How much hide could you expect to get from a Dragon Wyrmling?

[PaxZRake]

Hey Guys,

Just curious. My players killed 4 Dragon Wyrmlings and now they're looking to find someone to make them Dragon Scale or Dragon Leather armor. I'm not super sure how much usable hide they would get.

Would Wyrmlings even have the necessary Scale?

[Daishain]

Given their age, I'd be inclined to say their hide doesn't confer physical protection much beyond standard leather. The scales just haven't been given a chance to develop. However, given their size, I think you can get one good set of hide or studded leather armor out of each two, with some scraps left over for other projects.

In the interest of there being some actual benefit to this by comparison to standard leather based armor, I'd grant partial resistance (25% reduction) to the element the wyrmling in question was associated with, with older specimens promising full resistance and maybe other bonuses.

Bear in mind. Your players are now wearing the skins of the babies of a sapient species. Even assuming that the wyrmlings were of a color that tends to fall into the evil category. I'd consider the defilement an evil act, and most NPCs in my world would be quite disturbed at this knowledge at the least. Run it as you wish, but I think having it go without repercussion or comment at all would be quite unrealistic.

[Sigreid]

I would assume for a wormling you would get about as much as you would get off an adult cow, and google that in this situation.

[Gastronomie]

Bear in mind. Your players are now wearing the skins of the babies of a sapient species. Even assuming that the wyrmlings were of a color that tends to fall into the evil category. I'd consider the defilement an evil act, and most NPCs in my world would be quite disturbed at this knowledge at the least. Run it as you wish, but I think having it go without repercussion or comment at all would be quite unrealistic.Of course your world is yours, but at least in my world, no one would be shocked about it.

Human rights is an issue that developed only quite recently. Animal rights is an issue that developed only like... yesterday or something. And like, who in a world where whole kingdoms are destroyed by ancient dragons would ever feel sorry for a killed baby dragon?

Eh, I think your NPCs are too "modern". They're looking from the perspective of a 21-st century guy who's living in a well-developed country without fear of death. That's what you are, I assume, but most D&D NPCs actually live in the dark ages, except filled with malevolent sentient spicies that threaten to destroy villages and cities, a world where fear of death by the hands of another intelligent race is rampant. People don't have the extra space in their hearts to allow in other races and intelligent non-human beings.

But again, this is just my opinion, and your game is your game.

My answer as a DM to the topic creator's question is: I would give them the armor, but not a very strong one. The reason I'm allowing it is because it'll be frustrating for the players if they're told they can't get armor when they're wanting it so badly. The main thing about the DM is to have the players have fun. If they want something and they've earned it, just give them to it. Otherwise, it's not fun for them.

As a DM, I would give this sort of armor:

Wyrmling Whatever Badassness Armor
This armor looks pretty damn badass. It's MADE OUT OF A DRAGON
While wearing this armor, once per short rest, you can cast "Absorb Elements", as long as the scales of this armor include that of a dragon with the corresponding damage type. {Scrubbed}

[BurgerBeast]

Of course your world is yours, but at least in my world, no one would be shocked about it.

This. It should not be the default assumption that wearing dragon-hide armour is evil or frowned upon. It may be true in some worlds, but by no means should it be assumed.

[Regitnui]

{Scrubbed}

I'd vote for anyone who pulled that off.

[comk59]

While we're on the subject, how many Drow children would it take to make badass black leather armor? I'm building an insane paladin of Corellon and this thread gave me a few ideas.

*edit*

Also, while you probably won't have to worry too much about other people caring that you're wearing dragonhide, you will have to worry about other dragons. I have to imagine that wyrmling hide is fairly easy to spot, due to the size and thickness of the scales. If a dragon sees that you killed a bunch of babies and turned them into snazzy suits, they may take issue.

[Sigreid]

While we're on the subject, how many Drow children would it take to make badass black leather armor? I'm building an insane paladin of Corellon and this thread gave me a few ideas.

*edit*

Also, while you probably won't have to worry too much about other people caring that you're wearing dragonhide, you will have to worry about other dragons. I have to imagine that wyrmling hide is fairly easy to spot, due to the size and thickness of the scales. If a dragon sees that you killed a bunch of babies and turned them into snazzy suits, they may take issue.

