[3.5]Help hide flying fortress from view

[Elzak]

Long story short, How can I hide a 20ftx20ftx10ft flying fortress from prying eyes, include but not limited to plain-old spot check/divination/trueseeing/accidental trespassing/what-have-you? Anything stored in the fortress needs to be hide away, too. Since it's kind of useless if some random guy can cast locate object on those shiny bits to find the hidden fortress indirectly.

The fortress mentioned above is built through Stronghold Builder Guide. Through some serious WLB-mancy and by simply being an artificer myself, it basically covered most if not all Snizor's Flying Box and Sofawall's The Cube v1 designs. It's almost neigh-penetrable(as is, no Emerald Legion or epic casters try to pay a visit). I've turned the fortress into an item familiar, so it can navigate itself without problem.

The campaign is set for ECL12, putting epic spells out of access. Anything else is free for exploit, which I would preferred in artificer's way but any cheddar will work, as long as it doesn't involved too much flying books and Vorpal DM screen+5.:smallwink:

P.S. English isn't my first tongue, please do forgive all those lousy grammar and spelling. Thanks!

[ExLibrisMortis]

Have you considered simply casting (greater/superior) invisibility on your fortress? Sure, you need to turn it into a creature, but that's acceptable - intelligent items are arguably creatures, for example. After that, apply Persistent Spell, and you're done. Immunity to true seeing and other divinations is harder, as your regular mind blank is a bit out of reach, but there's still nondetection and such. There's also some wondrous architecture that prevents scrying.

[Eisfalken]

Long story short, How can I hide a 20ftx20ftx10ft flying fortress from prying eyes, include but not limited to plain-old spot check/divination/trueseeing/accidental trespassing/what-have-you? Anything stored in the fortress needs to be hide away, too. Since it's kind of useless if some random guy can cast locate object on those shiny bits to find the hidden fortress indirectly.

The fortress mentioned above is built through Stronghold Builder Guide. Through some serious WLB-mancy and by simply being an artificer myself, it basically covered most if not all Snizor's Flying Box and Sofawall's The Cube v1 designs. It's almost neigh-penetrable(as is, no Emerald Legion or epic casters try to pay a visit). I've turned the fortress into an item familiar, so it can navigate itself without problem.

The campaign is set for ECL12, putting epic spells out of access. Anything else is free for exploit, which I would preferred in artificer's way but any cheddar will work, as long as it doesn't involved too much flying books and Vorpal DM screen+5.:smallwink:

P.S. English isn't my first tongue, please do forgive all those lousy grammar and spelling. Thanks!

SBG has lead lined walls on pg. 37 to defeat several forms of divination. That's practically the only way to stop some of them without very expensive wall augments. That stops locate object and a lot of other stuff.

PHB has mirage arcana as a 5th level spell for bards, sorcerers and wizards; it can change the appearance of your entire stronghold and surrounding area in a 20-ft. cube/level; min level you cast it will cover 9 such cubes, more than enough for your little area. Lasts for concentration and an hour per level, so... 9 hours at min level.

There's very few ways to actually defeat true seeing; it's designed on purpose to be the be-all divination spell. Doesn't really matter; all they would know is that there's a building there behind the mirage arcana or whatever. You can't see through walls with it.

Honestly, though, I think it's a waste to sink that much effort into a stronghold. Having a cool place to hang out between adventures is great. Trying to defy the DM by making it "nigh-indestructible" is just a distraction from the main game. Unless that stronghold is the center of the game, little point in spending this much effort on it.

[Elzak]

Have you considered simply casting (greater/superior) invisibility on your fortress? Sure, you need to turn it into a creature, but that's acceptable - intelligent items are arguably creatures, for example. After that, apply Persistent Spell, and you're done. Immunity to true seeing and other divinations is harder, as your regular mind blank is a bit out of reach, but there's still nondetection and such. There's also some wondrous architecture that prevents scrying.

That was...great! Just take the fortress as a creature and it's mostly done! Spell clocks and automatic reset magic traps shall do the trick. Though I still need to do some sweet talking to my DM(plus some tasty snacks but whatever), that's manageable. :smallbiggrin:

I do wonder why mind blank is a bit out of reach. If we can treat the fortress as a creature, then applying mind blank on it do seem feasible. Hmmmm...did I miss something?

[Duke of Urrel]

Would it be possible to move your keep onto the Ethereal Plane? Perhaps you could have it transported there through a portal, stone by stone if necessary, and assembled on the Ethereal Plane itself.

Having a keep on the Ethereal Plane would solve some of your problems, though it would also create some interesting new ones.

[Calthropstu]

I would say you would need a new spell to hide everything. I recall there being an artifact that had all of this listed somewhere. But it was an artifact. So epic/mythic might be absolutely necessary.

[Elzak]

SBG has lead lined walls on pg. 37 to defeat several forms of divination. That's practically the only way to stop some of them without very expensive wall augments. That stops locate object and a lot of other stuff.

PHB has mirage arcana as a 5th level spell for bards, sorcerers and wizards; it can change the appearance of your entire stronghold and surrounding area in a 20-ft. cube/level; min level you cast it will cover 9 such cubes, more than enough for your little area. Lasts for concentration and an hour per level, so... 9 hours at min level.

There's very few ways to actually defeat true seeing; it's designed on purpose to be the be-all divination spell. Doesn't really matter; all they would know is that there's a building there behind the mirage arcana or whatever. You can't see through walls with it.

