Suitable boss for a party of 2 level 1s

[Hollysword]

Hi everyone. GitP lurker who's finally decided to step into the community.

I'm DMing a party of 2 PCs, a paladin and a cleric, two tanks who can heal. Since the party is only 2 people, I understand the difficulty of the encounters are pretty ramped up. I figure a CR 1/2 creature would be about right for the dungeon's boss, and given the dungeon has mostly animals, I decided a worg would make a suitable boss.

But looking at the worg's stats... this thing hits like a truck. A CR 1/2 creature can dish out 10 damage when it lands a hit? On paper that sounds a bit much, so I'm a bit worried about the party.

Am I just worrying for no reason? Should I change the boss or keep the worg? The party wants to start at level 1.

[LaserFace]

Hi.

Looks like the fight could be a challenge. Adjusted for a small party, seems like a Hard Encounter. Although I don't think it's too unreasonable, some bad dice rolls could mean character death. You should probably ask them how they might feel about losing a character.

If you really want to tweak things, in the DMG there is a bit about customizing monsters. You can adapt some of that info to a monster that already exists, and make a monster that perhaps fits better.

If you feel the Worg deals too much damage in a single go, you could try lowering it's offensive CR, balanced with an increase of defensive CR. It might turn things into a lengthier slog-fest that gives PCs opportunities to cast a healing spell and not get dropped immediately.

Also, it's good to pay attention to how the encounter begins. Having clear sight of an enemy before a fight breaks out will be different from them lurking in the shadows just outside of vision. If the party has a chance to cast a precombat buff or drink a magic potion, that could also give them a solid edge.

[Hollysword]

Yeah, I figured a hard encounter would be a good boss fight (there are no other hard encounters in the dungeon). I made the fight in a way where both sides know full well where each other are... that pause where both sides watch each other before someone springs forward. To make sure the cleric doesn't get eaten too quickly, the corridor is narrow enough that the paladin can cover it while the cleric stays back. I just hope the paladin doesn't die too fast (he has 12 HP), or the cleric might end up as dessert.

I'm thinking, would giving the paladin a +1 shield be a bit too much this early? Given it is a 2-person party, and he is pretty much THE tank, he'll need the shield.

[Safety Sword]

Feels like the perfect time to do some DM "cheating" and ignore any critical hits by the bad guys.

You might want to "roll low" on damage too.


Seriously, Level 1 and even Level 2 are pretty hard to survive if monsters are played properly. With a 2 person party the effect is amplified.

[Hollysword]

How about giving them some early magic items to give them that little boost. Like a +1 shield.

[BurgerBeast]

Most of the MM is comprised of creatures who have very low defences and very high offense. If you don't believe me take a random enemy in the MM and calculate it's CR using the guidelines in the DMG.

The trick to boss monsters is to swing it the other way. They should have a high defensive CR but a low offensive CR. A good boss monster for two level 1s, in my opinion, is about a CR 1/2, as you say. I would aim for it to do about as much damage as two CR 1/4s, so two attacks of 4-5 damage is about right. I'd aim low for about 4 damage per attack and a +3 attack bonus. If you wanted to raise the attack bonus I'd go +5 to hit and about 2-3 damage per hit. This may seem low but at two attacks per round and a big bag of hit points, you can make things scary because the little hits will accumulate. Players will have time to see the damage, respond, and stay alive. Four or five hits of 3 damage is a lot better than one hit of 12 or 15.

So, I would design a boss something like this:

Offense: Hit: +4 Dmg: 6 (two attacks of 3 each) -> OCR 1/2 (+5 to hit would've raised it)
Defense: AC: 14 hp: 60

If you think the hit points are too high, you can drop them to 40 and either (1) make the ATT +5 or +6; (2) make the AC 15 or 16.

If, on the other hand, you wanted the hp higher, you could go as high as 85 and still stay at CR 1/2.

Hope this helps.

[Specter]

...A rhino?

[DragonSorcererX]

An ogre! Believe me, they can totally kill the ogre! If one of them is a DEX character, let him do some "Shadow of the Colossus" on the ogre.

[LaserFace]

How about giving them some early magic items to give them that little boost. Like a +1 shield.

A +1 shield is better over a long time than for a particular fight. It's only a difference of 5% to hit.

Something that gives +5 HP will probably mean a lot more for this encounter.