I think it would take at least 20 children, maybe 20 because you would have to layer it to get the thickness to be effective.

As to your second point, that just means more armor. More seriously though, a metallic dragon would likely not be concerned with your wearing chromatic hide as it will be apparent that you are actively removing their enemies from the world and dragon scale armor will certainly help you do that. They may have a talk with you to verify that you're not collecting a suit of each color.

[BurchardOfEn]

I'd vote for anyone who pulled that off.

Trial by feat of combat is now in full swing. I for one welcome our new warrior kings of ages past.

I agree with the point that people aren't really too likely to assume anything of it outside of there being people who might think that the players have already killed dragons because they don't know what a dragon's scale looks like entirely which could lead to some entertaining situations.

The purely negative results of wearing baby dragon leather is going to come from dragons, their relatives, and their worshipers. Dragonborn probably aren't going to like your party for instance.


how many Drow children would it take to make badass black leather armor? I'm building an insane paladin of Corellon and this thread gave me a few ideas.

This one I think would bother people who aren't from the Underdark since you would be wearing armor made of skin. I don't even want to know how many children your insane paladin would be flaying.


They may have a talk with you to verify that you're not collecting a suit of each color.

Clearly these dragons are problematic and not inclusive enough. :biggrin:

[SilverStud]

So I had players who freaking ALWAYS skin the dragons. I ruled that they had to make a wisdom check to get usable pieces of hide. Decided it was six pieces for a full suit of leather armor. Wyrmling hide is normal leather with advantage on the scary aura saves against that color. Young hide is studded leather with that and resistance to that elemental damage. Adult hide is scale mail with all that and advantage on breath weapon saves vs. that color. Ancient hide is normal plate with all previous, but becomes +3 plate when near a dragon.

[Sigreid]

This one I think would bother people who aren't from the Underdark since you would be wearing armor made of skin. I don't even want to know how many children your insane paladin would be flaying.


Well, to be technical about it all leather armor is made out of skin. :smalltongue:

[lordhack]

Of course your world is yours, but at least in my world, no one would be shocked about it.

Human rights is an issue that developed only quite recently. Animal rights is an issue that developed only like... yesterday or something. And like, who in a world where whole kingdoms are destroyed by ancient dragons would ever feel sorry for a killed baby dragon?

Eh, I think your NPCs are too "modern". They're looking from the perspective of a 21-st century guy who's living in a well-developed country without fear of death. That's what you are, I assume, but most D&D NPCs actually live in the dark ages, except filled with malevolent sentient spicies that threaten to destroy villages and cities, a world where fear of death by the hands of another intelligent race is rampant. People don't have the extra space in their hearts to allow in other races and intelligent non-human beings.

But again, this is just my opinion, and your game is your game.

My answer as a DM to the topic creator's question is: I would give them the armor, but not a very strong one. The reason I'm allowing it is because it'll be frustrating for the players if they're told they can't get armor when they're wanting it so badly. The main thing about the DM is to have the players have fun. If they want something and they've earned it, just give them to it. Otherwise, it's not fun for them.

As a DM, I would give this sort of armor:

Wyrmling Whatever Badassness Armor
This armor looks pretty damn badass. It's MADE OUT OF A DRAGON
While wearing this armor, once per short rest, you can cast "Absorb Elements", as long as the scales of this armor include that of a dragon with the corresponding damage type. For instance, if you used the scales of a Red, White, and Blue Dragon Wyrmling to wear this really Americanized suit of armor and show off to the world that you're a better president candidate than Hillary or Trump, you can use Absorb Elements once per short rest on a Fire, Cold, or Lightning-type damage attack.

Sure, human rights are pretty recent, and making armor from the hides of dragons is classic, but to play devils advocate, skinning a human and wearing its skin as a cloak has always been pretty creepy and taboo. Certainly in most D&D worlds killing an Elf or Dwarf and wearing its skin would be considered pretty Evil. Dragons are sapient, its not too hard to imagine a world where the same morals apply to them. Of course, Dragons don't look 'human' like the other races do, and the skin of the other races isn't going to help you win a war, morals tend to go out the window pretty quickly when something like that is on the line.

