Modified Tiefling balanced?

[Elminster298]

A simple design that I would like some feedback on. It's a Far Realm based Tiefling for a plot device. The stats are as follows:

Ability score increase- same
Age- change to same as dwarf
Alignment- same
Size- same
Speed- same
Darkvision- same
Hellish resistance- changed to "Resistance of the Void" resistance to acid damage
Infernal Legacy- changed to "Aberrant Legacy" prestidigitation cantrip, 3rd level grease spell, 5th level darkness spell
Languages- changed to common and deep speech

My intention was to keep it as close to the same power level while have as much of the feel I was going for. Thoughts?

[Specter]

I would trade Grease for Dissonant Whispers or Tasha's, based on the Warlock selection for Great Old One. Makes more sense and is cooler.

If you're going to give them acid resistance, it should be as prominent as fire, or else it will be lackluster.

[Elminster298]

The acid resistance is a direct trade for fire resistance. I know fire damage is the most common in the game so acid resistance is less powerful but it seemed more appropriate.

I chose grease for the "slime" feel. I considered dissonant whispers and tasha's and they have the proper feel but I didn't want to step on the great old one warlock's toes. Grease seemed like the best thematic alternative.

[NecroDancer]

I would change acid resistance to psychic resistance.

[Joe the Rat]

The acid resistance is a direct trade for fire resistance. I know fire damage is the most common in the game so acid resistance is less powerful but it seemed more appropriate.

I chose grease for the "slime" feel. I considered dissonant whispers and tasha's and they have the proper feel but I didn't want to step on the great old one warlock's toes. Grease seemed like the best thematic alternative.
Tieflings get Hellish Rebuke, which is already Warlock-foot-trodding. whispers and laughter are also Bard tricks, so it's not an exclusively GOO trick.

[Elminster298]

I would change acid resistance to psychic resistance.

This was the first I considered but is FAR less powerful though thematically just as appropriate. The character is straight class great old one tomblock so I was trying to keep it balanced without Ability overlap while sticking to the theme... The character is super non-physical "keep as much distance" so I wasn't worried about a small power drop but I think psychic would be giving up too much.

[Elminster298]

Tieflings get Hellish Rebuke, which is already Warlock-foot-trodding. whispers and laughter are also Bard tricks, so it's not an exclusively GOO trick.

I agree and I do think dissonant fits the best. I Just thought grease would be most interesting since it's a decent utility spell that doesn't get much love.... Hmm.

[Herobizkit]

I like Acid resistance and Grease for the same reasons you put forward, Elminster298.

Prestidigitation is a lot more useful than Thaumaturgy, but not game-breaking. For 'cosmic horror', I wonder if Thaumaturgy is more appropriate, though...?

S'all I got. :)

[AmayaElls]

Don't be afraid to give Acid and Psychic... if you look at the Aasimar in the DMG (who are based off tiefling) they described how fire was the strongest resistance so replacing it with two is balanced (Aasimar get radiant and necrotic).

I also don't think crossover with warlock abilities is too bad. It gives you one extra casting when you really need it or you can not take that option because you already have it and have a little extra versatility.

[brainface]

Seconding acid + psychic. Whenever you have an environmental hazard, and whenever wizard casts "some generic wizard spell", it's going to tend to be fire. Psychic and Acid damage may literally never come up throughout the entire campaign. Heck, fire resistance basically reads "Go ahead and fireball whatever's in melee with me, party wizard, it will hurt them more than me." ^^

If you use grease, I'd consider replacing darkness with something else--they kind of both do the same thing in that they make an area suck in some way. Alter self? Crown of Madness? Dissonant whispers at a higher spell slot level?

[MrFahrenheit]

A simple design that I would like some feedback on. It's a Far Realm based Tiefling for a plot device. The stats are as follows:

Ability score increase- same
Age- change to same as dwarf
Alignment- same
Size- same
Speed- same
Darkvision- same
Hellish resistance- changed to "Resistance of the Void" resistance to acid damage
Infernal Legacy- changed to "Aberrant Legacy" prestidigitation cantrip, 3rd level grease spell, 5th level darkness spell
Languages- changed to common and deep speech

My intention was to keep it as close to the same power level while have as much of the feel I was going for. Thoughts?

You may want to consider an entirely new race if you're throwing an aberrant-descended PC option into the mix, while taking a lot of base tiefling mechanics if it suits you (and maybe lose cha for wis or con). Tieflings are linked to fiends like aasimars are linked to celestials, and elves to fey.

