Lycanthrope Question

[Chester]

3.5 edition:

Can a lycanthrope caster still cast spells while in animal form?

I'd like a wererabbit caster to hide in the bushes.

[Thurbane]

Unfortunately, not out of the box, no:


A lycanthrope’s hybrid form does not gain any special attacks of the base animal. A lycanthrope spellcaster cannot cast spells with verbal, somatic, or material components while in animal form, or spells with verbal components while in hybrid form.

I also think the usual feats that could help with this don't for various reasons.

Natural Spell doesn't, because it pretty specifically for Druids in Wildshape only.

Surrogate Spellcasting (Savage Species) probably would, but I'm not sure a Lycanthrope would meet the feat req of "nonhumanoid or nonhumanlike form".

...also, I hate to be a nitpicker, but you can't technically have a Were-Rabbit in 3.5:


This animal can be any predator, scavenger, or omnivore whose size is within one size category of the base creature’s size (Small, Medium, or Large for a Medium base creature). Lycanthropes can also adopt a hybrid shape that combines features of the base creature and the base animal. A lycanthrope’s hybrid form is the same size as the base animal or the base creature, whichever is larger.

It shouldn't be a big deal for a DM to waive this part, though.

Maybe the DM could also house-rule Natural Spell or Surrogate Spellcasting to work for your purposes.

[LTwerewolf]

Not without the surrogate spellcasting feat. Animal form is indeed nonhumanoid.

[Buddy76]

One level of Black Blood Hunter (Player's Guide to Faerun, page 177) grants you the ability to cast normally while in animal or hybrid form.

[Segev]

I hate top be nitpicker, but you can't technically have a Were-Rabbit in 3.5:


This animal can be any predator, scavenger, or omnivore whose size is within one size category of the base creature’s size (Small, Medium, or Large for a Medium base creature). Lycanthropes can also adopt a hybrid shape that combines features of the base creature and the base animal. A lycanthrope’s hybrid form is the same size as the base animal or the base creature, whichever is larger.

It shouldn't be a big deal for a DM to waive this part, though.



Rabbits are omnivores, actually. They will cannibalize. They just PREFER veggies, and are NOT obligate carnivores (they can survive just fine on an all-veggie diet).

[MisterKaws]

No. You need Surrogate Spellcasting, Nonverbal Spell(Hybrid-only) or the first level of Black Blood Hunter.

[Thurbane]

Would a Lycanthrope meet the reqs for Surrogate Spellcasting?

I guess "nonhumanoid or nonhumanlike form" is very much open to DM interpretation. I suppose so long as the character is in animal form when it levels up and takes the feat, all should be good by RAW. The hybrid form should certainly qualify as "nonhumanlike"...

Just playing devil's avocado - I'd certainly allow it in my game.

[ShurikVch]

Also:

The Moon Guardian (Complete Divine WE) - PrC for Good lycanthropes with divine spellcasting; the very 1st level gives you Natural Spell as bonus feat (yes, I know - Natural Spell works only for Wildshape, but RAI there is rather obvious thus good hope for houseruling it)

Master of Many Forms (Complete Adventurer): 1st level will give you Shifter’s Speech:
A master of many forms maintains her ability to speak normally (including verbal components of spells) regardless of the form she takes.

Dark Scholar (The Shattered Gates of Slaughtergarde) with Book of Stilled Tongue have all her spells (except 2 highest levels) permanently Silent; required Knowledge (history) 14

[Mutazoia]

Hmm..... I might argue that the meta-magic feats "Still Spell" and "Quite Spell" might get around this, since they effectively do away with the necessity for verbal and somantic componants.

[LTwerewolf]

Would a Lycanthrope meet the reqs for Surrogate Spellcasting?

I guess "nonhumanoid or nonhumanlike form" is very much open to DM interpretation. I suppose so long as the character is in animal form when it levels up and takes the feat, all should be good by RAW. The hybrid form should certainly qualify as "nonhumanlike"...

Just playing devil's avocado - I'd certainly allow it in my game.

I'd question any dm that wouldn't allow it, since animal form is pretty specifically not a humanoid form.

[MisterKaws]

Hmm..... I might argue that the meta-magic feats "Still Spell" and "Quite Spell" might get around this, since they effectively do away with the necessity for verbal and somantic componants.

It does, but no one wants to spam metamagic around, so unless you can slap it for free on all your spells(Lycanthrope Demilich Buonman with Nonverbal Spell?) you'd ideally want an easier solution.

[Segev]

It does, but no one wants to spam metamagic around, so unless you can slap it for free on all your spells(Lycanthrope Demilich Buonman with Nonverbal Spell?) you'd ideally want an easier solution.

Lycanthrope necromancer with a bunch of Slaymate pals?