[BurgerBeast]

Sure, human rights are pretty recent, and making armor from the hides of dragons is classic, but to play devils advocate, skinning a human and wearing its skin as a cloak has always been pretty creepy and taboo.

And yet as recently as 100 years ago (and even today in particular places) you will find humans who consider other humans to be non-humans. Don't underestimate the ability to people to view other species (and even members of their own species) as inferior.

The American government used to pay for the scalps of human beings. We can talk about degrees of morbidity but for me it's enough to recognize that humans are capable of justifying disgusting things to themselves.


Certainly in most D&D worlds killing an Elf or Dwarf and wearing its skin would be considered pretty Evil.

Yep, and this is a reasonable assumption, too. The "demo-humans" "demi-humans" are considered near enough to human to deserve the same respect as humans.


Dragons are sapient, its not too hard to imagine a world where the same morals apply to them.

Agreed. It's just not the standard of D&D or the fantasy genre.


Of course, Dragons don't look 'human' like the other races do, and the skin of the other races isn't going to help you win a war, morals tend to go out the window pretty quickly when something like that is on the line.

Yeah, this.

[Mellack]

I think most people would not recognize what your leather is made from. Are your townsfolk really going to be able to tell if that is from a dragon, a drake, or a giant snake? You might get some questions about your fancy armor and what it is, but probably not much. This is even more true is you have your drow/dwarf/ect leather. There is a fashion designer right now making items from (cloned) human leather. It looks like any other leather. Untill somebody told me I would not be able to tell it from cow or goat. So unless you are leaving the faces attached, I doubt anyone would even know your black leather is made from dozens of drow children.

[BurchardOfEn]

Well, to be technical about it all leather armor is made out of skin. :smalltongue:

Humanoid skin would look kinda distinct, I would usually tend to think.

[Sigreid]

Humanoid skin would look kinda distinct, I would usually tend to think.

By the time it's been cut, tanned, shaped and layered, I doubt it.

Edit: Of course I will be very pleased to never be in a position to verify that.

[Kurt Kurageous]

So unless you are leaving the faces attached...

For pscychokiller paladin; inspiration granted. Leave the drow children faces attached. Its easier that yelling, "I'm a psychokiller!" every few moments you are in Lawful-ish Good-ish society.

I like the upgrade of armor by age idea.

As a guy who built armor, I can tell you that articulation (the joints) can be very tricky, and it might work best to slip on an appropriate corresponding joint from a dragon.

That said, a wyrmling probably doesn't have the right sizes for knees and elbow joints.
A young dragon's forearms might work as knees, but its hind leg joints would be too big. Might be able to make elbows out of wrists or large claw joints.
An adult probably means the wrists and foreclaws are needed for joints.
I don't know how one would be able to use the joints of an ancient at all unless the character was large or a huge NPC.

Would curing and impregnating the hide with wax denature it? Can you even heat/cure white dragon hide? Or red?

[Gastronomie]

Can you even heat/cure white dragon hide? Or red?This is a pretty interesting idea.

The armor made out of Red Dragon scales might constantly be warm. ...Which makes it not a good idea to wear it all day in the middle of summer.

While wearing armor made out of Blue Dragon scales, you might constantly get static electricity whenever you touch something.

Green Dragon armor... I dunno. THINK FOR YOURSELF

If you put certain stuff near Black Dragon armor, it might slowly melt away. Food might get spoiled and taste sour. If you're wearing pretty clothes under the armor, be careful - it might get damaged badly.

White Dragon armor will be always a bit cold. Good to wear in the summer, not so in the winter.

And stuff like that.

[Daishain]

snip
Dragons aren't animals, and never have been animals in default D&D worlds. My NPCs tend to consider this sort of thing deplorable for much the same reason they're squicked out by the necromancer who used human skin as parchment for his spellbook. If it can think and speak, it deserves at least the minimal amount of respect afforded one's deadly enemies. That minimum respect may not amount to much, but it tends to include not screwing around with the dead.

Furthermore, there's a practical purpose to drawing a line between sapients and non in such cases. You do not piss off a mother that was already tempted to murder everyone you've ever known and is fully capable of ending a nation in response to such an offense.