[Addaran]

A +1 shield is better over a long time than for a particular fight. It's only a difference of 5% to hit.

Something that gives +5 HP will probably mean a lot more for this encounter.

Two scrolls of False Life? =O Pretty "worthless" item that they can waste now and will never come back to bite the DM if they save it. But it should give a buffer for both of them and prevent the risk.

[RumoCrytuf]

Hi everyone. GitP lurker who's finally decided to step into the community.

I'm DMing a party of 2 PCs, a paladin and a cleric, two tanks who can heal. Since the party is only 2 people, I understand the difficulty of the encounters are pretty ramped up. I figure a CR 1/2 creature would be about right for the dungeon's boss, and given the dungeon has mostly animals, I decided a worg would make a suitable boss.

But looking at the worg's stats... this thing hits like a truck. A CR 1/2 creature can dish out 10 damage when it lands a hit? On paper that sounds a bit much, so I'm a bit worried about the party.

Am I just worrying for no reason? Should I change the boss or keep the worg? The party wants to start at level 1.

If you feel a worg is too strong, my advice (from a creative standpoint) is to have the worg been born a runt, so it's weaker than a normal Worg, but still tough for level 1 PCs. Adjust the stats to what you think would be a fair challenge, but make it obviously stronger than other animals.

[Hollysword]

Awesome advice everyone, thanks. Is it also possible to give the advantage to the party by making the room layout better suited for the heroes?

[LaserFace]

Awesome advice everyone, thanks. Is it also possible to give the advantage to the party by making the room layout better suited for the heroes?

Room layout can do a little or a lot. Your players may not always pick up on it or want to use it, but I think it's generally good to think about.

Chambers with multiple levels, with stairs, balconies and platforms can be used by characters to narrow down enemy approach methods or to plink them with arrows or spells from safe distances.

Rubble and cave-ins can create difficult or even impassible terrain, which can hinder monsters and/or characters.

If you're in a crumbling ruin with a giant fissure from an earthquake or something, that provides an opportunity to push a monster in, possibly trapping them if not killing them. You could also have ruined statues or structural supports and junk that could collapse onto a nearby enemy if disturbed.

Personally I enjoy doing this stuff in my games because I feel it can reward observation, and I think it encourages getting creative to solve problems.

[Hollysword]

I checked out other creatures that are also CR 1/2, like the black bear. I notice the worg is superior to the bear in most aspects. Why are they both the same CR? I'm assuming the worg is on the higher end of the CR 1/2 level?

[Ninja_Prawn]

I checked out other creatures that are also CR 1/2, like the black bear. I notice the worg is superior to the bear in most aspects. Why are they both the same CR? I'm assuming the worg is on the higher end of the CR 1/2 level?

I ran the numbers... and I believe worgs are under-CR'd. The black bear comes out at OCR 1 / DCR 0 (Average: 0.5), while the worg is OCR 2 / DCR 1/8 (Average: 1.0625).

The worg should be rated at CR 1.

[Hollysword]

Well that's interesting. I was wondering why a CR 1/2 creature can easily eat level 1s. Well, party can have fun with a bear now. Thanks.

[BW022]

Hi everyone. GitP lurker who's finally decided to step into the community.


Welcome




But looking at the worg's stats... this thing hits like a truck. A CR 1/2 creature can dish out 10 damage when it lands a hit? On paper that sounds a bit much, so I'm a bit worried about the party.

Am I just worrying for no reason? Should I change the boss or keep the worg? The party wants to start at level 1.

A worg is an interesting choice. It is doable, but you are certainly should have reservations.

A worg has 26hp. That means about 3-4 hits to drop. It also average 10hp per hit, so even if it doesn't drop a PC every round... one PC will be healing pretty much every round. With only one PC likely attacking... even with a 75% hit... this could be an issue. PCs will likely run out of healing quickly even if they had their full spell/healing loads. This also doesn't factor in how bad the combat could easily go if the worg did say 15hp in a hit... or ever made a critical.

Now... you can certainly setup the encounter to make it possible for the PCs. For example, the worg is likely to start at distance and the PCs have a couple of rounds of attacks at it closes, the PCs have trees to climb, the work is just finishing a fight with someone/something else, PCs get some NPC to bless them prior to the fight, etc.

Finally, worgs are intelligent and cunning.