[Elminster298]

I like Acid resistance and Grease for the same reasons you put forward, Elminster298.

Prestidigitation is a lot more useful than Thaumaturgy, but not game-breaking. For 'cosmic horror', I wonder if Thaumaturgy is more appropriate, though...?

S'all I got. :)

Thank you! 😀

The choice of cantrip was a toss up for me. I think they both are entirely fitting for the idea and I mostly just changed it to push it a little farther than the regular tiefling. A very good point though...

[Elminster298]

Don't be afraid to give Acid and Psychic... if you look at the Aasimar in the DMG (who are based off tiefling) they described how fire was the strongest resistance so replacing it with two is balanced (Aasimar get radiant and necrotic).

I also don't think crossover with warlock abilities is too bad. It gives you one extra casting when you really need it or you can not take that option because you already have it and have a little extra versatility.

All very valid points. I had not even considered a second resistance in regards to the aasimar. Since the character will be going great old one it can't be considered too powerful since he will gain pychic resistance at 10th level anyway. Thank you!

[Elminster298]

Seconding acid + psychic. Whenever you have an environmental hazard, and whenever wizard casts "some generic wizard spell", it's going to tend to be fire. Psychic and Acid damage may literally never come up throughout the entire campaign. Heck, fire resistance basically reads "Go ahead and fireball whatever's in melee with me, party wizard, it will hurt them more than me." ^^

If you use grease, I'd consider replacing darkness with something else--they kind of both do the same thing in that they make an area suck in some way. Alter self? Crown of Madness? Dissonant whispers at a higher spell slot level?

I hadn't considered alter self but that is absolutely a better fit than darkness! That will definitely be a change I make. Thank you!

[Elminster298]

You may want to consider an entirely new race if you're throwing an aberrant-descended PC option into the mix, while taking a lot of base tiefling mechanics if it suits you (and maybe lose cha for wis or con). Tieflings are linked to fiends like aasimars are linked to celestials, and elves to fey.

A "new race" was very much my intention. I called it "modified tiefling" simply because that is the base race I am using. It will even have the similar physical differentiations to the Tiefling and Aasimar: random growths(rock, crystal, fungal), odd eye placement( multiple eyes, eye stalks), tentacles(tail, shoulders, face i.e Davey Jones), skin color/texture(most any color including translucent, pebbly, slimy, scaly, spongey).

[MrFahrenheit]

A "new race" was very much my intention. I called it "modified tiefling" simply because that is the base race I am using. It will even have the similar physical differentiations to the Tiefling and Aasimar: random growths(rock, crystal, fungal), odd eye placement( multiple eyes, eye stalks), tentacles(tail, shoulders, face i.e Davey Jones), skin color/texture(most any color including translucent, pebbly, slimy, scaly, spongey).

Oh cool. I'd caution against making them too different as far as their facial features are concerned; note the tiefling can still cover up most of its key different physical features when in less accepting locales.

[Elminster298]

Oh cool. I'd caution against making them too different as far as their facial features are concerned; note the tiefling can still cover up most of its key different physical features when in less accepting locales.

Excellent point. I will leave the choice of features to the player so they can decide for themselves how normal or grotesque they wish to be.

[AmayaElls]

Excellent point. I will leave the choice of features to the player so they can decide for themselves how normal or grotesque they wish to be.

I agree with that, some players will not want their features to be hideable. I played a tiefling with horns that were 1ft tall and an odd skin and hair colour because I like playing up the inability to fit in, but other players will want to seem more human and hideable.

[Reaper34]

little confused. this a pc or dm's bad guy/npc?

[Elminster298]

little confused. this a pc or dm's bad guy/npc?

PC. If it were DM bad guy it would be much easier/less important for me to balance it so carefully.

[Joe the Rat]

Grease is certainly different, and that's not a bad thing. Acid + Psychic would make a fun combo. Actually, this is getting a major ooze-affinity...

If you have SCAG, they have a mini list of variant physical traits for Tieflings. Might be a good start point. But you should probably add things like tri-lobed iris and head tentacles as options.

[Reaper34]

just a thought but..... the tieflings are generally either hellish or demonic. this makes their differences fairley consistant depending on their heratage. the far plane has a wide varity of different creatures, and one quality of it is fairly chaotic. why not offer a selection of spells/resistances for each slot. it would be a bit harder to balance but would simulate that every creature was unique and affected by the far plane. some might be just re-skinned tieflings while others could be slimy slugmen.just a thought.