[Regitnui]

Furthermore, there's a practical purpose to drawing a line between sapients and non in such cases. You do not piss off a mother that was already tempted to murder everyone you've ever known and is fully capable of ending a nation in response to such an offense.

Something Vaarsuvius learned to his/her cost. That whole arc is also a masterclass on enforcing realistic consequences on your PCs.

[PaxZRake]

Thanks a ton guys!

Now I'll have to figure out cost, but I'm pretty sure I can get that from the DMG somewhere.

To further explain, the Wyrmlings in question are Brass Dragons that had been corrupted by the Shadowfell through magical plot powers. The party did try to negotiate first, but they didn't quite make it through to the Dragons.

Should be interesting, and I've been able to take a few interesting ideas for the plot from here for further on.

[Sigreid]

Thanks a ton guys!

Now I'll have to figure out cost, but I'm pretty sure I can get that from the DMG somewhere.

To further explain, the Wyrmlings in question are Brass Dragons that had been corrupted by the Shadowfell through magical plot powers. The party did try to negotiate first, but they didn't quite make it through to the Dragons.

Should be interesting, and I've been able to take a few interesting ideas for the plot from here for further on.

This actually changes some things. Wearing the hide of assumed to be good dragons, like brass dragons can easily be interpreted as a sign of evil in a way that wearing the hide of a red dragon wouldn't be.

[PaxZRake]

This actually changes some things. Wearing the hide of assumed to be good dragons, like brass dragons can easily be interpreted as a sign of evil in a way that wearing the hide of a red dragon wouldn't be.

Yea, I agree, I think the Dragon community at large would agree.

The party argues that since they effectively mercy killed them they're now going to wear them as a sign of respect and to allow the dragons to get some measure of vengeance for what happened to them.

So, it should be interesting from an encounter perspective if they choose to run with it.

[RickAllison]

Yea, I agree, I think the Dragon community at large would agree.

The party argues that since they effectively mercy killed them they're now going to wear them as a sign of respect and to allow the dragons to get some measure of vengeance for what happened to them.

So, it should be interesting from an encounter perspective if they choose to run with it.

On the other hand, maybe they can get some street cred from chromatic dragons!

[Tanarii]

What makes you think Wyrmlings have "hide"? It wouldn't provide a Wyrmling a +6 to +7 AC bonus for Natural Armor if that was the case.

But assuming it's not thoroughly destroyed by the battle, and given a 5e Wyrmling is a medium sized creature that gets a +6 or +7 Natural Armor bonus from it's skin, I'd allow adventurers to chop off sufficient scales to allow someone using Smith's Tools to make mechanical Chainmail or Splintmail from it (ie AC 16 or 17, disadv to Stealth, weight per table).

[Plaguescarred]

Because a group doesn't encounter a dragon every other level, i<d make sure they have at least enought hide to make 1 dragon armor for sure.

[Tanarii]

Because a group doesn't encounter a dragon every other level, i<d make sure they have at least enought hide to make 1 dragon armor for sure.
They don't? Next you'll be telling me the PCs don't go into Dungeons either.

[Plaguescarred]

They don't? Next you'll be telling me the PCs don't go into Dungeons either.My PCs usually go into dungeons more often than they meet dragons actually, but hey everyone's game can be different!

[Tanarii]

My PCs usually go into dungeons more often than they meet dragons actually, but hey everyone's game can be different!
For sure. That's why I used Blue text / sarcasm. :smallwink:

[Plaguescarred]

Its all C:smile::smile:L

[Easy_Lee]

I say a creature's hide can provide adequate clothing or armor for one other creature that size, or two creatures of the next smaller size. Hence, two small hides could make one medium clothing, and one large hide could make two medium clothing.

[R.Shackleford]

Hey Guys,

Just curious. My players killed 4 Dragon Wyrmlings and now they're looking to find someone to make them Dragon Scale or Dragon Leather armor. I'm not super sure how much usable hide they would get.

Would Wyrmlings even have the necessary Scale?

Soon you would probably get enough for at least 2 adult dragons. Or they would get you...

Edit

I'm sorry, that is assuming they were all siblings.

It can be anywhere between 1 and 8 adult or older dragons.

Rule of thumb, don't kill wyrmlings. See V as to why.