Honestly, though, I think it's a waste to sink that much effort into a stronghold. Having a cool place to hang out between adventures is great. Trying to defy the DM by making it "nigh-indestructible" is just a distraction from the main game. Unless that stronghold is the center of the game, little point in spending this much effort on it.

Well...the main reason I'm doing all of this shenanigans is to counter other PCs. Our DM is all fine and well, but other "teammates" is whole different story.

Let's just say some of them Can and Will optimize their full casters to high-heaven(which is not bad, sort of, I think), and take "Everyone else must fail, because lulz" as their guidance of dealing with just about everything(which is really bad for business).

My character is a ghost(savage progression) who ruled a small kingdom in his lifetime. The fortress is his mausoleum which he basically store every weapons/armors/wonderous items/shiny he owns in it. His plan A for most encounter is throw ethereal copies at any low-life scums who cross his path, which requires the origin one laying safe and sound in the mausoleum(unoptimized, I know). It will be a disaster for him(and me) if some "ELC12-9th-level-spell-wielding-full-casting-grave-robber" break into it and get rich in no time.

If other PC ever finds out the location/existence of the fortress, it's very likely someone will try to arrange and execute a heist of century. NPC grave robbers who were tied to the storyline? Sure, why not! PC super saiyan grave robbers who tries to rob you blind and ruin your day? Hell No!

[Jack_Simth]

1) Lead lined (Blocks most divinations)
2) Transparent augment on all the walls (so it can't be normally seen)
3) "Secure Chamber" on all the rooms (Mind Blank for everyone)
4) "Veil of Obscurity" on the whole shebang to make it seem not there (or look like a cloud or something). A Stormgathering Orb is a fair replacement.
5) "Inscriptions of Concealment" on every stronghold space to hide items.
6) "Inscriptions of Falsehood" on every stronghold space to hide creatures.
7) Make it flying.
8) Keep it far enough from everything that it'll be out of True Seeing / Blindsense / Blindsight / Mindsight / et cetera range.

[Eisfalken]

Well...the main reason I'm doing all of this shenanigans is to counter other PCs. Our DM is all fine and well, but other "teammates" is whole different story.

Let's just say some of them Can and Will optimize their full casters to high-heaven(which is not bad, sort of, I think), and take "Everyone else must fail, because lulz" as their guidance of dealing with just about everything(which is really bad for business).

My character is a ghost(savage progression) who ruled a small kingdom in his lifetime. The fortress is his mausoleum which he basically store every weapons/armors/wonderous items/shiny he owns in it. His plan A for most encounter is throw ethereal copies at any low-life scums who cross his path, which requires the origin one laying safe and sound in the mausoleum(unoptimized, I know). It will be a disaster for him(and me) if some "ELC12-9th-level-spell-wielding-full-casting-grave-robber" break into it and get rich in no time.

If other PC ever finds out the location/existence of the fortress, it's very likely someone will try to arrange and execute a heist of century. NPC grave robbers who were tied to the storyline? Sure, why not! PC super saiyan grave robbers who tries to rob you blind and ruin your day? Hell No!

Okay, so you have s**t players. Sorry, no game rule is foolproof. You need to find better friends who won't ruin your game experience just for a few cheap laughs.

No gaming is better than bad gaming.

[Calthropstu]

Okay, so you have s**t players. Sorry, no game rule is foolproof. You need to find better friends who won't ruin your game experience just for a few cheap laughs.

No gaming is better than bad gaming.

My response to those players in my games is "thanks for playing! Please leave."

[Honest Tiefling]

Okay, so you have s**t players. Sorry, no game rule is foolproof. You need to find better friends who won't ruin your game experience just for a few cheap laughs.

No gaming is better than bad gaming.

Trying to play one-up with other players is a losing proposition unless you enjoy that sort of thing. And your language and the fact your character is tied to this is making me think this is not the game you want.

[ExLibrisMortis]

I do wonder why mind blank is a bit out of reach. If we can treat the fortress as a creature, then applying mind blank on it do seem feasible. Hmmmm...did I miss something?
It's an eighth-level spell, which you can't craft an item of at level 12. Personal mind blank, while a fifth-level power, is psionic, so I don't think you can use it (it's personal, too, but an intelligent fortress can activate an item of it). Maybe you can create an item, I'm a bit fuzzy on using UMD to emulate psionics.

[Bronk]

I don't think the 'true seeing' spell should be that much of a problem unless they're right next to your fortress already, since the range is only 120'. If it is, you could create traps/spell clocks (already mentioned as possibilities) of the second level spell 'Fog Cloud', or better yet, permanancied 'Solid Fog', on both the inside and the outside, to obscure vision, including true sight. You could even hide the thing as a cloud somewhere, or inside a cloud.

Or, you could (as was already mentioned) make the whole thing invisible, surround it with an invisible spell 'permanent image' to confuse people scrying on it, and fill the inside with eversmoking bottles, fog clouds, and walls of smoke to obscure vision.

You could also give the fortress/item familiar the greater power 'detect scrying', just in case, and put a 'Forbiddance' spell on it as well.

You could do all of that, and quest for a weirdstone...

How close is this item familiar going to be to you? How do your ghost copies get out? If it's teleportation, you could easily send the fortress out into space to create an inhospitable environment for possible grave robbers.

I do agree that it's sad that your fellow players would be the ones trying to grave rob you though. Make sure the DM never tells them what you're doing, or they'll pick away at it until they get to you, no matter what you do.