Are necromancers (if played properly) the ultimate "party" PC?

[MrFahrenheit]

So one of my players is bringing in a necromancer to our 14th level party. Given all the undead he can bring to the fight, what's stopping him from potentially directing them all to provide Help to the rest of the party (assuming enough enemies and available open battle mat space)? Or with bounded accuracy, even at higher levels, is this a wasted use of his undead legions (i.e., should he make them all attack too)?

[R.Shackleford]

So one of my players is bringing in a necromancer to our 14th level party. Given all the undead he can bring to the fight, what's stopping him from potentially directing them all to provide Help to the rest of the party (assuming enough enemies and available open battle mat space)? Or with bounded accuracy, even at higher levels, is this a wasted use of his undead legions (i.e., should he make them all attack too)?

Nothing. If you are allowing a necromancer you are allowing this.

You know the issues with necromancer so either tell them to cool it or make a different character.

[Yuki Akuma]

The only thing stopping it is the other PC's potential bias against being aided by legions of the undead, but if they're fine with it, well.

They may have some trouble with NPCs unless in this setting necromancy isn't considered unsavory.

I think the most tactically efficient use for a legion of undead is to Help on hard hitting attacks (like a Sneak Attacking Rogue or a nova-ing Paladin), or any spell that can miss and potentially waste a spell slot, but just use them to attack otherwise.

Any undead with their own hard hitting attacks (like Wraiths, if you can animate those I forget) should be used as shock troops and not helpers, usually.

Obviously exceptions apply. Don't use Wraiths to attack other undead, for instance. Minionmancers need to be flexible in their battle tactics.

[CursedRhubarb]

If the party starts to die down; a Cleric can breathe life back into it, but only a Necromancer can raise the roof.

[JellyPooga]

Used correctly, undead legions can catapult a party straight onto Easy Street; just giving all your skele's bows and unleashing waves of arrows can decimate many a foe before they get a chance to close. Bounded Accuracy goes a looong way.

Used "out the box" (i.e. without equipping your minions with superior gear) and with poor tactics, they can be swiftly outmatched; a single blast from a dragons breath or an enemy spellslingers Fireball can wipe clean all your efforts if you're not careful.

[RulesJD]

Well lets see. At level 14, let's assume he's walking around with ~30 Skeletons.

Their AC will be 13, their HP 27 (average damage of a Fireball funnily enough). They will have +4 to hit.

Their damage, however, will be 1d6+7.

So, basically, every turn the Wizard gets as a free action 30 attacks. Drop a Blindness, Black Tentacles, whatever to generate Advantage through their spells.

Even assuming just half hit, that's 15d6+105. If the target isn't resistant to non-magical weapons, that's 157.5 damage (not counting criticals). As a free action. Have your Cleric/Paladin cast Crusader's Mantle to add on another 37.5 (total ~195 damage).

So yes, Necromancers at higher levels are 100% broken, outside of campaigns where enemies are straight up immune to non-magical weapons. Even then, they can provide guaranteed advantage through the help function. The player becomes a party unto themselves.

Tell the player they need to get a dice rolling App for their phone btw. I played a Necromancer up through level 10 and it's absolutely required to have any semblance of a speedy combat round.

[NecroDancer]

The problem I have with necromancy is that there is usually a lack of humanoid bodies to be found. Most of the monsters my party fights are beasts and monstrosities also most NPCs don't like it when I rob their graveyards.

[MaxWilson]

BTW, if some PCs can multi-attack, you'll want to direct some of your skeletons to Help on the first attack(s), but the others won't be useful unless they Ready a Help action for after the first (second, third) attack.

As a DM I'd be really dubious about giving standing orders to a skeleton to "Help this guy by readying an action after each second attack of the round." Skeletons aren't that smart. "Help this guy kill whatever he kills" is about the upper limit for what I'd accept.

[MrFahrenheit]

BTW, if some PCs can multi-attack, you'll want to direct some of your skeletons to Help on the first attack(s), but the others won't be useful unless they Ready a Help action for after the first (second, third) attack.

As a DM I'd be really dubious about giving standing orders to a skeleton to "Help this guy by readying an action after each second attack of the round." Skeletons aren't that smart. "Help this guy kill whatever he kills" is about the upper limit for what I'd accept.

Yeah I was gonna go with the second option you mention anyhow. Good things to keep in mind.

FWIW, the character is a rock gnome necromancer wizard 12/knowledge cleric 2. Plans to go rest of the way in wizard though.

[Gastronomie]

As a DM, I would rule that skeletons and zombies cannot take the Help action, since it's difficult for the skeleton to do complex tasks. If it was a Ghoul (conjured by Conjure Undead), I would rule that it can Help others, since ghouls are somewhat more intelligent. ...And because, unless I rule so, Conjure Undead is a sorta underpowered spell.

Actually, let me think: I would rule that zombies cannot take most actions.

Attack: Sure.
Cast a Spell: Obviously no.
Dash: This might be me being affected by old zombie movies, but I don't think zombies are good at running.
Disengage: Requires complex actions, so no.
Dodge: Requires swift actions, so no.
Help: Requires complex actions, so no.
Hide: Zombes would probably fail with their stench. For skeletons, it might be a lot easier, especially since they're as skinny as a skeleton. ...Because they're skeletons.
Ready: Sure.
Search: Ehhhh.... sure.

That leaves Attack, Hide, Ready, and Search. Not that necromancers will often order zombies to dash, disengage, or dodge - but I can't picture undead taking these actions.