Edit

This is also rude, aunties, uncles, and grandparent dragons may also have a bone to pick with your group.

[RickAllison]

My PCs usually go into dungeons more often than they meet dragons actually, but hey everyone's game can be different!

In our D&D campaign, our last few areas have been:

A necromancer's castle. Standard fare. Filled with undead, a necromancer, a mummy lord hidden in a sealed tomb (that the other players just HAD to open... only avoided a TPK because my rogue was pilfering all the other lesser sarcophagi), and a pair of dragons with their wyrmlings.

A town where we performed a song-and-dance routine to thank them for their hospitality. None of us had Performance, so it went rather well considering.

A city where my PC ended up getting onto the wanted list for kicking open the door to the sage we needed to talk to. Then ended up persuading the king's steward to help while pretending I was not associated with the party...

A ship where we fought a weakened kraken in and out of the water.

Essentially Isla Sorna, but caused by massive fluxes in planar energy that caused portals to the various elemental planes to activate at random intervals.

And then a gauntlet of challenges based off the 7 Deadly Sins.

Then we jumped back in time and played Farmville: Magic Edition until the werewolves showed up.

So we got two dungeons on the list!

[comk59]

Thanks a ton guys!

Now I'll have to figure out cost, but I'm pretty sure I can get that from the DMG somewhere.

To further explain, the Wyrmlings in question are Brass Dragons that had been corrupted by the Shadowfell through magical plot powers. The party did try to negotiate first, but they didn't quite make it through to the Dragons.

Should be interesting, and I've been able to take a few interesting ideas for the plot from here for further on.

Wow, actually? Your players are basically asking for hell by wearing Metallic Dragon hide.

That being said, if they reaaally want to justify it, let them! Eventually the consequences will catch up to them.

[Reaper34]

I don't see this ending well. any good dragons (especially mom and dad) are likely to "shoot" first and ask questions later. same with good aligned npc's.... at least they do in my games. the armor would also draw a lot of the wrong kind of attention. necros, bandits, cutthroats, and other ner-do-wells looking for minions or contacts.

as for the armor. leather of studded leather with elemental resistance 1-5 for fire in this case.

[PaxZRake]

Wow, actually? Your players are basically asking for hell by wearing Metallic Dragon hide.

That being said, if they reaaally want to justify it, let them! Eventually the consequences will catch up to them.

That's the exciting part for me!


I don't see this ending well. any good dragons (especially mom and dad) are likely to "shoot" first and ask questions later. same with good aligned npc's.... at least they do in my games. the armor would also draw a lot of the wrong kind of attention. necros, bandits, cutthroats, and other ner-do-wells looking for minions or contacts.

as for the armor. leather of studded leather with elemental resistance 1-5 for fire in this case.

I could see Gold or Copper Dragons asking questions first... and any Evil Dragons maybe swooping down to give them a high five.

Most NPC's in my world won't care too much, but there are certainly some who might.

I like the idea of the party attracting bad guys seeking them as allies though. They're all Good or Good leaning Neutral, so should be fun.

[R.Shackleford]

That's the exciting part for me!



I could see Gold or Copper Dragons asking questions first... and any Evil Dragons maybe swooping down to give them a high five.

Most NPC's in my world won't care too much, but there are certainly some who might.

I like the idea of the party attracting bad guys seeking them as allies though. They're all Good or Good leaning Neutral, so should be fun.

Even the Pope said he would punch someone for hurting his mom, I don't see why a good dragon wouldn't get a bit of blood lust if their children were dead and some people were wearing new dragon skin.

Plus I'm sure the skin may still smell like the children or have birthmarks...

[comk59]

Even the Pope said he would punch someone for hurting his mom, I don't see why a good dragon wouldn't get a bit of blood lust if their children were dead and some people were wearing new dragon skin.

Plus I'm sure the skin may still smell like the children or have birthmarks...

Also... what did the PCs do with the bodies? Did they just leave the skinned and mutilated corpses for the parents to find?

[Easy_Lee]

Even the Pope said he would punch someone for hurting his mom, I don't see why a good dragon wouldn't get a bit of blood lust if their children were dead and some people were wearing new dragon skin.

Plus I'm sure the skin may still smell like the children or have birthmarks...

