. The dread necro feels right, but I'm not sure if I want to utilize the class features for the lichdom or have it attained at level 11 and do something else.

So, does anyone have any suggestions? I would also like feedback on the plot and any ideas you might have there. Thanks.

[Waker]

Generally speaking in Gestalt, you wanna make sure you have classes that have complimentary attributes being paired up. A Rogue//Wizard for example would result in a character with high skill points, two good saves, good bab and full caster levels. Mixing mage classes together tends to produce underwhelming results, since even if they have tons of spells, they are typically no stronger than either class individually. Lastly a good rule of thumb is to mix active and passive classes together. An Archivist//Wizard may have ultimate cosmic power, but they don't have the action economy to use all that power, but a Monk//Wizard could be played as a Wizard who just happens to have all good saves, decent HP and so on.

I could probably make a few suggestions, but I have a few questions. What materials do you have access to and did you have any specific aspects for the character you wanted to emphasize? I see you are toying with the idea of divinity, but was there anything else?

[ExLibrisMortis]

How are you embedding the experimentation mechanically? Are you using grafts (item crafting), epic magic (origin of species), regular magic, unique monster abilities (sarrukh-style), or borderline TO tricks you'd never normally allow (fusion + astral seed)?

One thing that works is the combo of soul crystal, fusion and astral seed. The latter two are eight-level powers, so it's not for low-level campaigns. It allows any creature to permanently fuse with another eligible creature (target must be living, corporeal, willing, and of the same size or smaller). To play up the graft/crafting angle, you can create single-use magic items of the same as a psionic artificer, requiring 13 levels in artificer. It also explains why the lich would be gestalt: they fused with other beings over time. Liches can still fuse by temporarily counting as 'living', so maybe the lich is even looking to go tristalt or quadstalt, by adding more and more unique and powerful beings to their self.

[Bohandas]

How about rogue//warlock?

Another idea would be to do a bard//warlock and make him like a heavy metal guy

[Duelpersonality]

Generally speaking in Gestalt, you wanna make sure you have classes that have complimentary attributes being paired up. A Rogue//Wizard for example would result in a character with high skill points, two good saves, good bab and full caster levels. Mixing mage classes together tends to produce underwhelming results, since even if they have tons of spells, they are typically no stronger than either class individually. Lastly a good rule of thumb is to mix active and passive classes together. An Archivist//Wizard may have ultimate cosmic power, but they don't have the action economy to use all that power, but a Monk//Wizard could be played as a Wizard who just happens to have all good saves, decent HP and so on.

I could probably make a few suggestions, but I have a few questions. What materials do you have access to and did you have any specific aspects for the character you wanted to emphasize? I see you are toying with the idea of divinity, but was there anything else?

The ultimate cosmic power is probably better for my purposes than something with better action economy or passive//active. I know a wizard//factotum would wreck things handily, for example, but may not make for a fun encounter for the players when things get that far (probably starting them at level 3-5).

I have most of the books, but not any issues of Dragon. I think the only books I dont have are some setting specifics (no Ebberon, only a few FR) and races of the dragon. I don't know if I will actualy do divine ranks, it's more a perception of the lich itself. Emphasizing intelligence and patience.


How are you embedding the experimentation mechanically? Are you using grafts (item crafting), epic magic (origin of species), regular magic, unique monster abilities (sarrukh-style), or borderline TO tricks you'd never normally allow (fusion + astral seed)?

One thing that works is the combo of soul crystal, fusion and astral seed. The latter two are eight-level powers, so it's not for low-level campaigns. It allows any creature to permanently fuse with another eligible creature (target must be living, corporeal, willing, and of the same size or smaller). To play up the graft/crafting angle, you can create single-use magic items of the same as a psionic artificer, requiring 13 levels in artificer. It also explains why the lich would be gestalt: they fused with other beings over time. Liches can still fuse by temporarily counting as 'living', so maybe the lich is even looking to go tristalt or quadstalt, by adding more and more unique and powerful beings to their self.

The idea of adding additional beings us interesting, but I'm thinking I would like to have it be an innate thing rather than combining two or more individuals. Mechanically, it's probably going to be independent epic spell research, working towards a spell that is on par with Karsus' avatar (and potentially as devastating).


How about rogue//warlock?

Another idea would be to do a bard//warlock and make him like a heavy metal guy

Rogue//warlock would make for a great recurring minion of the lich, possibly. Lots of diplomacy and bluff, constantly discrediting the PCs and limiting the support they receive.

[Waker]

My suggestion isn't quite ultimate cosmic power, but it would still be strong and have a nice fit thematically. How about Cloistered Cleric//Incarnate? His domains aside from Knowledge could be something like Community or Planning since his big goal is advancing sentient life. As for Incarnate, the class would give him plenty of passive buffs that could give him even higher skills, resistance/immunity to whatever he feels like, plus it would have the added bonus of having a big bad that has access to raw soulstuff. That could explain how it plans on advancing life, by meddling with it before it is born.

[Duelpersonality]

My suggestion isn't quite ultimate cosmic power, but it would still be strong and have a nice fit thematically. How about Cloistered Cleric//Incarnate? His domains aside from Knowledge could be something like Community or Planning since his big goal is advancing sentient life. As for Incarnate, the class would give him plenty of passive buffs that could give him even higher skills, resistance/immunity to whatever he feels like, plus it would have the added bonus of having a big bad that has access to raw soulstuff. That could explain how it plans on advancing life, by meddling with it before it is born.

It's a very interesting idea. I'll have to think about that one. I am not very familiar with MoI material.

[Randomthom]

If you're playing in Pathfinder and allowing 3rd-party, the Aegis//Wizard combo is awesome and still feels quite wizardy despite gaining full BAB.

[Bohandas]

savant//factotum