To be fair, you should be able to mask which dragon the skin came from if it's properly treated and cured. I mean, we have books and such bound in human skin, and we can tell it's human. But only modern science can tell you which human.

[R.Shackleford]

To be fair, you should be able to mask which dragon the skin came from if it's properly treated and cured. I mean, we have books and such bound in human skin, and we can tell it's human. But only modern science can tell you which human.

I don't think a dragon, any color, is going to care which dragon the hide came from.

If a dude walked by you wearing human skin, would you not freak out? If one was walking around with a weapon would you not just think "dude needs to die".

If two baby/teenager dragons were found/reported dead I don't think anyone wearing dragon Armor would be safe.

Plus these are sentient beings, not sure how "good" it is to be wearing baby/teenager skin.

[RickAllison]

That's the exciting part for me!



I could see Gold or Copper Dragons asking questions first... and any Evil Dragons maybe swooping down to give them a high five.

Most NPC's in my world won't care too much, but there are certainly some who might.

I like the idea of the party attracting bad guys seeking them as allies though. They're all Good or Good leaning Neutral, so should be fun.

"Okay, alright guys. All you gotta do is show Blackwing the Flame-Scorched that you guys are cool, then you're in! It's gonna be so awesome!" Says the overexcited young green dragon.


I don't think a dragon, any color, is going to care which dragon the hide came from.

If a dude walked by you wearing human skin, would you not freak out? If one was walking around with a weapon would you not just think "dude needs to die".

If two baby/teenager dragons were found/reported dead I don't think anyone wearing dragon Armor would be safe.

Plus these are sentient beings, not sure how "good" it is to be wearing baby/teenager skin.

But it would be so soft!

[R.Shackleford]

"Okay, alright guys. All you gotta do is show Blackwing the Flame-Scorched that you guys are cool, then you're in! It's gonna be so awesome!" Says the overexcited young green dragon.



But it would be so soft!

It would be, but do note that even some of the most evil screwed up people still don't hurt kids (at least directly). Those evil dragons would be an issue if they heard baby dragons were being killed for sport and clothing.

Tiamat and Bahamut would do a fusion dance and become Ao.

[RickAllison]

It would be, but do note that even some of the most evil screwed up people still don't hurt kids (at least directly). Those evil dragons would be an issue if they heard baby dragons were being killed for sport and clothing.

Tiamat and Bahamut would do a fusion dance and become Ao.

Note to self: Obtain the hides of all ten chromatic and metallic wyrmlings, then taunt both Bahamut and Tiamat with the ten-colored outfit. Have Nondetection and Contingency+teleport or whatever and then Demiplane that is warded against scrying along with a second hidden Demiplane whose memory has been erased. Watch the fusion, have the Contingency set for when you are attacked by the dragon gods. Live in fear as you write your findings.

[Bubzors]

Again guess it depends on the campaign setting, but in mine it wouldn't be that big of a deal. Normal people wouldn't attack on sight, but would probably be more impressed. Not everyday you see someone wandering around in Dragon armor. Better not mess with those guys.

Now if they were wyrmlings and you left the parents alive, yea you better worry about mommy's justice. But beyond that I don't see much of the dragon community getting too angry. Their lore always make them seem loner creatures who leave behind parents and family shortly after being able to take care of themselvrs. Only coming together in strange circumstances.

This is also why I don't play with hard automatic alignments for monsters/creatures. Just because you are a red Dragon doesn't mean you are evil. Maybe you are just quick to anger or more direct in your dealings with others. That copper Dragon is more known for its destructive pranks then it's good humor. Better laugh at his jokes or you might become the butt of the next prank, and might not survive.

[smcmike]

I don't think a dragon, any color, is going to care which dragon the hide came from.

If a dude walked by you wearing human skin, would you not freak out? If one was walking around with a weapon would you not just think "dude needs to die".

If two baby/teenager dragons were found/reported dead I don't think anyone wearing dragon Armor would be safe.

Plus these are sentient beings, not sure how "good" it is to be wearing baby/teenager skin.


Also... what did the PCs do with the bodies? Did they just leave the skinned and mutilated corpses for the parents to find?

These posts indicate a default assumption that dragon society is basically like modern human society, or perhaps that dragon parentage is similar to a mother bear and her cubs. This doesn't seem justified.

The evil dragons, especially, are nothing like people or bears. There is no mention in the text of family feeling, and plenty of references to hating and fearing other dragons. If a black dragon met one of his wyrmlings, my guess is that he would eat it. If he met someone wearing that wyrmling's skin, he'd probably eat him too, but he'd probably eat him regardless.

The good dragons are different, though only the silver dragons are explicitly described as enjoying the company of other dragons.

This isn't to say that it's a bad idea to think about the consequences of wearing dragon hide. It could be a fun path to conflict. I just wouldn't reflexively smack the party down for doing so.

As far as NPCs go, I would imagine that most people would be impressed and intimidated by dragon hide armor, but perhaps also horrified since it's from a good dragon.

[R.Shackleford]

These posts indicate a default assumption that dragon society is basically like modern human society, or perhaps that dragon parentage is similar to a mother bear and her cubs. This doesn't seem justified.

The evil dragons, especially, are nothing like people or bears. There is no mention in the text of family feeling, and plenty of references to hating and fearing other dragons. If a black dragon met one of his wyrmlings, my guess is that he would eat it. If he met someone wearing that wyrmling's skin, he'd probably eat him too, but he'd probably eat him regardless.

The good dragons are different, though only the silver dragons are explicitly described as enjoying the company of other dragons.

This isn't to say that it's a bad idea to think about the consequences of wearing dragon hide. It could be a fun path to conflict. I just wouldn't reflexively smack the party down for doing so.

As far as NPCs go, I would imagine that most people would be impressed and intimidated by dragon hide armor, but perhaps also horrified since it's from a good dragon.

No. They assume that dragons aren't just bags of HP and have sentience due to their mental ability scores and fluff.

You should read OotS.

[Tanarii]

No. They assume that dragons aren't just bags of HP and have sentience due to their mental ability scores and fluff. and that they are humans with big wings and scaly armor.

smcmike nailed it. You're doing the same thing Angry DM rants about people doing with Elves, Dwarves, Halflings in http://theangrygm.com/angry-rants-stop-playing-against-stereotypes/

Even an Elf or a Dwarf is sufficiently alien in mind-set to not just be hairless pointy eared humans or stocky bearded humans. And D&D Dragons (across editions) have a rich and detailed history of not being like humans, or even other animals, in many ways. Including their approach to how they view their young.

Of course, 5e has it's own dragon lore, and it's kinda thin on the ground so far. ;)

[smcmike]

No. They assume that dragons aren't just bags of HP and have sentience due to their mental ability scores and fluff.

Sentience can come in many forms.

In terms of the chromatic dragons, they are more-or-less explicitly solitary creatures. The most extreme example is the whites, which only meet each other to procreate, and then immediately "flee" into isolation. They are not loving parents. Most of the metallic dragons also include some language hinting at solitary natures, though not nearly so extreme.

They are not like us, and do not live in our world. They would likely have some reaction to seeing dragon-hide armor, but is likely to be completely different from your reaction if you walk into a bar and see someone wearing human-skin clothing.

[R.Shackleford]

and that they are humans with big wings and scaly armor.

smcmike nailed it. You're doing the same thing Angry DM rants about people doing with Elves, Dwarves, Halflings in http://theangrygm.com/angry-rants-stop-playing-against-stereotypes/

Even an Elf or a Dwarf is sufficiently alien in mind-set to not just be hairless pointy eared humans or stocky bearded humans. And D&D Dragons (across editions) have a rich and detailed history of not being like humans, or even other animals, in many ways. Including their approach to how they view their young.

Of course, 5e has it's own dragon lore, and it's kinda thin on the ground so far. ;)

Dragon and Humans are pretty much the same species but went down different physical lines. I understand for other things but for dragons...

I mean...

Greedy and MATES. WITH. EVERYTHING.

Seems like a simular mind set at least ;)

[Tanarii]

Greedy and MATES. WITH. EVERYTHING.

Seems like a simular mind set at least ;)hahahaha sure sure but also doesn't always stick around after to make sure the baby-mama & sprog is looked after proper am I right? :smallwink:

[Daishain]

hahahaha sure sure but also doesn't always stick around after to make sure the baby-mama & sprog is looked after proper am I right? :smallwink:
Truth, but with every higher order mammal we know of, humans included, the default expected behavior is that the mother is inclined to care for the children at least until they reach a certain age.

and before someone brings it up. D&D Dragons aren't reptiles. They're not cold blooded creatures, and their basic physiology and movement are far closer to felines than anything else we can draw comparisons to. Besides, several reptile species also are known for child rearing.

Assuming that a draconic mother is inclined to care about what happens to their children is indeed a matter of importing what we are familiar with. But it is a no more egregious offense in that regard than assuming that the sky over Faerun is blue. It might not be, but we have plenty of reason to assume that it is, and no reason to assume otherwise.

Now, if someone went and assumed that dragons formed family units analogous to the ones we're used to, (especially the Mom+Dad&2.4 children setup) that would indeed be way off the mark. But that isn't quite the case here.

[MBControl]

Being that it is wyrmling hide/sacle, I would limit it to a accessories such as helms, gloves, boots, hats, and light armor.

Depending on the item created you might give a small bonus, most likely resistance to fire damage.

As far as the quantity itself, it would depend on how much they can successfully harvest. For a light armour 15-20 Scales worth. gloves may require 4-6.

[Sigreid]

Also... what did the PCs do with the bodies? Did they just leave the skinned and mutilated corpses for the parents to find?

Last time my group killed a dragon we spent a good bit of time preparing jerky...

[RickAllison]

Last time my group killed a dragon we spent a good bit of time preparing jerky...

Lat time my group did it, we were taking a hasty retreat because there were more wyrmlings and two very large dragons nearby...

[Sigreid]

They are not like us, and do not live in our world. They would likely have some reaction to seeing dragon-hide armor, but is likely to be completely different from your reaction if you walk into a bar and see someone wearing human-skin clothing.

If I walk into a bar and see someone I'm certain is wearing human skin clothing I would most likely decide I'm in the wrong bar and leave immediately and spend the rest of the night trying to convince myself I was mistaken.

[Mellack]

Can you really tell different animals that well when they are changed into leather? I certainly can't tell cow from pig or goat leather in a pair of gloves. How would you tell dragon from drake or giant snake?

[Reaper34]

Truth, but with every higher order mammal we know of, humans included, the default expected behavior is that the mother is inclined to care for the children at least until they reach a certain age.

and before someone brings it up. D&D Dragons aren't reptiles. They're not cold blooded creatures, and their basic physiology and movement are far closer to felines than anything else we can draw comparisons to. Besides, several reptile species also are known for child rearing.

Assuming that a draconic mother is inclined to care about what happens to their children is indeed a matter of importing what we are familiar with. But it is a no more egregious offense in that regard than assuming that the sky over Faerun is blue. It might not be, but we have plenty of reason to assume that it is, and no reason to assume otherwise.

Now, if someone went and assumed that dragons formed family units analogous to the ones we're used to, (especially the Mom+Dad&2.4 children setup) that would indeed be way off the mark. But that isn't quite the case here.

not the same edition but......... the cover of the dragonomacon from 3.x had a red mom and dad taking care of atleast 2 different clutches of young (one clutch hatching and another obviously older). while the family unit might not be common, it does happen among even evil dragons. I would think it would be more common among metallic dragons.

[R.Shackleford]

Can you really tell different animals that well when they are changed into leather? I certainly can't tell cow from pig or goat leather in a pair of gloves. How would you tell dragon from drake or giant snake?

I don't think it would matter. Dragon hide is a specific type of Armor tho.

Mommy is missing her child and you are wearing dragonhide armor? Nice knowing you.

[Gastronomie]

I suppose it depends on the campaign and DM whether dragons will come to seek out vengeance. I have this image that being so narcissist, most dragons wouldn't care about the lives of other dragons (especially if they're of different color - and even if they were the same color, I find it doubtful).

If I were the DM, I might have a dragon attack the PCs for wearing dragonhide, but it wouldn't be for retribution - rather it would be to reclaim their "pride".

"If these mortals walk around wearing dragonhide armor, it'll seem like we dragons are weak and can be easily slain! My massive ego cannot allow that! EVER!!"